2Raw2Ride Social Media

[OverandOnward]

Per public info, in NM the brand inspection comes after the horse is in the state for 30 days.

Colorado has more applicable brand inspection rules, including if a horse is going to travel over 75 miles within the state. Because of the amount of time that 2Raw’s journey will require to go through the state, this could come up.

I’ve gotten a brand inspection in Colorado, although years ago. It is easy to do and the brand inspector was helpful. Even with the 2Raw’s changes of location, I do not think that he will have any problem getting a brand inspection done. Even though he may need a second brand inspection when/if he travels over 75 miles.

I don’t get why people think that the brand inspector is in some way going to stop this ride. Brand inspectors don’t see seize horses the first time a brand inspection is done and a horse doesn’t have one.

They may tell the owner not to take the horse anywhere until the brand inspection is completed. But they don’t police it.

I’ve never been to a show in Colorado that wanted to see all of the horses brand inspections. So it’s not like people are asking.

It’s kind of a non-issue unless someone just refuses to comply over a fairly long period of time while traveling with the horse, which I gather is often just overlooked anyway. In Colorado. Technically that can be trouble, but it’s not all that well enforced.

But it does bring up the point that a long rider should have copies of documents proving ownership of the horse. Things could come up where that might be important.

However, if 2Raw is required to prove ownership, I am sure the brother will send him copies of what he needs.

With luck, he never gets that far. He has a very long way to travel in Texas still, and it doesn’t sound like they are making time and distance.

[Mara]

I hope no one is giving the man money or food.

If he’s broke and starving, that might make him quit. Or maybe he’ll eat some poisonous berries like Chris McCandless did. I don’t expect he’s terribly savvy about what is/isn’t edible foliage.

[OnAMission]

MT brand inspection laws are pretty strict; we can’t leave the county without one. Someone driving through MT can’t unload unless they have a brand inspection. He would not be able to just traipse through MT with no brand inspection is why I wondered; if he was questioned and didn’t have the paper work the horse would be basically impounded and he would have a hefty fine. Laws are different state to state and MT is pretty hardcore.

[Sparrowette]

@OverandOnward

So legally, I dunno, it might be hard to intervene. I can remember a couple of incidents in the news when someone was pulled off a long-distance ride and had their horse seized. Both were extreme situations, the horse was in a near state of collapse and the rider was behaving erratically and LE judged them not to be capable of continuing to care for the horse.

Who wants to bet that this eventually happens here?

[firecracker]

I guess I misunderstood how it all works. I was told by my local brand inspector that I could not cross inspection districts in NM without getting a brand inspection done. When I bought a horse in Colorado, I was told I couldn’t bring her into NM without the brand inspection, so I had that done in Colorado before bringing her home. When I brought my horse in from TX, I brought her home into NM, set up the inspection, and was told I couldn’t move her out of my district until I had her brand inspection done.

Based on that information, I assumed this could potentially be used as a tool to do something. Just trying to think out loud and be helpful. Guess I’m off base. Under normal circumstances of course I assume a horse wouldn’t be held or confiscated, but I was just wondering if this could be used a sort of legal loophole to give an excuse to stop the ride, since it was my understanding that it was not legal to cross state or inspection district lines without a brand inspection done.

[OverandOnward]

@firecracker

… was told I couldn’t move her out of my district until I had her brand inspection done.

I was told things of that kind by the brand inspector with almost a wink.

My experience from Colorado: Brand inspectors say a lot of things like this. They want people to take it seriously and get it done. They also made it a fairly painless process so that people would do it and they could collect the fee.

In actual fact, the state does not want to seize horses and have the responsibility and cost of their care. And work through expensive legal action to settle the problem. All of that is resource-instensive and they aren’t that well funded. Plus there can be political fallout when outraged horse owners call their representatives to rant.

I was also told by long-time Colorado residents who were experienced horse buyers/sellers that “brand inspector” is a cush state job that the inspectors themselves settle into and want to keep. But the entire brand inspection process is useless, it does nothing in the modern age.

So the inspectors have a spiel and a rationale to keep people taking it all seriously and encourage the state to continue funding it. If that makes sense.

[RMJacobs]

I got two horses from a rescue in 2003 in Colorado, and never had a brand inspection. Fast forward to 2017, one had died and I needed to move the other to South Carolina, where I was moving. I contacted the brand inspector for my area, and he told me he would do the inspection if I wrote him a letter stating I’d owned the horse since 2003, and why there hadn’t been a brand inspection at that time. I did that, and also provided a copy of my bill of sale, and got the brand inspection with no problem. I wasn’t even there for it; I was in South Carolina awaiting my horse, and my Colorado BO represented me.

I could have easily faked the bill of sale, but of course did not since I still had it. I might have gotten away with no brand inspection at all, but the last thing I needed was for the Brook Ledge truck to get stopped along the way due to a problem with my horse’s paperwork. I don’t think they would have even allowed him on the truck without brand inspection.

I wasn’t very impressed with brand inspection as being at all useful or reliable.

Rebecca

[Scribbler]

@OverandOnward

@firecracker

… was told I couldn’t move her out of my district until I had her brand inspection done.

I was told things of that kind by the brand inspector with almost a wink.

My experience from Colorado: Brand inspectors say a lot of things like this. They want people to take it seriously and get it done. They also made it a fairly painless process so that people would do it and they could collect the fee.

In actual fact, the state does not want to seize horses and have the responsibility and cost of their care. And work through expensive legal action to settle the problem. All of that is resource-instensive and they aren’t that well funded. Plus there can be political fallout when outraged horse owners call their representatives to rant.

I was also told by long-time Colorado residents who were experienced horse buyers/sellers that “brand inspector” is a cush state job that the inspectors themselves settle into and want to keep. But the entire brand inspection process is useless, it does nothing in the modern age.

So the inspectors have a spiel and a rationale to keep people taking it all seriously and encourage the state to continue funding it. If that makes sense.

Yes, it does sound a bit old fashioned to me now that we microchip high end horses, and don’t brand anything much except some ranch horses and some warm-bloods. I don’t even see QH branded now. Actually in our big barn now we have one Andalusian and one WB with body brands and of course the OTSB with neck freeze brands, and that’s it.

[OverandOnward]

So this is very harsh, but here it is. The only way I can see to stop this is to NOT help him and NOT help the horse.

According to the watchers, he just spent a few days of rest while a generous landowner nourished and cared for his horse. That didn’t heal the horse to recovery, but it did restore the horse enough to last a bit longer. That help made it possible for him to ride off again.

If all of the help stopped, no more horse feed, no more places to stay, etc., I don’t think this would last another full week, and certainly not two weeks.

It is really awful, but given this man’s irrational obsession with this ride, and the weakness of animal protection laws, the horse will have to become physically unable to take more steps before LE can step in and the horse can be saved.

But what will happen is that the kindness of strangers will keep him and the horse going indefinitely. And will keep the horse from getting into such a pitiable condition that it finally meets local criteria for seizure.

Is there anywhere along his most probably routes that county and local laws about animals are more strict, who can be prepared to act when/if he comes through? I hope that is what the watchers are working on.

@Mara

I hope no one is giving the man money or food.

If he’s broke and starving, that might make him quit. Or maybe he’ll eat some poisonous berries like Chris McCandless did. I don’t expect he’s terribly savvy about what is/isn’t edible foliage.

People are doing exactly that, and it is the only reason he’s been able to get this far.

@Sparrowette

@OverandOnward

So legally, I dunno, it might be hard to intervene. I can remember a couple of incidents in the news when someone was pulled off a long-distance ride and had their horse seized. Both were extreme situations, the horse was in a near state of collapse and the rider was behaving erratically and LE judged them not to be capable of continuing to care for the horse.

Who wants to bet that this eventually happens here?

Given the ongoing publicity, I think it is more likely that he will get so much assistance that he’ll be able to continue with a horse that isn’t in bad enough condition to warrant a seizure.

I think it will definitely help a lot to calm down the public outcry. It can be very distracting to authorities. If the local authorities can quietly have their attention directed to the problem, and have the space to focus on what is in front of them without a lot of outside clamor, something more might happen on behalf of the horse.

We are all focused on this one case of horse abuse because of the publicity. So it is a good thing and a bad thing, at the same time.

[LilRanger]

Is he really taking highway 87?

We just had 3 inches of snow here in Santa Fe, and we are well west of the storm. This spring is going to be a doozy and there aren’t many people i in NE NM. Like maybe 4-5 thousand? And half live in Clayton. That’s really rough and there’s been cold fronts rolling down the east side all winter. And there’s no shelter unless you’re in a building.

And that wind just never stops.

[FjordBCRF]

@Mara

I hope no one is giving the man money or food.

If he’s broke and starving, that might make him quit. Or maybe he’ll eat some poisonous berries like Chris McCandless did. I don’t expect he’s terribly savvy about what is/isn’t edible foliage.

It’s been a few years now, but when I was last in Paris, I was shocked at the amount of homeless people with a dog or multiple dogs. I guess people are more inclined to give them money because of the animals. I saw a couple cases where people would just drop them dog food.

Take care of Falcon but not the moron riding him? That might send a message.

[OverandOnward]

@FjordBCRF

Take care of Falcon but not the moron riding him? That might send a message.

It will not. This is the whole point.

If you keep the horse going, he keeps going. This guy does not make rational decisions.

That is what just happened north of San Angelo, where a farm owner took care of Falcon for a very few days. That is what made it possible for 2Raw to ride again. Without that help, it would have been so much closer to ending now.

That is the hard, hard truth. The only way to stop him is to withdraw support for Falcon as well.

[FjordBCRF]

@OverandOnward

If you keep the horse going, he keeps going

Not if HE is starving and exhausted.

[ShenanAnna]

If he sincerely thinks that he’s on a mission and there’s a horse that will carry him, I do not see him stopping, no matter how he’s feeling himself.

[Mara]

Maybe he’ll step in a nest of rattlesnakes during a nighttime pee excursion.

[OverandOnward]

I was looking for images to see the terrain around Big Spring, TX, where he seems to be headed. I looked for Forsan, TX, a rural community on his side of Big Spring – all that came up was high school football.

But anyway, I did find this for the area around Big Spring. This is true legendary Texas Hill Country.

Notice there is a highway barely visible in some of the photos. So he can ride near the road, or off the road … big, big difference in the effort and time to navigate the choices.

in the state park (there is a lake there)

Yep, this is getting more real with every mile.

And this terrain is nothing compared to where he may be going. Honestly this is the easy part.

[ShenanAnna]

Ooh, there are LOTS of Texas desert things to step in during a night time excursion.

[OverandOnward]

@ShenanAnna

If he sincerely thinks that he’s on a mission and there’s a horse that will carry him, I do not see him stopping, no matter how he’s feeling himself.

I agree. I do believe that he is thinking delusionally, and that he is showing a consistent pattern of blatantly irrational decisions. If he is in the mental state that I think he’s in, he can’t assess his own physical condition and will ignore it just as he is ignoring the horse’s. He seems not to be acknowledging anything beyond the current moment. People in such a mindset will often forego nutrition and ignore injuries and illnesses, and seem to be unaware of the needs of their bodies.

I wonder if there is a way to intervene on a psychological basis, that this is a person who may unintentionally do themselves serious harm. Unfortunately he is increasingly in areas where intervention on any grounds is less likely.

[firecracker]

I have driven through that general area many times, going from the Texas Hill Country to Albuquerque. He’s headed into some pretty desolate and unforgiving country. Water is going to be his biggest problem.

[OverandOnward]

If he wants to do this the “old west” way, that was extremely slow. You didn’t go the most direct route. You went from water to water, and hopefully not too many miles between them. And of course to do that you have to know ahead of time where the water is.

And if you don’t know where water can be found, then you take a LOT of supplies with water. There is a lot of searching and backtracking to find the next water. There is no going forward until the water is refilled again.

Back then there were no fences. When fencing was introduced, the old west essentially went away. Water had to be provided to cattle. There was no more wandering here & everywhere.

I’m not sure if it is even possible to do that any more. And I am not sure Knucklehead acknowledges that. He may be relying on help throughout the journey, but that’s a hit-or-miss proposition that also adds time and indirect routes.