Gore
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by magnolia:
Greetings Doc!
Thanks for the info on the HPA. I didn’t know there was such thing. What else does it cover? I’m curious.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Greetings, Magnolia. You don’t have to call me “Doc”, just Ellen will do. HPA, despite its grandiose name, only covers soring and the use of certain heights of pads, and weights of shoes and chains. (The TWH’s with the exaggerated action, aka “Big Lick”, all work and show in pads and chains.) It’s not a breed-specific legislation, but it’s the TWH industry that was (and to some extent, still is) responsible for soring.
TWH’s were more or less thrown out of AHSA many moons ago (in the 1940’s or 50’s, I think) because of soring.
If you’ve never seen the Big Lick horses move, you should. It’s absolutely hideous, even if they aren’t sored. IMHO, it’s about the most unnatural thing we ask horses to do.
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by pacificsolo:
[B] <BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hobson:
Pacificsolo, I have to agree with you. I resent paying taxes so that freeloaders like the Honeywell and Raytheon CEO’s can sit on their lazy butts and just wait for those NASA contracts to come rolling in. Why don’t they go and start their own darned space program, anyway? What’s space exploration done for us, besides bring Gore-Tex to the masses? We sure didn’t need to pump billions of dollars into a wasteful program just to get high-tech winter clothing. And why does ADM need millions in subsidies with MY tax money? I’d rather throw my paycheck off a bridge than pay for one more single undeserving ear of bio-engineered corn. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I’m not sure if that was meant to be sarcastic, …
I think you REALLY missed my point…no, I’m CERTAIN you missed my point! What kind of random tangent was THAT?!
[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Pacificsolo,
You sweet innocent, you! Hobson understood you perfectly and responded with some delightful sarcasm.
I enjoy reading your posts, but there is a certain naivete evident in most. Would that we all could preserve our innocence and sunny outlook on life. I understand that your religious convictions help simplify life for you, and that is wonderful. Sophistication and broadened insight will come with time. Hopefully, cynicism will not.
[This message has been edited by Inverness (edited 11-07-2000).]
AHC- you stole the words right out of my mouth!
We can’t go back 30 years in the Supreme Court. Yes, many of you might be pro-life, or pro choice… No matter what EVERY woman should have the right to chose. It really scares me that some 65 year old man can tell me what to do with MY body.
Also, Bush is backed by the Christian Coalition, and for me that’s another bad idea. Not everyone in the USA is Christian…
Gore all the way!
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jumphigh83:
Do I feel guilty for driving my truck? NOT. Why should I feel guilty for working 18 hour days to have the resources to buy and support my truck? I am sick and tired of appologizing for working hard and being able to have some nice things. Algore will try to scare the pants off of you (no…that was Clinton)…but I digress…Environmental changes are pretty predictable and quite cyclical. Yes we have an impact on our environment but not the doomsday impact our vice president would have you believe. Arrggghh! I can’t stand this topic! Why not just give up everything we have and let big brother tell us all what to, when to do it, and how and with whom we can do it…get the government OUT of my life…oh yeah, and quarterly sales taxes are due…and withholdings, and state and federal tax, inheritance tax, luxury tax, sur tax, gasoline tax, and property tax, and income tax… IS ANYBODY LISTENING???<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Wow Jumphigh83… what a heart you have… good to see, good to see. You take social Darwinism to a whole new level I see. I disagree with absolutely everything you say… so I am not even going to begin picking apart all of your arguments (and a train could be driven through the holes in your arguments). However, I would just like to point out one thing… you complain and you complain and you complain about taxes… and yet you critique the education system? Since you apparently believe there thould basically be no taxation, especially federally, then explain to me, please, how our children will be educated? You live to moan and groan about the horrors of our government and democratic leaders… but please, by all mean, feel free to offer up some solutions that don’t involve taxation of some sort.
So then I guess Aly you are in favor of a slickly sophisticated and produced product. Doesn’t really matter what’s in the box. He can say anything you want to hear and that’s makes it better than a real person with some integrity and honesty to admit he’s not an expert on everything in the world but willing to delegate to those who are the experts.
Which Al Gore do you like? The one from who lies about his pristeem views of the environment while his own money comes from a poluter of the water and ground? The one who didn’t know he was at a fund raiser in a budist temple? The one who backed up the Pres who was using cigars in a most unusual way? The one who got most of his money from the entertainment business he says is ruining the children? and on…and on…and…on!
Did you know that Winston Churchill’s Dad thought he was so dumb that he wouldn’t trust him as the executer of the family estate? Did you know that Dwight Eisenhower chose to be President and passed people’s ideas because he already had accomplished all he needed and wanted to help others? He was aware of his image but he didn’t give a ****. He just did what was what he believed was right. And, what about Harry Truman who certainly wasn’t a genius, did that stop him from being a good President?
None of them gave away the store for votes!
Do you know if Gore’s grades were better? Do you know if he is anything more than parrot of the polls? Would you really like a President who has no honest opinions of his own, but has to check the polls to find out what he thinks on an issue.
Do you know if George Bush flunked any classes? Do you know if he graduated from Yale with honors? Do you know his IQ? How does it compare? Are you positive that you’re not just a victim of the media which so heavily supports Gore? Are you sure you’ve been told the truth? Are you sure you know what Al Gore really stands for and which people influence his opinions day to day!
Even his mother and father have not been saved from his prevarication of the details of his life. Which life is the truth?
We’re obviously, not going to change each others minds on our priorities. I would like it though if you would consider whether or not there is a real Al Gore or is he a produced media package that you don’t know at all.
If as we have all agreed the major problem today is the lack of personal responsibility for what we do, then would you prefer a guy who gets up and just says, Hey! this is me and I think I have a track record that proves I’m up to this job. What you see is what you get and you can be sure of an honest guy with integrity.
The criminals don’t seem to have any problem getting guns. I have heard on the news that their best source are the recyled guns discarded by the various police departments which cannot be tracked and are not sold at gun sale places.
Now, if all the criminals have guns which they got through various nefarious means and everyone of the rest of us don’t have guns…what do you suppose will be the result?
I have not heard a valid argument for why it is not better if a criminal can’t be sure which house or person is armed and which is not. They at least then have to take a 50/50 risk that the person they intend to victimize might be able to defend themselves.
Yes, the slippery slope is OK! no one with a criminal record can have a gun…but these are the dummies who got caught. The smarter crooks didn’t get caught! The you have all the do gooders who want to release everyone from jail because they were not properly prosecuted, or they didn’t have a good defense, or they were just plain innocent. You have all the bleeding hearts who are sure that it was the twinkie that made him do it, or his Mother didn’t nurture him right, or he was abused as a child or any one of a 1000 other excuses for why they are not responsible for the consequences of their actions.
Now! is our choice no guns at all including the police! or guns for everyone to keep the status quo. I sleep with a 12 guage shot gun in my bedroom, it was recommended to me by my police because we live too far off the beaten track to get help in time. Security systems are fine if the criminal types aren’t smart enough to cut the telephone lines. There are no neighbors who would hear a siren if it went off outside.
And yes! I’m a terrible shot, that’s why I have a shot gun with a spray. Now even if I intended to miss I’m such a bad shot I just might kill him. What are my options?
The terrorist, the nut case knows how to rebuild anything into a gun. They’re never going to go bare.
Can’t you see that the answer lies much deeper than the symptoms of gun ownership? It is a respect for privacy, property and individual rights. You need to better ask how can we better manage society so that there are no scam artists, no thieves or criminals to be defended from!
What is a deterent against crimes? I agree that gun ownership is not. I would prefer a world without guns. I’m not too bad with a bow and arrow. Reality check please!
Don’t just tell me that you hate guns and want them gone, tell me how to stop the crooks and villains from being socialized into our society? How do we keep all the crazies out there from becoming violent and attacking someone?
How can we on the one hand be too afraid to disclose the truth as witnesses, to assist in the enforcement of the law as citizens and then wonder why all these deviant personalities don’t know that there is something wrong with killing people.
How can they understand when we have looked the other way as their crimes were growing.
[This message has been edited by Snowbird (edited 10-29-2000).]
Well… so long folks!
I can’t keep up with this INCREDIBLE thread anymore and I have so much to say that I am just going to keep my mouth shut because I simply don’t have the time. I think it is ridiculous that we are getting into such a heated debate about abortion and gun control. People feel the way they do about those issues and have their very own ideas of what is wrong and right… and the only way that those views will EVER change is if they are personally affected (i.e. are shot at or raped or something like that). Anyway, I have had it up to here (drawing my hand across my throat) with debating the candidates and the election. We have who we have for candidates… nothing can change that. And what will happen in the election will happen… we’ll have to start a whole new thread AFTER the election when the american public decides what happens.
As for me, I’m not going to sit around and type about it. I hit the campaign trail in New York City tomorrow for Gore and JumpHigh83’s most beloved “Hillarious”. Wish me luck braving the streets of NY campaigning. I’ll check in if I can for a peek at the board… if you havn’t heard from me by the end of next week I am probably in a New York morgue somewhere… shot by a handgun-toting Hillary hater in the middle of Herald Square (I’m kidding, I’m kidding… I think!).
So, whoever you are and wherever you are in the country I say… VOTE! And if you really care, volunteer! I garuntee your local party headquarters could need your help getting out the vote.
And my personal prediction:
-Democrats take back the House by the slimmest of margins
-Republicans keep the senate by the slimmest of margins (despite dem wins in NY, WA, FL, DE, NE, GA, and either Missouri or Michigan)
-Al Gore looses the popular vote and wins the electoral college in the closest presidential race in history (and if he looses i think it will be because too many people went to Nader in the battleground states… sorry Hobson… but I actually don’t blame gore for saying “MINE, MINE, MINE”… I think all of us dems are damn resentful of the fact that Nadar is making this ten times more difficult then it already is for Gore… and were scared bad… and it would be crazy for Gore to offer Nader some sort of cabinet spot when Nader disagrees with him so much… that would be SUCH a sign of weakness on gore’s part)
it’s too close to really tell though! and hey, a lot can happen in 6 days!
til’ after the election…
Rockstar
No no no, you’ve missed the point Pwynn made (and I was coming to post!) To paraphrase Daddy Bush, “It’s the LYING, Stupid!” Oh how I love hearing the Elephants on this board excusing Dubya’s “mistake”. We Donkey’s have had to do that for Clinton, and it it’s so awkward, isn’t it?.
The point is not that he was arrested for DUI, it’s that he didn’t mention it ever. In fact, lots of researchers right now are trying to find an instance of Dubya’s denying this conviction on the record (or best of all, under oath). So far they’ve turned up: “Have you ever been arrested?” Dubya: “Well, I didn’t have a completely clean record as a YOUTH” Hmmm, in 1974 he was 30! Talk about Gore’s exaggerating! HAH!
This should be a reminder, or eyeopener, to all the people who have hidden their heads in the sand, believing that “Bush is honest, a “real” person.” The man is a POLITITIAN, THEY LIE FOR A LIVING. Accept it.
And WORST CRIME about the DUI which is even more telling about Dubya: Somebody pulled the strings to have the record expunged! A simple man indeed. Simple enough to believe NO ONE would find out about it.
But as my local radio pointed out, it’s a good thing this DUI thing broke today… Otherwise the headline would be, "Dubya declares, “Social Security is not a Federal Program!” when he (mis)spoke at a rally yesterday.
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Caruso:
[B]Gore, environmentalist? Check it out:
The Wall Street Opinion Journal http://www.opinionjournal.com/
Investigating Al Gore
The vice president, Armand Hammer and zinc. http://www.opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=65000067
Saturday, August 12, 2000
[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hmm, consider the source . . . then investigate the facts yourself. Gore isn’t the only one out there with a tendency to exaggerate.
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rockstar:
The BOTTOM LINE here is that the Republican Party has grown extremely
conservative.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hey rockstar, I appreciate your efforts and while I’m voting for Ralph, who is unfortunately the most tedious public speaker in the world, I’m secretly rooting for Gore. But I just don’t buy your New Democrat line. It’s just code for the process in which the D-party is moving steadily to the right, adopting more and more Republican-type positions. Heck, one of the several reasons the Repubs hate Clinton so much is that he keeps stealing their material! I’m thinking of welfare reform, reduction of the federal gov’t, and stuff like that bizarre Defense of Marriage Act that he supported (I keep asking my gay/lesbian pals when and how they plan to destroy my marriage, but they promise me that their insidious attack will be a surprise one). And as to your argument that the Republicans won’t play fair in Congress, I’d bet that the Dems on the federal debate commission fully cooperated in keeping Nader and Buchanan out of the presidential debates(correct me if I’m wrong on this) - doesn’t seem much like sharing, does it? The further to the right everyone shifts, the fewer choices we’ll have in future elections, and the political discourse will become dangerously narrow. So, if your party won’t allow a multi-party electoral system, can’t you guys at least resurrect some of those Old Democrats? 
Hobson-
I’m more a libertarian than a Nader supporter, but I may vote Nader because I’d like to see a 3rd party out there.
I am soooooooo tired of hearing dems and reps say 3rd parties are illegitimate and have no purpose. At least they stand for something other than the status quo.
My boyfriend is a huge Nader supporter, but I hate taxes…although, we do spend more money subsidizing corporations than people, so maybe Nader would even save us money (I doubt he’d give tax dollars to corporations, unlike Bush and Gore)
And, I think Bush has pretty much won here in NC, so unless some Gore supporter can tell me otherwise, I’ll do it, I’ll vote third party (which I always do!).
To Change!
Uh-oh. When I am in the middle of a diplomatic problem, I always ask myself, what would Captain Picard do in this situation? (yeah, I’m a Star Trek fan on top of everything else…and Jean-Luc rides horses too!)
Rockstar, what will I do with you? This is not the place where anyone is going to be converted, so you’ll have to accept that. The value here is that we are all learning from one another what a diverse group we are, and I additionally hope we are gaining some new insights into political positions we might formerly have dismissed. I hope you don’t drop out of the discussion, because it’s been such fun! I dislike inaccurate generalizations as much as you do, and I understand it’s horribly frustrating. But I would ask you to do the right thing and not throw insults back, because it does nothing for your cause. Right now, Sannois thinks that you’re not only a socialist, but a rude socialist to boot. I think the Captain would keep his calm and say something like , Sannois, you may have misunderstood me when I explained the democratic party’s position on such-and-such. I see that you have concerns about this or that topic, so allow me to be more clear about it.
As the Captain would say, “Make it so, Geordie!”
Personally, I’m going to be sorry to see this thread end. It has been such fun watching Snowbird, Jumphigh83, and others get riled and radical.
Its a wonder my monitor hasn’t burst into flames!
Well, I don’t feel compelled or obligated to explain anything else. Different strokes for different folks. Y’all have a nice weekend, and don’t forget to vote on the 7th!
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SLWarrior:
keep in mind that Gore WILL impose a litmus(sp) test on his Supreme Court candidates as he stated during the first debate. He said he would not appoint someone the likes of Clarence Thomans and another judge currently on the bench. Bush said he would not use a litmus test. Roe v. Wade is safe, Americans want that freedom of choice for their mothers, daughters and sisters.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
With all due respect, SL, I think you may have misunderstood the point Gore was making during that question. He was pointing out that no matter WHO makes the appointments, they have ways of selecting the candidate that will more than likely guarantee a certain type of future voting record without openly asking about it.
This is no more or less than has ALWAYS occurred with supreme court selection, and I think we would be in a whole new fantasy land if we were to assume that either of these candidates are any less than the politician they are born and bred to be. To do other than their party demands is a great way to lose the support of your OWN party, and few inpolitics can survive that.
OK, I think MY cynicism about politics came shining through 
<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Moose:
[B]QUOTE
QUOTE: “Hey rockstar, I appreciate your efforts and while I’m voting for Ralph, who is unfortunately the most tedious public speaker in the world, I’m secretly rooting for Gore.”
IMHO, If you are secretly rooting for Gore, don’t vote Nader, since it will only split the vote and help Bush to win. I situation like this I think your really need to decide whether you are Republican or Democrat.
[/B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Hiya, Moose - you make some excellent points on the regulation issue. Bravo. On the Nader - Gore thing, I’ve really struggled with it. I KNOW Nader doesn’t have a chance. But my anti-Bush vote does not automatically belong to Gore. See, I’m really a radical left parliamentarian accidentally born into an inflexible two-party system tightly controlled by special business interests. I can’t force myself any longer into the body of a Democrat. It’s really hard for me to NOT lend a hand to the third-party effort. What to do? This happens for EVERY election - if I vote for the guy or gal I like, then the nasty one will win because I “steal” a vote from the less nasty one. But the lesser evils never help us Chris Hitchens fans out here on the fringe build a more broad-based, fair electoral system! Oh, for proportional representation!
And rockstar, don’t hate me 'cause I’m green. And yes, by my debate commission remark I meant that I can’t cry a river for the dems because the repubs won’t share power…when they’re guilty of the same selfishness. But agreed, the dems are certainly more representative of the nation than the republicans, and have significantly different (and in my opinion more reasonable) positions on various stuff. No argument there. But darn it, I want to vote for the candidate I think is best and smartest and most honorable! I’m sorry, but Al Gore just makes me feel icky. Yeah, he wants us medical patients to have rights, but gosh, he’s awfully friendly with the pharmaceuticals. Eeek! Not a horsey topic!
So here’s a horse-related thing: Those of us on the east coast are now nervously watching the spread of West Nile virus. In another thread, Weatherford mentioned all the work that the Centers for Disease Control is doing to find a way to deal with this threat, which affects both humans and horses. Our taxes support this research. For those who want the government “out of my life,” would you be OK with the CDC having only enough staff and resources to test one or two dead crows and leave it at that? Hey, horses and people are dying! Oh, well, we can’t meddle in your lives, ya know?
[This message has been edited by hobson (edited 10-22-2000).]
Well Applebird I have to tell you I feel the same way! The idea of Gore in the Whitehouse with his finger on the red button scares me to death. The idea of Gore being charge of anything by himself scares me to death.
BUSH! BUSH!BUSH! BUSH!BUSH! BUSH!BUSH! BUSH!BUSH! BUSH!BUSH! BUSH!BUSH! BUSH!
I’d rather trust the Bush team, with Colin Powell and Chenney, Thank you very much!
Snowbird – get your facts straight. Bill Gates WAS born with a silver spoon in his mouth. I went to school with Bill Gates. His father was a partner in the most prestigeous law firm in Seattle and is very wealthy. Paul Allen also came from a very wealthy family.
When I was coming up, it was a dangerous world, and we knew exactly who the they were. It was us vs. them, and it was clear who them was. Today we’re not so sure who the they are, but we know they’re there." - USA Today, August 28, 2000
Hello,
Can someone explain why the quotes from Bush are funny? I thought Gore’s claim to have started the Internet heart-wrenching. How can people vote for somebody who learned to lie from his boss (Clinton)? Also, I can not tell you how many times I have said the wrong words or mispronounced something! I would rather have someone in office who means what he says (or means) than someone who can not decide what he means.
Also, on a different issue, I believe that murder is wrong. I know that most of you think murder is just fine and do not even loose sleep at night knowing that innocent lives have been lost that day.
On gun control - If Gore wins the election I will go to the local gun dealer and purchase a semi-automatic pistol. I believe in personal freedom. I believe that I have the right to protect my family if the need arises. I will not give up my second-admendmant rights.
Regarding the issue of Bush being backed by the Christian Coalition - I find that an encouragement. The Christian Coalition does not back just anybody. On the issue of church and state - if the christian faith had been left in Europe this country would not be. The founding fathers believed that God was guiding their footsteps. Without this faith, would they have been as bold? And if you truly believe that your religous freedom will end with the election of Bush then you need a new understanding of Christianity.
In Christ,
Image
[This message has been edited by Image (edited 11-02-2000).]
[This message has been edited by Image (edited 11-02-2000).]
