Best and Worst clinics you've been to

[Graymaresrule]

[QUOTE=Isabeau Z Solace;6938804]
But the problem with this is that you were not the instructor in either scenario. It may be that LP had a reason for the tactic that was not apparent from the stands. Maybe the rider was crooked enough or weak enough or the horse ‘sketchy’ enough that sitting on a small circle was the wiser option?

Unfortunately just because Rider A and Horse A can accomplish something with a particular technique does not mean Horse/Rider B will be able to pull off the same thing. This sort of thing is made MUCH more evident when you analyze jumping instruction. Sure Ingrid Klimke can jump on the horse and do X with it, but can the current rider do the same? Or will it be many years before that rider will get to the point that it can cope with that technique?[/QUOTE]

Here’s the clip if you are interested
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=398073796953336&set=vb.345907222169994&type=2&theater

She does not seem to be a rider who would have a problem posting around the arena

[Native_Funk]

I’ve only ridden in one clinic. It was with Greg Best, who taught me an incredible amount in a very short time. Our group was mostly younger greener horses. At this point I had barely jumped my horse over 2’6". I went in telling Greg that I rode in the Eq and occasionally the jumpers. He tailored his teaching to fit me and my horse. Amazing experience. If I ever get the opportunity again I will jump all over it!

The video of our last course at the clinic
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kHrHWPzvMJs

[OverandOnward]

[QUOTE=TBPONY;6938391]
I’ve never attended a horse riding clinic before. What’s with all the hate for Phillip Dutton? Was he mean, rude, ineffective, ??[/QUOTE]
Audited about half of a Novice session at one of his clinics. I saw what I have heard many others say - all he says is “jump this” and “jump that.” No feedback on what is going on. I didn’t see him really talk to a rider at all.

But he has had students riding at the very highest levels. Very few people have coached as many 4* riders as he has. And at least 2 selected for the Olympics, although Heidi White very unfortunately had to withdraw at the last minute when her horse was injured.

It might be different for lower/upper level sessions, don’t know. Every coach/instructor is not a fit for every rider, and vice versa.

[kalidascope]

[QUOTE=Isabeau Z Solace;6938749]
I’d love to try her out, but her prices are as tro nom i cal… [/QUOTE]
:lol: I nearly googled that foreign sounding phrase!

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=lcw579;6938751]
Was the comment “Carry your hands” by any chance? Or was it “Breathe”?[/QUOTE]

Haha. Apparently I have mastered the art of oxygenating the brain. My hands, on the other hand…

which is amazing because I am the first person to admit I suck mightily but my hands are usually my strong point?!

[Alternative1]

[QUOTE=PNWjumper;6937683]
This will come as no surprise to anyone who knows how much I post about his clinics, but best for me would be Greg Best. I like his clinics so much that I ride with him as many times a year as I can. I learn something on every single horse I ride with him every single time. No exceptions.

I’ve had a lot of “worsts” over the years. I had one very BNT who was getting married the next weekend who was so distracted I’m not sure he would even have remembered that he taught that weekend if he were still alive. I had another very BNT who told me that my mare wasn’t capable of being a 1.30m horse (this was my winning-est horse ever with a LOT of 1.30m championships and a few forays into 1.40m). After the last jump of the weekend (a 5’ vertical) he looked at me and said, “well, I’ve changed my mind. Maybe she’s got more in there than I thought. I would have done different things if I’d realized that.” :ambivalence:

There are a few other horror stories (like the trainer who drilled us for so long over jumps in a clinic that 4 of 5 horses in the session were lame the next day). But most clinics I’ve found to be mediocre. The trainers might be great trainers, they might be great riders, but they just weren’t able to concentrate it down to 3 days worth of teaching that would make an impact.

Oh, oh, I remember another wasted $500! I had my (very dead-type) mare in a clinic at a barn with pretty much only hot horses. So there were 3 super hot/anxious horses and then my went-around-like-a-drugged-horse mare. Every exercise was set up to slow a horse down. Yeah, not an issue for us. Every time I went through, the (olympic medalist trainer) would tell me how brilliant I was and how amazing of a rider I was to get my horse through the exercise so well. At the end of the weekend he said, “you know, you could be good enough to compete against those amateurs down in California who do nothing but ride all day every day…” Um, gee, thanks? :lol:

So these days I pretty much stick to riding with Greg because I know I’ll get something for the money every time.[/QUOTE]

Yes, agreed!! Greg Best is also my favorite clinician. I just love his laid back demeanor and that he also likes to joke around. I have learned something new in every clinic I have ridden with him. He just has a wonderful way of explaining things so that they click in your brain. He is also interested in actually bettering every horse/rider in his clinic whether you are jumping 2’ or 5’ . You can see the difference in horse/riders from the start of the clinic to the finish. His clinics are well worth the money!

[TBRedHead]

I haven’t been to any bad ones, I’ve cliniced a lot with Mark Rashid and I love him and all his assistants! I loved clinicing with Shannon Brown too, western people that are able to help an English girl, love it!

However, I can’t stand the people that go to their clinics. Their clinics ate mostly western riders, and I get snobbed so hard that it’s really preventing me from going back. Like wont talk to me, won’t acknowledge me, and only a few will watch my ride (which I don’t care about, but to blatantly leave during mine and come back later??) The only people who talk to me are the few English riders.

My first clinic I was brand new to clinics, the one I was in asked me right away for payment so I sent it. I was to be in another one a few months later, and the lady hadn’t asked for payment yet. At the clinic, one of her friends started really nasty, mean things about me, AND I DIDNT EVEN KNOW HER NAME! I guess the other clinic lady as upset because I “refused to pay for the clinic”. Since this went on in front of everyone while I was somewhere else, in front of my HUSBAND, he set her straight. I ended up back at the trailer crying because I couldn’t even believe people could be THAT poopy. I still can’t even look at that lady, and unfortunately she’s the one that got my old trainers mare that was my project mustang all through high school.

I don’t know, I’m a nice person, and I can strike up a convo on your hair bow. But I can’t bring myself to go back to his clinics, like him, not the crowd he brings. (and that’s not saying anything on him, if there’s something I’ve learned, someone who knows how to deal with their life issues attracts people who can’t deal with their own.)

I also much enjoyed Gina Miles, huge confidence booster.

[meupatdoes]

@TBRedHead;6940040

However, I can’t stand the people that go to their clinics. Their clinics ate mostly western riders, and I get snobbed so hard that it’s really preventing me from going back. Like wont talk to me, won’t acknowledge me, and only a few will watch my ride (which I don’t care about, but to blatantly leave during mine and come back later??) The only people who talk to me are the few English riders.

My first clinic I was brand new to clinics, the one I was in asked me right away for payment so I sent it. I was to be in another one a few months later, and the lady hadn’t asked for payment yet. At the clinic, one of her friends started really nasty, mean things about me, AND I DIDNT EVEN KNOW HER NAME! I guess the other clinic lady as upset because I “refused to pay for the clinic”. Since this went on in front of everyone while I was somewhere else, in front of my HUSBAND, he set her straight. I ended up back at the trailer crying because I couldn’t even believe people could be THAT poopy. I still can’t even look at that lady, and unfortunately she’s the one that got my old trainers mare that was my project mustang all through high school.

I went to a clinic once that was mainly home boarders and I was one of the few trailer ins. For my first ride of the day, I got the “pre-lunch” slot. After my ride, I spent roughly 6.5 minutes untacking the horse, hosing it off and giving it a quick squeegee, and putting it back in its stall for hay and water.

When I emerged the entire operation had left to go off the property for lunch.

The horse’s owner and I stood around looking completely dumbfounded for a few moments, then I pulled my jaw back up to my face, unhitched my trailer, and drove us in my truck to the nearest Subway where we ate just the two of us.

Had to come back and ride my post-lunch horse too, and this was a two day $750 affair so we got to come back the next day and feel really included the whole time. :rolleyes:

Later this same facility held a fundraiser for the clinician. I love the clinician so I sent a check for $50 along with a handwritten card. I guess they received it, because it was cashed. Not a word of thanks, via email, post, or phone though. They sure have my email when they want to send round clinic sign ups, though!

I mean, you meet all kinds in your travels through life but that was just …astonishing.

[Lucassb]

Favorite clinician ever: the late, great Ronnie Mutch. Smart, funny, and he had a knack for giving you the perfect exercise to address whatever weakness(es) you might have had.

More recently: Linda Allen, Kobi Rhodes, Jeff Cook, Walter Zettl. All fabulous in different ways - but I still “hear” each of them in my head during my daily work now.

Worst: Anne Kursinski. She is clearly knowledgeable but in that particular clinic she was unbelievably nasty to a couple of the riders. One in particular, a very good junior mounted on a very talented but very difficult jumper, was berated to the point of tears - whereupon Anne dismissed her from the ring. I felt so badly for her, that I left the ring with her to show her some support. Anne didn’t like that and snapped at me as well, (“Where do you think YOU’RE going?”) Mmmm, back to the barn, thanks very much; I pay trainers to teach, not be (insert nasty name here.)

[Mara]

[QUOTE=Lucassb;6940146]
Favorite clinician ever: the late, great Ronnie Mutch. Smart, funny, and he had a knack for giving you the perfect exercise to address whatever weakness(es) you might have had.

More recently: Linda Allen, Kobi Rhodes, Jeff Cook, Walter Zettl. All fabulous in different ways - but I still “hear” each of them in my head during my daily work now.

Worst: Anne Kursinski. She is clearly knowledgeable but in that particular clinic she was unbelievably nasty to a couple of the riders. One in particular, a very good junior mounted on a very talented but very difficult jumper, was berated to the point of tears - whereupon Anne dismissed her from the ring. I felt so badly for her, that I left the ring with her to show her some support. Anne didn’t like that and snapped at me as well, (“Where do you think YOU’RE going?”) Mmmm, back to the barn, thanks very much; I pay trainers to teach, not be (insert nasty name here.)[/QUOTE]

Seems a lot of people have had that experience with Anne K. A couple of more recent accounts in the H/J forum claim she’s mellowed a lot.

[vxf111]

[QUOTE=Mara;6940214]
Seems a lot of people have had that experience with Anne K. A couple of more recent accounts in the H/J forum claim she’s mellowed a lot.[/QUOTE]

I feel like 50% of the people I talk to love her clinics and 50% relay the same “bad attitude” story. FWIW I know someone who recently cliniced with her and experienced the bad attitude. There’s no doubt she’s forgotten more than most of us will ever learn. But being an amazing rider or even trainer doesn’t necessarily make you a good clinician or vice versa. And, different strokes for different folks. I don’t care what I do, if I am not endangering safety I do not want to be screamed at by someone I am paying big bucks to teach me. YMMV.

[amastrike]

I haven’t been to enough clinics to have a worst, but I’ve ridden with one clinician 3 times and I absolutely love him.

Jeffrey Lord isn’t super well known, which is probably good for me because his clinics aren’t outrageously expensive. Every time I’ve ridden with him, it’s been a huge help. Months later, I’ll be riding and struggling with something, then I’ll remember “oh yeah, Jeff said to do X.” I’ll do X, and like magic, problem solved. Ten minutes into riding with him, he got through to me and my OTTB gelding/giraffe was giving to the bit and relaxing. Can’t say enough good things about Jeff!

[anon68314200]

[QUOTE=carolprudm;6938787]
I saw a very nice video of Christoph Hesse explaining RHYTHM and its relationship to relaxation to LP. Good demo rider showing the results of a good posting trot and lateral bending. That was before the Dressage Summit where you see Linda “coaching” a rider to sit the trot and make small circles to get the horse to relax. The horse did slow down a tiny bit, but only because it was either that or fall over. I had to think “But CH TOLD you how to fix this. Didn’t you learn anything?”

I honestly think that LP likes to hobnob with BNT’s but doesn’t listen.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=carolprudm;6938837]Here’s the clip if you are interested
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=398073796953336&set=vb.345907222169994&type=2&theater

She does not seem to be a rider who would have a problem posting around the arena[/QUOTE]

Well lets see… I really don’t think the LP clip is heinously awful. BUT, we start this discussion off on the wrong foot, really, because I don’t have video of the Hesse lesson to compare it to.

Anyhow, I have to say the LP rider is in a typical ‘horse pulling the rug out from under the rider’ scenario. Seemingly because the rider is quite behind the motion and driving the horse too much. Who knows, maybe the horse has been naughty in the past and she developed the habit as a means of defense? But that is just guessing.

Her stirrups are so flippin’ long I am in doubt that she could post well enough to be ‘with’ the horse at the trot.

LP does get it right when she has the rider release the reins, so as to break up the ‘water ski/rug’ being pulled dynamic. Next I would shorten the stirrups (3 holes) and have the rider get all the way to the top of the rise in the posting trot.

But honestly, LP does nothing awful. And without more video of the entire ride, more background on the horse, AND Hesse video to compare, it’s all a lot guessing.

Carol did you attend the symposium? See the entire lesson? From 1:05 video, I think it is unproductive to make pronouncements.

[event101]

Just have to say that my 2 favorite clinics were with Lucinda Green and Boyd Martin. Both pushed just enough that you left feeling super confident. With a baby/very green horse I might not have enjoyed them as much, but for the horses I was on, it was perfect.

I have not ridden in any that were horrible, but some I probably would not pay to ride with again. And audited a few that I was glad I did not ride in.

[MyGiantPony]

Best hands down was Capt. Andy de Szinay. He had such a way of calmly explaining what he wanted, made you really want to succeed at what he was asking. The goal was a quiet partnership with your horse. I think that was the only clinic that I never experienced one moment of anxiety.

Worst was like others, Michael Matz. He’s just not a teacher. To this day, if he ever came back to training, I’d send him another horse in a heartbeat. Wouldn’t hesitate to put him on any horse of mine. But I would never take another lesson with him. Great rider doesn’t = good teacher.

[Jcrain]

The absolute best clinics I have ever attended, were held by a mother and daughter team. BJ Stone and her daughter, Stormi. Their genuine concern and eagerness to instill confidence in the riders while teaching us how to understand body language was amazing. There are no magic wand training aids to purchase and we all left feeling like we had learned more in four hours than we had learned in years!

[Salty]

I’m glad to see this zombie thread so I can just say what a wonderful, educational & fun time I had at a clinic with Nick Onoda recently. He’s really reignited my love of dressage. A very good teacher & a kind person.

Gotta say that my worst ever clinic was with Karen O’Connor.

[Xanthoria]

Gotta say some of the best clinics I’ve ever had were with Brian Sabo and he’s been nothing but kind to and about my horses over the years, as well as a super positive instructor!

[HappyTalk]

Best: David Marcus: this was an audit and every horse and rider came out for the better.

Worst: Marina Genn. A total waste of my time and money.

[RedmondDressage]

I agree - this is a good zombie thread

I haven’t actually ridden with a terrible clinician - I’ve been lucky.

Most recently I’ve ridden with Karen Pavcic from Canada and Alfredo Hernandez. Both fantastic experiences. I also rode with Lientje Schueler before she moved back to Germany - also fantastic and wish she would come back now that my horse is no longer a 4 y.o. super greenie.