Affordability by Trainer

[Guyot]

I’m a pro and I don’t even know

I do believe in having my own horse and I’ve bought less than fancy and or bad X-rays or just taken risks to keep myself in one or two horses. I think now I’ve trained a few to GP I feel less compelled to have my own. (Maybe can start saving for a retirement…)

It was easier in eventing to keep a bit of a pipeline for myself as I bought off the track directly, and always had three or four and sold a few. Dressage I find tricker as selling to this group all want perfect PPE and the buy in is so high.

I tend to buy off breeds (currently have DHH) because spending 25-40k on an unbroke baby (pre the crazy market now) was too much risk for me.

I do run my own farm that my parents backed but I had to pay off that mortgage which was scary as hell especially in the beginning. (My parents are not wealthy, my dad was a high school teacher… so no family money) they are kind and generous obviously and I’ve done my best to be respectful of that.

We all live in debt or very close to the edge to live this “dream”. I really do not know how mid level trainers like me go to florida… and would not risk that probable debt without all client support as I would not risk my parents that way.

All this said, I’ve financed horses and I’ve traded horses, and I’ve taken risks on health or soundness to keep myself in horses. I don’t have the fanciest but I do think I could train a donkey to do flying changes and piaffe so there is that.

I have probably spent more money on lessons and clinics, then horses, and continue to do so… I even will pay for lessons on client horses if I have nothing to ride. Continuing education is extremely important and I will lesson on anything to keep learning.

Also anything horse related can and does get written off and depreciated for tax purposes. So if I have my horse worked on or extra new equipment I want, it does lower my tax bill. I don’t need to show a lot there to “live” and sadly I’ve found that as long as I “look the part” and my stuff is new people think it’s worth more to ride with me… even tho I could teach in ratty jeans and falling apart boots it doesn’t fly… gotta play the game.

[Bristol_Bay]

@clanter

my daughter is an amateur who is highly skilled in the sport, she assists a top trainer in our breed by covering for him while he is doing seminars/clinics.

OT but really? She covers for him and gets a free horse? Doesn’t that count as a form of payment that would make her a pro?

[clanter]

@Bristol_Bay

Doesn’t that count as a form of payment that would make her a pro?

it was a gift, her horse broke a leg.

[vxf111]

It could be construed as remuneration (even though it sounds like that wasn’t the intent).

[LCDR]

There are tax issues with gifting over specific amounts, which last year was raised to $16,000 per recipient. Did the gifter of the horse file the appropriate federal form and pay the taxes due on the gift of the expensive horse?

My guess is likely not. Posting on the internet about a valuable gift horse could potentially open a can of legal worms. Best not to boast about it too much, though it is typically the gifter who has the tax liability.

[Scribbler]

@LCDR

There are tax issues with gifting over specific amounts, which last year was raised to $16,000 per recipient. Did the gifter of the horse file the appropriate federal form and pay the taxes due on the gift of the expensive horse?

My guess is likely not. Posting on the internet about a valuable gift horse could potentially open a can of legal worms. Best not to boast about it too much, though it is typically the gifter who has the tax liability.

If the horse had no value to the trainers program he’s not worth much in that world.

I believe these horses are on a breed circuit so the h/j ammie rules may not apply.

But this is a very good reason why trainers may be keeping the ownership and acquisition process of horses on the downlow. Unless you see the bill of sale you don’t know who really owns any horse.

And if you sell a horse well below market value is that considered a gift? If I sell my nice colt for $1?

There are lots of reasons for riders trainers owners to be discrete. Not least that if they hand one trainer a bargain horse to campaign they may be besieged by wannabe trainers who think they are a soft touch, or ammies who want to bargain down because the horses have lost value in their eyes.

Horse world runs on discretion and smoke and mirrors. Trainers want to look prosperous to instil confidence.

[akhunterrider]

My trainer grew up with a horse trainer Mom and still trains out of her family’s facility. They bought a WB mare several years ago that was meant to be an investment horse, but ended up being a more difficult ride than they originally anticipated. Now she is usually leased out half of the year and my trainer shows her in the 1.15 - 1.20 jumpers. She’s a really cool mare who I personally love riding, but she is not the easiest horse to ride. If she were to be sold, it would be for high 5 figures, but she keeps her for income and the face that she enjoys showing the horse herself.

[rothmpp]

@Bristol_Bay

OT but really? She covers for him and gets a free horse? Doesn’t that count as a form of payment that would make her a pro?

Depends on what is meant by covering. Feeding, turning out, etc… would likely survive the sniff test by USEF so long as she was not lunging/riding/teaching lessons in his absence. I’m not so sure the gift horse would.

[Tini_Sea_Soldier1]

Yes, but the problem is that many of them are always “chasing the dream/dragon”. It’s about the next top derby horse… next potential FEI horse, etc. So they’ll take on a risk, buy something with an investor group, etc. Some don’t have to worry about it because they have an amazing network of supporters and investors or family money to fall back on… others seem to just hemorrhage money to make their perfect world keep spinning.

[Farosh]

There’s a lot of different reasons for this obviously but a lot of it is luck and taking chances. For example we buy a lot of horses online without ever seeing them and get them waaay lower than the advertised asking price many times. People will sell cheaper if you’re willing to pay quickly and you have a well known barn. I would never ever do this however for a client because I’m just not willing to gamble their money without ever seeing the horse. Which is kind of ironic I think because I’ve had much better luck with horses I’ve bought without seeing than I have horses I’ve tried lol.

But when you’re buying it for yourself and you have a large lesson program of people who w/t up to people who jump the 1.20m, even if the horse isn’t as advertised you can find someone in your barn who is a good match. In the past 2 years I think I’ve bought like 15 horses online and really only got one who was not usable, they advertised him as 8 years old but the dentist said he was 30 And okay I can take that hit and obviously care for the horse since all the others were so great but I cannot do that to a client. Even if they knew the risks and were not upset with me I would just die of anxiety and stress.

Some horses were exactly as advertised, some actually much better than advertised, and a few just different than advertised.

I got a really beautiful warmblood for very cheap that they said was a packer and jumped beautiful in his videos but wouldn’t go over a single pole when he came lol which okay yeah suspicious price tag so you deal with the consequences but honestly after a few months of jumping all the poles everyday he’s a pretty solid guy now I actually trust him a lot in jumping lessons and he’s a barn favorite. Plus he has always flatted beautifully and is incredibly sweet to groom and tack up. There’s a lot of people who don’t really want to jump so when he was not jumping well he taught people how to leg yield and spiral and put a horse on the bit and everyone left extremely happy. Now he jumps great and I could sell him for a lot more than I paid but I don’t even want to.

Anyway that’s just my experience as a professional who is not getting paid to ride the most fabulous horses in the world but has a lot of really super nice horses I paid very little for.

[MapleBreeze]

You can buy a lot of nice horses on payments.