I am so very sorry, but no matter what this breeders history is, I would not call them a responsible reputable breeder at this point. It is so wrong to sell a puppy claiming the papers are in the mail and then never provide the papers. Saying that no one is going to breed them or show them does not make it better.
10 Likes
Apparently, since the pups were all sold as "petâ - she decided not to spend the $ to register the litter or even do the paperwork. She believes this is ok because none of the pups were to be shown nor bred. Is she in some financial situation ? I would spay your dog when you and your vet agree itâs time-best for the dog.
No chance the breeder will will have any objection - or give you any trouble. Just ignore her - you have a bill of sale and a great new dog. Enjoy !
The breeder did not fulfil her part of the contract - the contract is bologna !
No need. All you have to do is get the dog scanned which will tell you the manufacturer of the chip. You then call the manufacturerâs number and tell them ownership has been transferred and update with new information. Microchip manufacturers are happy to do this because the new owner then assumes payments to keep the chip active. Itâs usually about 10 bucks a year.
Kind of weird though that she lied about the papers. First she told you she was waiting for the AKC to send them to her, then she admitted she never sent them in to begin with?
I would do as you like with your pup. If the breeder doesnât care enough to register, and sheâs lying to you, I doubt sheâll care about an early spay or expect vet paperwork.
7 Likes
Iâm not a lawyer but I would read the contract to see what the contractual consequences are of spaying too early. When I bought a puppy a few years ago, there were all sorts of conditions about the vaccines that I shouldnât give the dog, and not to spay at all but the consequences were simply that I couldnât seek compensation from the breeder if the dog developed some sort of problem. I signed the contract fully intending to get the vaccines and spay the dog. I was never worried that I could not seek compensation.
My other question is how would the breeder even know if you got the dog spayed before 20 months? I think this is pretty low stakes so I recommend doing what is best for the dog and not worrying about the breeder. She has already demonstrated the weight she puts on the contract.
2 Likes
Iâd spay when it is best for your dog and supported by your vet. If the breeder circles back asking for proof of spay between 20-24 months, Iâd ignore their communications and move on. Not registering puppies and lying about paperwork tells you all that you need to know.
10 Likes
A breeder can sell puppies with a âlimited registrationâ caveat. The American Kennel Club is well aware that not all purebred puppies are âshow quality.â Indeed, the majority of them are not and there is nothing wrong with that (or the puppy).
My cousin got her Dalmatian from a reputable breeder who designated Domino as not-quite-worthy-enough for full registration. My cousin, however, got Domino spayed and started training and showing in obedience trials, along with other activities. My cousin kept her dogâs breeder updated with every new âaccomplishmentâ that she achieved. When my cousin tried to enter an obedience trial in Canada (20+ or more years ago), she found that Canada at that time did not recognize the AKC Limited Registration of dogs. My cousin contacted Dominoâs breeder, and because my cousin had proved to be a responsible owner (to the point she offered my cousin a âreturnedâ puppy), the breeder contacted the AKC to remove the Limited Registration and allow Domino to have âfull registration.â Since Domino was spayed, she still would not have been allowed to be shown in conformation classes.
The American Kennel Club, I believe, is more upset by a breeder withholding legitimate registration papers than the âqualityâ of the said dog. Still, a person can apply for a PAL registration. On the registration, you can state who the breeder is (page 2 of the actual registration application) and on page 3 (after #5 and #6), one can say, for example, âbreeder never provided promise registration papers/proof of breeding parentsâ, naming the breeder/kennel. One could even âhintâ at the breeder/kennel in the puppyâs registered PAL name. (If the kennel was Snowshine, the name could be Big Bubba of Snowshine or similar.)
If one were to tell the breeder that they were applying for a PAL, that breeder might get their act together and provide the promised papers.
Personally, I would contact the American Kennel Club asking what to do. The OP does not want to breed the dog, as the OP bought the dog with a spay/neuter requirement. There should be no reason to withhold the registration papers.
I have no idea if the OP wishes to show eventually in âperformance eventsâ or just wants what they were promised to get along with the puppy. At one time, there were premiums and catalogs for dog shows that listed the official registered names, often with the name of the breeder/breederâs kennel listed. I think dog show catalogs have gone by the wayside but there is certainly nothing that would stop the OP from telling people who the breeder of the puppy is. So, it makes no sense to ME while the breeder is being lackadaisical about.
3 Likes
The fact that sheâs withholding registration papers makes me wonder if she never paid the stud fee and therefore doesnât have the paperwork necessary to initially register the litter with the AKC.
Iâm not a dog breeder, but Iâm wondering if there arenât provisions in place similar to those in the horse world to ensure that the stud dog (horse) owner gets paid before the offspring are register-able.
1 Like
Assuming part of the purchase price was based on the dog being AKC certified, and that certification hasnât come through, at the very least Iâd be asking for some kind of refund. She kinda pulled a bait and switch on you.
6 Likes
It doesnât usually work that way, but of course every situation is different.
My guess is that the sire isnât really the sire.
5 Likes
You paid for a registered pup? Did you get a price reduction because it was pet quality? I would ask that she at least register yours because you paid for that in the price. How can the breeder know that none of the pups might be shown one day?
2 Likes
This is bizarre. Even if the puppies werenât sufficient quality to show in the conformation ring, there are a LOT of other sporting venues where tracking parentage and and titles matter. Saying ânone are going to be shown so I wonât bother registering themâŠâ doesnât make sense. Thereâs something really off about her story.
Spay your dog when it works for you. The breeder will likely never followup.
8 Likes
Agreed; I typed something like that out and then got sidetracked and lost it. Something doesnât make sense; thatâs why I said my guess is that the âsireâ isnât really the sire. It was probably another dog and she doesnât want to identify and/or does not want DNA them and/or doesnât want the bad publicityâŠlikely that the owner of the sire(s) found out that the breeding was falsified.
2 Likes
The breeder also owns the stud, so there isnât an issue with the stud fee. And I am certain that the stud is who she says it is because she planned the breeding from the beginning and intended to keep a puppy from the litter for herself. She did choose her pick, and after further evaluation, the one she chose didnât end up being up to her standards for show quality and she was placed in a pet home. The AKC papers were never discussed as I know the history on most of her dogs and am friends with another breeder who got her going in the show scene. I just assumed that the puppy would come with the papers, as it was stated in the contract that I was REQUIRED to register it within 30 days. The pricing for pet vs. show homes wasnât any different and Iâm honestly not interested in causing a monetary stink over papers that I really donât care about or need. I just want to spay my dog before 20 months. I can guarantee the breeder will follow up on the spay although she may not care quite as much now since I wouldnât be able to register anything without the papers. Not that it matters. But she keeps tabs on her puppies and wants updates to make sure they are doing well so I fully expect to hear from her.
This has been an interesting conversation and you all have brought up quite a few points to think about!
Odd situation with the AKC papers. Never knew of a reputable breeder that wouldnt register the litter or provide restricted registration for the pet home puppies.
Are the papers important to you for showing in obedience etc? If so, I would remind her that you purchased an âAKC registerableâ puppy and you intend to register it. If you go to the AKC with this it could cause problems for her.
If you dont care about registering but want to spay earlier than the agreement, just do it! She would be in no position to make any waves.
I am no lawyer, but she isnt either and likely wouldnt want the whole business public when she didnt do as she should have. I would drop all contact with her and she will likely do the same.
I agree that something is very hinky to have her do this.
ETA: you posted as I was typing! She may want to âkeep tabsâ but you are under no obligation to do so. Is this a large breed? How early are you thinking of spaying?
3 Likes
I have no desire to do any kind of showing with her, so the papers wonât be necessary. I have enough to manage with horse shows! lol. My vet and I agreed that it would be appropriate to spay 3 months after her first heat.
I know you say you do not want to show at all, but the whole situation sucks. The PAL program was mentioned above and to register your dog using that you have to have it spayed/neutered. If the breeder gets grumpy about you spaying when the vet says to, simply tell the breeder that they tied your hands and that you can not get PAL papers until the dog is spayed.
2 Likes
Perhaps a co owner of the sire or dam wasnât on board with the breeding, or the bitch got covered by someone other than the intended sire, so thereâs risk of mixed parentage. Thereâs something wonky there, to have a breeder just say 
about registering the litter.
What penalities exist in the contract if you spay early? How enforceable are they?
And how would she know?
4 Likes
Playing devilâs advocate, if you were planning on spaying earlier, it might have been wise to discuss this with the breeder before buying the pup. The contract on my gsd is 2 yrs. But she is having abnormal cycles, (short cycles ever 3 months) so my vet is recommending sooner due to the risk of pyometra. Iâm planning on xraying to check status of hips and growth plates and discussing an exception due to health reasons with her breeder.
1 Like
The way I read the OPâs posts, they had no intentions of not following the contract until the vet suggested that it would be best to spay earlier.
They are not the one who went into this contract with no intentions of following thru with their end.
4 Likes
