Aussie Vs Border Collie

I have had a BC almost continually since an undergrad in college. From apt to small acreage to very rural farm. Have always worked away from home. None of the BC’s have ever been destructive in the house until recently and that is older dog with extreme thunder issues that developed later in life.

No specific job but to be pet and companions. Basic obedience and spend lots of time with us doing stuff…two were/are awesome Frisbee/fetch dogs…just started doing paddle boarding with one. Did couple mile “pack” paddle with him tonight. Has also passed all the therapy dog training/tests.

Over 33 years of marriage we have had a number of different breeds from Great Dane to Borzoi to cattle dog an BC. The BC’s definitely the most consistent. They have energy but in my experience it is easy to focus the energy and are soft, not stubborn, which fits better with my abilities training, such as they are.

are the shelties kind of yappy though?

thanks for the responses…I was not familiar with the English Shepherd breed. they look like a nice dog. I have never seen one in the states before…but that is not saying much as I don’t travel much either.

[QUOTE=knightrider922;8724536]
are the shelties kind of yappy though?

thanks for the responses…I was not familiar with the English Shepherd breed. they look like a nice dog. I have never seen one in the states before…but that is not saying much as I don’t travel much either.[/QUOTE]

I think ALL the herding breeds fall into the “can be kind of yappy” category. :wink:

Honestly there are huge variations in different lines of BCs and Aussies – certainly lines exist within each breed that are reactive, have no “off switch,” are obsessive, have very labor intensive coats, etc. On the flip side there are certainly lines within each breed that are easier to live with while still being competitive in the agility ring.

(side note: coming from poodles, I don’t think you could find an Aussie or BC whose coat you would actually consider “labor intensive”… I have a bench-bred Sheltie with a heavy coat, and grooming is an absolute breeze compared to grooming a poodle.)

My best recommendation is to talk to different breeders, go to agility trials and ask about the breeding of dogs if you like their look/attitude, read competition results from venues you’re interested in (there are differences in the types of courses in AKC/USDAA/UKI/etc, and they can play to different dog strengths/weaknesses)… and make a decision based off those things.

The good news/bad news is that a sport-bred, well-built dog of either breed can potentially be very competitive at high levels… unless you’re talking about WAO level competition, time spent training will be an infinitely better predictor than breeding of the dog’s success.

Something else to consider is that if you’re interested in AKC agility, you can qualify for big events like the Invitational much more easily if you have a rare breed (the top 5 dogs of each breed are invited). I have a great little Briard and have no doubt that once he’s ready to compete, qualifying for the Invitational will be a walk in the park for him. If he was a border collie with a comparable amount of talent, I’d have no delusions of being able to get there easily. :winkgrin:

I’ve never had an Aussie but I’ve had BC for years. Absolutely hands-down the easiest breed I’ve ever owned.

Quirky? Well, yes. :uhoh: But I’m a southerner. As the saying goes, we don’t hide our crazy relatives in the attic - we put them on the front porch in a rocking chair with a glass of sweet tea. So I think their quirkiness is one of their charms. :slight_smile:

BCs come in smooth coated varieties, and I’ve known 60 lb BC and 20 lb BC. So much variety in working lines, because they’re bred for what they can do not how they look.

The only caveat is, if you have horses, you can’t ever leave the BC out with the horses unattended. Drivey little beasties, and the horses do NOT appreciate it and will not hesitate to retaliate. My very first BC got her leg broken at her home before mine trying to work the horses. Of course, Aussies are probably the same way. I know shelties are. Sadly I knew one who was killed because her owner thought it was cute to send her to bring in the horses. Yes, they do work cattle and I don’t know what the difference is but horses just don’t react the same way.

Totally agree with LPH about it being waaaaaaaaaaaay easier to get to AKC nationals with a rare breed (I know someone whose dog competed once, got hurt, missed the rest of the year, and was the #1 agility dog in the breed that year and got invited to nationals). But I believe it has to be an AKC recognized breed for that to work. I believe Mini american shepards are AKC recognized, the regular ones are not.

Aussie owner but have had BCs around here often- agree with others-

Both are highly trainable but maybe Aussies tend to be less OCD (they are all individuals however)

Both breeds tend to excel at agility

As for coats- my Tris have not been high maintenance at all.
Much like a BC. Merles more like having sheep in the house.

|Shelties are lovely but I think more high maintenance for grooming and more vocal.

As a Springer owner, I have to say… Get a Springer. :cool:

But seriously, I think either breed would do well in your home - or a sheltie if you want an agility whiz with less intensity. Personally I would pick the Aussie over the BC, but in your case I think its a matter of getting out to the breeders’ and meeting their dogs. Have a discussion about what you want to do and see what the breeders have to say.

You want to know what I think a pretty competitive AND pretty easy-to-live with breed is (since now we’re really straying a bit on the original question). Cavs. I take class with someone who breeds specially for agility and OMG are hers drivey-- and then the second they leave the ring they melt into a little puddle of looks-like-a-stuffed-animal. I never thought I’d say this about ANY non herding breed-- but I could totally do one of HER cavs. Will they beat the shelties? No. But will they Q and awful lot and be NICE dogs to live with-- absolutely.

"The only caveat is, if you have horses, you can’t ever leave the BC out with the hrorses unattended. Drivey little beasties, and the horses do NOT appreciate it and will not hesitate to retaliate. My very first BC got her leg broken at her home before mine trying to work the horses. Of course, Aussies are probably the same way. I know shelties are. Sadly I knew one who was killed because her owner thought it was cute to send her to bring in the horses. Yes, they do work cattle and I don’t know what the difference is but horses just don’t react the same way.[/QUOTE]

Although I generally don’t leave my dogs out of a fenced area unattended, issues with my BC’s and horses have not been my experience. The one I had in college (a stray that I did not know was a BC at the time until someone knowledgeable with the breed suggested it/maybe a cross but mostly BC), was totally safe with horses (again I did not know anything about herding dogs at the time, was young and reckless, and took no precautions). When I would go out to get my gelding in a big pasture full of horses, I would hand her the lead and she would walk him back to the barn. She would follow along beside us in the ring or on the trails…perhaps her version of herding…but never indulged unless I was in the saddle and she was tagging along.

My next BC came from working lines from breeder that competed in sheep trials (long before agility etc). That dog did want to herd the horses so as young pup we taught her she was not allowed to go under wood fence. She spent her life patrolling the fence line, calm and convinced it was her skill and vigilance that kept the horses confined. Never, ever went in the paddocks and never moved fast or in threatening way…just used her eye and body language…horses totally ignored her but she didn’t know that.

Two current BC’s (from same lines as above) show no interest in horses at all. Now breeder breeds more for sport but stll trials. If anything these two are afraid of the horses and won’t willingly go in pastures with them. They are only interested in tennis balls.

Cattle dog is different story and though trained to stay out of paddocks and to respond to “out” if he looks tempted, I always stay alert and ready to call him off if his nature gets the best of him.

I’d say aussies. I am on my third. Had two standard size and currently have a mini. She is very confident. She loves her trips to the barn because she gets to go trail riding with me. She can be a little bit of a pain when I ride in the ring, so if I plan to do ring work, I will leave her in the car or stall. She is great with the elements of agility. Has never shown any fear with anything including the banging of the teeter totter. I love about her though is that while she is hardy with lots of stamina, she can also be a couch potato if that is what I am doing.

yes. I prefer my aussies (4 so far) to the BCs I have met - for life on the farm with horses-

but if main focus is agility-not general farm life - would also consider BC.

[QUOTE=Crockpot;8725758]
yes. I prefer my aussies (4 so far) to the BCs I have met - for life on the farm with horses-

but if main focus is agility-not general farm life - would also consider BC.[/QUOTE]

World’s best farm dog, IMO, is a border pyr (BCxGreat Pyrenees). Great with horses, cats, even the chickens. Loves all people. Completely suspicious of all other canines who might harm his/her charges.

However I bet they would make the world’s worst agility dogs. :lol:

I have a sheltie and a BC. I wouldn’t guarantee that they both are absolutely the breed standard, but in my experience the sheltie is easier to train, hands down. Mostly because he is 100% food motivated, and partially because he tolerates my mistakes. He’s portable, and a couch potato until I ask him to come along and do something. The breed has a rep for being barky but Scott isn’t too chatty… unless there are joggers nearby. Then all bets are off.

The border collie is faster, and probably more talented, but keeping focus is difficult. Not a couch potato but is not impossible to live with, either. So much less maintenance on the grooming side vs. my sheltie, because he’s got a much slicker topcoat and thinner undercoat. He’s still an adolescent dog so I have faith that the focus will improve but he’s much sharper than my sheltie so timing is extra important.

Neither are as independent-minded as my friends’ Aussies.

I don’t have much experience with Aussies but have had several BCs and will never go back to another breed. I’ve never had one destroy anything in the house. I don’t consider myself an especially high energy person–I mean, I run and I ride, but I’m not out climbing 14ers every weekend. I’ve never had one that had too much energy for me. Two out of the three that I’ve had are prone to take themselves on walks given the opportunity, and think the longer they play keep-away, the funner it is.

Two border collies here. Full siblings, same litter. Female is super high drive, should be in a working home. Male is super soft, super sweet, and will lay at my feet all day (while the female lays on the back of the couch like a cat, watching the world go by and barking at every dog, human, squirrel, and bird that dares show up in her line of sight).

I’m in school right now on top of my full time job, and sometimes we go on daily long walks and sometimes I just can’t. They get a bit rowdier in the house, but not destructive.

The only thing my female has ever destroyed is a toenail clipper. And leather - she will eat leather. And stuffies. Nothing she loves more than getting a new stuffie, creating a small hole, and then systematically destuffing it. Surgeon-Lex.

Male has destroyed nothing (although occasionally he aids in the stuffie surgery). He gets crated because otherwise he climbs on the table to stare out the window and wait for me, and scratches the table and/or knocks stuff off of it and breaks it. It’s not intentional, but he likes his crate and barrels into it so he’s happy.

Female is the self-proclaimed master of the house and about six months ago she informed me that she no longer goes in a crate and she is on crate-strike. She says her den is the bathtub and she can live there thank you. So she gets babygated in the entrance. I could totally leave her free but the neighbours probably wouldn’t enjoy her guarding the world from her window seat on the back of the couch.

Male doesn’t bother horses at all. Barely notices them. Doesn’t bother the sheep when we farm sit either.

Female will mostly not bother the stock because she’s been told not to repeatedly, but occasionally requires an e-collar reminder because while she’s VERY sensitive, she’s also VERY strong willed and VERY sure she knows way more than the humans involved and therefore she should totally go work those horses or those rams. She does prove herself to be VERY useful in helping peel sheep off of gates, etc, and has learned that we will let her “work” the ewes while we grain as long as “working” means lying in front of them with two other dogs and holding them back from the grain tubs until I’m done pouring grain. Her “that’ll do” is well installed.

Funny story: I had the dogs at a friend’s home/vet clinic and was doing some bookwork. Female was bugging friend’s boyfriend’s horse. Said horse doesn’t like dogs. I zapped her once and told her off. It lasted a while but when Friend went outside dog decided she had an audience, yay! She crept towards the fence. Friend tried to call her off using her Heeler’s command. “Away”. Dog went “Oh yay! I’m on it!” and started a rather lovely counter-clockwise outrun to “Bring. Us. That. HORSE.” Friend hollers because dog is now in full outrun to get the horse. I went to door and hollered “That’ll do!” Dog hits brakes and skulks back grumbling about stupid humans ruining all her fun after getting her hopes up.

Honestly they’re great dogs and for the last while I do NOT get them out enough. Granted, they’re going to be six in september so not pups anymore and we were pretty active when they were.

I truly feel that the people who find them destructive aren’t aware of or prepared for their energy levels. I knew that in town, people have had issues with BCs…so from the time the female was a pup she was never put in a situation where she could learn destructive habits. If she wasn’t supervised she was crated and when she was supervised, undesirable behaviours (chewing the table leg, etc) was discouraged and a desirable behaviour/ acceptable chew toy was offered as a substitute (Um…this might be why we de-stuff stuffies)

Just my twenty cents. I love my BCs and wouldn’t have anything else :yes:

[QUOTE=knightrider922;8724536]
are the shelties kind of yappy though?[/QUOTE]

OP and I are in the same area. I’m guessing she’s asking about yappiness because of all of the debarked Shelties we hear at our trials. The breed is notorious for barking. I’ve heard a wide variety of results from debarked shelties like odd muffled coughs to a slightly less than volume-cranked-up barks.

[QUOTE=knightrider922;8724536]
are the shelties kind of yappy though?

thanks for the responses…I was not familiar with the English Shepherd breed. they look like a nice dog. I have never seen one in the states before…but that is not saying much as I don’t travel much either.[/QUOTE]

All the herding breeds have an inclination to be vocal, but like any dog that can be trained.

I have Aussies, so my opinion is a bit biased, but I’m going to do my best to give you a balanced opinion.

If you stick to working lines you won’t have issues with coat. https://www.facebook.com/shari.joanisse/media_set?set=a.10156092199370724.1073741855.656750723&type=3 That’s my working-bred bitch at 29 months, holding about as much coat as she gets except for a few weeks in the dead of winter.

A well bred border will have a good off-switch. So will a well bred Aussie. Good breeders are breeding for stability of temperament, as that is absolutely vital to working ability (loose screws don’t do well at work).

Not that colour is your most important choice, but they both come in a lovely variety of colours.

Do you like tails?

[QUOTE=Bicoastal;8726089]
OP and I are in the same area. I’m guessing she’s asking about yappiness because of all of the debarked Shelties we hear at our trials. The breed is notorious for barking. I’ve heard a wide variety of results from debarked shelties like odd muffled coughs to a slightly less than volume-cranked-up barks.[/QUOTE]

Can’t say I’ve seen any of that in my area?!

[QUOTE=pAin’t_Misbehavin’;8724609]
The only caveat is, if you have horses, you can’t ever leave the BC out with the horses unattended. Drivey little beasties, and the horses do NOT appreciate it and will not hesitate to retaliate. My very first BC got her leg broken at her home before mine trying to work the horses. Of course, Aussies are probably the same way. I know shelties are. Sadly I knew one who was killed because her owner thought it was cute to send her to bring in the horses. Yes, they do work cattle and I don’t know what the difference is but horses just don’t react the same way.[/QUOTE]

Horses kick much different than a cow - harder to evade a horse kick.