Best joint supplement....

[newhorsemommy]

[QUOTE=TWH Girl;8942684]
I use Pentosan, and have tried many orals, but have always come back to the Smartflex joint supplements. Both of mine are on combo supplements- one Smart R&R (Smartflex Rehab is the joint sup in this one) and my older guy on Smart Combo Ultra (Smartflex Resilience is in this one).

Others I have tried and liked include the following; I just come back to SP because I like them and it’s just more convenient.

• Aborsobine Flex Max
• Uckele Lubrigen Pellets
• Hyla Sport[/QUOTE]

My gelding won’t eat the Smartpak joint supplements. Or Platinum Performance. I had a bunch of samples sent from both companies. He sniffs his bowl and walks away He won’t eat any of the powdered supplements from HorseTech. He’ll eat Grand HA if I add fenugreek powder to hide it. He’s eating the Flex Max without any hesitation so that’s what he gets for now. He is a picky, picky, old man

[Dutchmare433]

The only oral one I use is MSM, it can help with joints, and certainly helps with inflammation at the cellular level and can help with allergies.

Otherwise, I found it way more effective physically and cost wise to use injectables, either Adequan or Legend.

[FEIwannabe]

My vet recommended MSM.
But she said that since we’re starting Adequan it would be good to add Condroitin and Glucosamine, but I’m not sure why. I’ll have to ask her next time.

[DoodlesMom]

My gelding was lame for years, not ridable, only pasture sound, until I put him on Cetyl-M. It was like magic. We actually ended up competing on judged trails for another year… 6 years after I retired him due to his arthritis. He has since been re-retired, and he stopped eating the Cetyl-M, the picky little brat. But he ate it for years, and it worked wonders! Most of the older guys in my barn have switched to it, and their owners love it.

He’s on Prevacox now, which works to keep him comfortable in retirement. I think it does depend how back the joints are, and how much you want to spend. Injections did nothing for him, and neither did the plethora of other supplements we tried. That’s not to say something else wouldn’t help a different horse, though! Heck, my dog is on the SmartPak Joint Ultra, and it works really well for her.

[RedHorses]

MSM helps reduce inflammation. 10,000mg per day has been shown to reduce the number of inflammatory cells in joint fluid after a hard work (jumping was used). MSM is cheap protection. My farrier noticed a change in my horse with a hock issue after I started feeding MSM.

Glucosamine helps build and improve the joint fluid. There is debate over whether glucosamine sulfate is better than the other form (can’t think of the name right now… begins with a c I think). Either way 10,000mg/day is the recommended dose. I have a horse who has been getting MSM for years when I added glucosamine after he turned 16 - his walk warm-up time dropped from 11-12 minutes to 5-6 minutes.

Chondroitin helps build and repair cartilage. Chondroitin is expensive. If your horse doesn’t have cartilage issues, skip it. I had very good results from a chondroitn/glucosamine/msm supplement with one of my horses who had a bone chip digging at the cartilage every time he flexed the joint - BUT the chondroitin dose was 8500mg/per day and the supplement cost me over $2/day in the cheaper bulk size, six month bucket (and that was ten years ago). Compare that to the few hundred mg in other combined supplements.

Both glucosamine and chondroitin have been implicated in feed through studies as not absorbed by the horse. I wonder if the horses used were actually likely to have needed joint help, and if glucosamine and chondroitin are like vitamin c - dumped straight out if not needed.

As with anything fed to a living being, the individual horse may or may not be able to utilize the components in the form of THAT SPECIFIC supplement, but derive great improvement from this other specific supplement. My vet recommended trying one for two weeks (using a loading dose as directed on the product) and if I didn’t notice a difference to try a different product. I found one that worked for my hock issue horse, until the manufacturer changed the manufacturing process. The listed contents were identical, but it looked and smelled different and stopped working for my horse.

I think the first poster to respond got it bang on! Depends on the issue and reason for use!

[Hampton_Bay]

[QUOTE=RedHorses;8942969]

Both glucosamine and chondroitin have been implicated in feed through studies as not absorbed by the horse. I wonder if the horses used were actually likely to have needed joint help, and if glucosamine and chondroitin are like vitamin c - dumped straight out if not needed.
![/QUOTE]

Actually the studies have shown that there is no detectable level of glucosamine or chondroiton in the blood after feeding either supplement individually or both together. The studies showing these results were found to be thorough and well-designed. If it doesn’t make it to the blood, it cannot make it to the joints or cartilage.

[Ganesha]

I am really interested in MSM, but have heard so many anecdotal accounts of it making horses spooky or reactive that I’m a little leery. Maybe those horses were just finally feeling good? Any thoughts?

[TandyTX]

[QUOTE=BatataHead;8940714]
Equithrive (oral supplement) seems to have at least one study that found it effective
http://equinegold.com/texas-am-clinical-trial-indicates-equithrive®-joint-is-effective-therapy-for-equine-hock-lameness-practical-horseman-magazine/

And Adequan.[/QUOTE]

I read the JAVMA submission on the research for this product. Don’t have it handy to reference directly now…however, found it almost strange they’d published it.
Primarily because the “results” were anecdotal owner feedback and the findings were equal to the control (placebo)…but that it “might” have some use?

[FalseImpression]

[QUOTE=LadyB;8940632]
I use Triacta-HA Not sure if this is sold in the US. Sold in Canada, and I absolutely love it.

My gelding is 12, he’s had water on the knee for quite a few years no, no pain but just gross looking. After being on the loading dose, the knee went down half. Now he’s been on it for about 6 months, HOLY CRAP, his knee is 100% back to normal. Most of the time you don’t see a change with supplements but this one is enough proof. His warm up went from 20 minutes to 10 minutes as well.

Its about $119 CDN for 30 days. Worth every penny to me.[/QUOTE]

i agree 100%. Love the stuff. No fillers. I give it to my dog as well!

[RedHorses]

[QUOTE=Hampton Bay;8942991]
Actually the studies have shown that there is no detectable level of glucosamine or chondroiton in the blood after feeding either supplement individually or both together. The studies showing these results were found to be thorough and well-designed. If it doesn’t make it to the blood, it cannot make it to the joints or cartilage.[/QUOTE]

You and I evidently looked at different studies! :lol:

[Absolut_Equestrian]

@RedHorses;8942969

MSM helps reduce inflammation. 10,000mg per day has been shown to reduce the number of inflammatory cells in joint fluid after a hard work (jumping was used). MSM is cheap protection.

Which study demonstrated this?

Perhaps you are thinking of this study, which did show a reduction in biomarkers of oxidative stress in the blood - but did not examine synovial fluid levels.

[TWH_Girl]

I honestly must be the only one that is not on the MSM bandwagon. By itself, I’ve just never seen it do much. My lameness vet has always recommended a glucosamine/chondroitin joint supplement and has never said anything about MSM. It’s in the joint supplement I feed, but if I had to eliminate an ingredient, it would be MSM over the other stuff.

I probably feed joint supps to make myself feel better in all honesty!

[Cheltenham]

I have had good results with Cosequin ASU Plus.

Horse had a sore hock, mildly sclerotic bone lower hock, beginning to lose some joint space. Tufts guy, Garcia-Lopez looked at films for me. He said–try some oral HA for a month, rest, see what happens. Sometimes that’s enough. With regular vet we loaded horse w IV HA a few days and I chose the Cosequin ASU Plus because it was one stop shopping MSM, GLuc, Chon, HA and Avocado Soy Saponin plus some antioxidents. I didn’t expect much, but there is a lot of lab research on people showing HA and the ASU’s level off joint space loss and significantly reduce need for anti inflammatory NSAIDS etc.

Pleasant suprise—horse got better…hock fingers crossed hasn’t acted up again. So I gave some to his 26yo orthopedic disaster draft buddy who’d only been kept comfy by Meclofenamate. Either she miraculously fused up all her issues or the ASU+ helped her dramatically. She needs nothing else now and even the farrier was like WOW she’s not laying on me or having the trouble she used too.

SooooooThen I tried the ASU=+ on myslef. I found the same, wowsa…I’m not in pain. Eureka.

So, I dunno…either a heck of a good placebo worth paying for or it does have significant anti-inflam action.

The studies I read—can be found on google scholar…pub med—not for the cosequin product itself but individual oral therapy using HA, MSM, ASU —the studies are compelling—it won’t reverse terrible arthritic changes but reduce inflammation effectively without the GI issues of most NSAIDS, In vitro—they got ASU to stimulate sheep cartiledge cell regeneration…but that has not been seen in live human studies. The level off of the joint space loss probably comes from reduction of inflammatory “factors”/ proteins and maybe increase in joint lubrication which tends to drop off as we mammals age.

If I was going to recommend products definitely Cosequin ASUPlus. Also Conquer if you just want HA and less expense. And/or Adequan or Legend depending on circumstances.

From What my vet and Tufts Garcia Lopez told me— it can be good to load the horse with Adequan or Legend—and then use the orals as your maiitenance. Both seemed to think as a Maitenance, daily thing long term the orals do see to help avoid joints space loss/ maintain—but they aren’t going to magically repair bone on bone or remodled/fused stuff obviously.

[RedHorses]

[QUOTE=Absolut Equestrian;8944292]
Which study demonstrated this?

Perhaps you are thinking of this study, which did show a reduction in biomarkers of oxidative stress in the blood - but did not examine synovial fluid levels.[/QUOTE]

No, that’s not it. It was years ago that I saw the information.

[2horseygirls]

[QUOTE=Hampton Bay;8941536]
I have never had luck with anything more than HA. In the past I used Grand HA, and it made a significant difference in my mare when nothing else did. I just bought a year’s supply of “pure” HA from Amazon for $30 for my 10-yo gelding recovering from a joint and tendon sheath infection due to a snake bite. It may not help him at all, but for $30 for a year it’s no biggie if it doesn’t help. It’s 1/8t per day in wetted feed, so it’s easy to hide.[/QUOTE]

Which item, if you don’t mind? Just did an Amazon search, and got overwhelmed PDQ!

[hunterprincez]

My horse goes bonkers on MSM. I have tried 4 different times and every time he turns into a spooking, reactive maniac. I have taken it for arthritis and rosacea and it does work. I just suck at remembering to take pills!

[stb]

I have used Cosamin ASU on myself and it is amazing. I can certainly tell if I miss my dose for a few days.

[Mathilda]

For those who like Adequan but can’t afford it-- and are brave of heart – the product Ichon is identical and less than a third of the price. It’s sold as a lavage due to patenting issues, but is in every way the same product. It even comes in 5ml bottles, exactly the same. I know some people never go “off-label” and that’s fine, but my vet tipping me off to Ichon has been a godsend to me and my horses.

[Hampton_Bay]

[QUOTE=2horseygirls;8947756]
Which item, if you don’t mind? Just did an Amazon search, and got overwhelmed PDQ![/QUOTE]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GT4DL3E/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1

I did a loading dose of 1/8t twice a day for a week. No clue if it’s working as my horse has adhesions in the tendon sheath that are causing his lameness. I just figured that for $30 for around a year’s supply it couldn’t hurt. The bag doesn’t zip closed properly, so I keep it rolled over and inside a ziplock bag in the fridge. I feed it with some soaked feed, as HA is supposed to work best when fed wet.

[trail_blazer]

We have access to a very well known lameness veterinarian. Her recommendations are 30 mg of MSM all at once. This dose is necessary to help the body to increase its own production of HA.

Actistatin has studies that show improved flexion scores. We have had good results with it