A horse that’s eating, conservatively, 30#s of hay a day, plus whatever hard feed that the owner is giving, and is still losing weight, is a veterinary issue. Don’t feel bad at all telling the owner to involve in the vet. Don’t feel bad insisting that the owner involves the vet, because whatever is going on with this horse is clearly not a problem that can be solved with more calories.
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Well… It could be.
When my nearly-20 TWH came out of Winter ribbier than I like last Spring, on my vet’s advice I added TC Sr to his grain (oats).
Just a cup 2X daily & he wintered w/o weightloss.
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You’re saying that your horse was consuming 30 plus pounds of grass and alfalfa every day, plus a significant amount of hard feed (some sort of pelleted grain) and two cups of TC Senior is what made the difference?
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The horse gets half of a bermuda bale, averaging 125lbs, in a hay bag typically on monday and friday, and pretty much he gets a fresh bale of alfalfa every weekend. I dont weight it but I am pretty certain on the weights, most of my horses are out with other horses and get fed whole small square bales, and we typically feed MWF, but he is in a smaller turn out and by himself so he gets fed in smaller increments to keep waste down. none of my other horses in turn out get alfalfa but him, which is part of why it is more costly as I buy it from the feed store, rather than by the truck.
Over the three years she has been here my hay costs have roughly doubled, she has seen her board go up $20/horse/month, durning this time. I mentioned earlier that she is very cost sensitive, I think this puts her in a bit of a bind. I am concerned over the well being of the horses, as has been pointed out this is not a situation where she can move overnight.
I don’t have his papers but to my recollection he is somewhere in the 18-20 years old range.
I guess at this point I am going to request that she have the vet out to look him over, and hope that between whatever the vet suggests and the weather warming up he will improve.
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I’m not the OP.
I feed 1st cutting orchard grass - ~20# daily to this horse. Give or take depending on the state of pasture.
Horses are out 24/7 w/free access to stalls.
Only grain fed is whole oats & BOSS.
& Yes, adding the 2c of TC St kept weight on my horse.
Conundrum:
I was already feeding my mini TC Sr (no oats) & it is keeping weight off him.
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Yes, and in my post, I said that–given the amount of food this horse is consuming–this is not a calorie issue.
You disagreed??
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It sounds like you’re doing a lot for this boarder’s horse. I hear that you’re worried about her being in a bind when it comes to cost, but respectfully, someone who owns 8 horses has really signed up for figuring out their own costs. If you were to tell her that the increased costs of caring for this horse (feed above your usual amount, vet, dental) are her responsibility instead of yours and she were to respond badly, what are you most worried about? The conflict? Your potential loss of income if she were to pull all 8 horses out?
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In every thread started on this forum, there is the question posed, and then what the OP is really asking.
The OP isn’t asking “what is wrong with this horse”? He’s asking “do I really have to do more?”
Reading between the lines it looks like he’s hoping for people to say that it’s not his obligation to feed this horse more.
His obligation is whatever is in the contract.
Again, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to feed this older horse concentrates provided the contract states these options may be available. This is very common with older horses who need more calories to keep good weight on - especially coming out of winter. We don’t know the whole picture here or what the owner is feeding, or even how much the horse is actually consuming. It could be 30lb a day or could be 5. With all threads on COTH there’s three sides to any given story and we only know what’s freely shared.
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yep
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There are a lot of unknowns in this post. I am ASSuming that the boarding agreement calls for a pasture for the horses to live in and hay and that the owner is responsible for anything above that. Some horses thrive in a forage based diet but it doesn’t sound like this one does. We do not know what the owner is feeding this horse besides the hay included in board. If the contract calls for a certain amount of hay (which sounds adequate based on what has been posted) I am not sure what else the property owner can do. Perhaps weigh the hay out each day and hang the day’s amount out in a hay net. If I tried to feed my horses hay 2x a week they would eat out the choice amounts the first day, pull the rest out of the haynet, trample it into the ground, and complain they were starving until the next allocation. I realize this is very time consuming and may not be feasible due to time constraints.
There are a lot of reasons this horse might not be thriving. Not enough calories could be one. Some horses need more calories than forage can provide although it sounds like it is getting good alfalfa added to the bermuda hay. Poor dentition can be another. Points on the teeth, abscessed teeth, no grinding surface left. Chronic pain can lead to a horse loosing weight. Cancer, kidney disease, liver disease, etc.
Hormones from not being a gelding can cause stress and weight loss. I do think the barn owner needs to have a sit down with the owner and discuss what he is doing and his concern that the horse is not doing well. Maybe they can come up with a plan. Maybe not. I do think that a workup from a vet is in order. It might reveal problems that are not solvable and the owner can start having an end of life plan. If the owner, who has EIGHT horses, does not want to involve a vet and just wants the barn owner to do more - well that has an air of eau de hoarder. Since we do not have the whole picture here - I will not put the owner in that camp right now. How much money is he making on the other seven horses? Could that offset the loss on this horse? But unless the hay he is feeding is poor quality I don’t think more forage is the answer.
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**
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I deleted most of the above post, leaving these four important points to emphasize them.
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how much hay is wasted? I am guessing a fair amount as there is no reason for him to conserve by getting large amounts at one time.
I also give my horses large amounts of hay at a time, in a net. None is wasted. It sounds like there’s some sort of container here, as well.
very little, half a bale fits in the hay bag, and it is in a 150 gallon rubber maid tub, he pulls it out almost daily, but he cleans it up . I typically fill 2 bags so the entire bale goes in bags when one gets almost empty I throw the other one in. then repeat typically on monday
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I was answering this question. When I have 8 horses in the barn I basically go through a bale + a day, feeding the same portion so pretty sure it is a 100 lbs/week
My boarding contract states $/per horse per month, and that is it. Your right my question is how much more, if anything should I do. pretty much going to ask her to consult a vet, and follow his instructions.
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@house from the sounds of it, you offer a pretty straightforward pasture board situation, where you supply space and hay. You’ve set this horse up in his own space, are feeding him a lot of grass, and are purchasing alfalfa just for him.
I’m guessing that separate space and alfalfa hay isn’t really what you signed up for. Does your boarding contract outline what you provide? If not, this is a good time to think about updating that.
Regardless, if this horse is eating 30 plus pounds of quality hay every day, and still losing, there’s something wrong with him beyond your responsibility.
Hopefully the vet will be able to help the owner address whatever this issue is. Consider what you want your involvement here to be–you may need to explain to the owner what you can & cannot do given your setup.
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thanks for the update… so that puts me with those who advise a vet check
We had one TB, she was never raced but she only had two gears, walk or run as fast as the wind, she never was fat, maybe a 4 on the 5 scale all of her life. She was a hard keeper compared to her stable mates who could live on air
We did fed hay to one yearling in a water trough to keep his paddock buddy out of his hay
Found it would fit into a wagon for easy movement/bring in out of the rain
his buddy
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No idea about that sentence. 
Reads like auto-edit had itself a little bit of fun, and no one checked again before it was posted. But just guessing.
Agree.
^^^ this
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Truth. Wisdom for the ages.
Here is the pointer to the real problem – maybe. I’m guessing.
@house is gradually falling into the position of partially supporting this boarder’s 8 horses. All of the horses. And it is likely getting more so over time.
My misty crystal ball (it’s crystal but the visibility inside is not great) tells me that @house is weighing concern for the welfare of all of the horses, especially this one that is not thriving, against the growing problem of having this boarder and her horses in the picture at all.
Given she may not be able to adquately support the horses, leaving @house in the position of feeling neglectful or making up the shortfall from their own pocket.
She is “cost sensitive”. Another way to say that she is emotionally manipulating the professional care provider to provide more for her horses without her paying her full share – that is, at least partially at the expense of the care provider.
Classic problem of a caring care provider. An owner is falling short. But the professional care provider is worried that at least one horse has increasing needs that the owner will not provide. That if they ask the owner to leave, the horses will be worse off. What to do?
If someone with 8 horses can’t afford a vet to come check out one of them, can’t afford to up the feed on one, maybe it would be better to own fewer than 8 horses? “If having 8 horses is making it hard for you to give the extra care that this one needs, maybe you might consider moving one horse to another good owner? Then hopefully you can better take care of Dobbin’s needs.”
In any case, the horse is her responsibility. The barn owner / care provider is a good egg to try their best for the horse. But in the end it is up to the horse owner.
@house, if you conclude that it is requiring too much of you, financially and otherwise, to care for this lady’s 8 horses, if you decide that you have a hard decision to make, don’t feel guilty about making that decision Know that owners like this tend to find another favorable option and the horses do not starve or go wanting.
If you come to the conclusion that either you provide the extra care for the declining horse at your own expense, or the horse doesn’t get the care at all, it is ok to decide that you don’t want the responsibility on your farm. It’s up to you. Personally I would endorse whatever you decide.
All the best wishes for a good outcome for Dobbin, the owner and especially for you.
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I am sympathetic to your problem as I have dealt with similar situations at my backyard boarding facility. I agree that you should weigh what you’re feeding him so you can give her that information to share with her vet. Then she should work with the vet to determine how to manage this horse. When she tells you what the vet recommends, you should tell her that you need some time to work out what you have the time and resources to do at the current board rate. Then think about what you can do at the current rate, what rate you’d charge for additional services, and what is just not feasible with your set up.
You can then gently explain what you can afford to do at the current board rate and say that you’ll understand if she wants to move the horse to a facility that is set up to accommodate his needs. You can reiterate that, as a small-scale farm, you just don’t have the resources to provide more specialized care.
Remember that if you stretch yourself too thin trying to accommodate other horses, your own horses will suffer from lack of quality time with you, or lack of resources for them. By setting limits, you are not being selfish - you are protecting your horses and your family.
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