Buy American

[Backstage]

[QUOTE=Bent Hickory;5862636]
Herein lies a big disconnect. You severely underestimate the time these activities take by a factor of 3 or 4, particularly for a small breeder without a staff.

To begin with, it takes two adults at least an hour and a half to two hours to prepare a young horse for photos by the time you factor in bathing, clipping ears/whiskers/fetlocks, bleaching whites, pulling mane, banging tail, drying, fitting a halter/bridle, etc., all the while dealing with a young horse.

And if you have 4-5 youngsters, you’re looking at a whole day’s worth of work and not a single photo taken…[/QUOTE]

Well, firstly, I think the simple reality is that regardless of the amount of time it takes, its very much a necessity if you want to sell youngsters. It needs to be done and sellers simply need to govern themselves accordingly or expect that sales will be slow non-existent.

Obviously you are entitled to prepare your horses as you see fit. And while I would be cautious as a BAD photo will do a breeder some harm, when the alternative is nothing to show to potential purchaser, there is really and truly no need to clip and bleach to that degree. The horse should be clean, the mane/tail should be tidy, the rest is gravy and most buyers can look past those details. Frankly, I like the babies to look like they are out growing and playing in any event.

[Equilibrium]

OK, am I mistaken in thinking that people want to see 2yo’s clipped up looking ready to step into the show ring? If you’re shopping in Europe for unstarted youngsters, you ain’t gonna see that. Tidy mane, banged tail, and clean brushed coat are all that’s required. Bridle maybe, but probably headcollar and rope. Getting them to stand in a position long enough to get good pics is difficult yes, but the rest of the stuff, come on now. Really?

Hand up now who wants that from an unstarted youngster. Mine is down and I would also have to think you don’t have an understanding of what you are buying. I want to see feet in good condition, a healthy coat, and hopefully something that tells me the horse can do the job at hand. I don’t need clipped out ears to tell me that.

You guys are making things way too difficutl and then throwing your hands up in the air and saying nobody wants to buy. That’s why they go to Europe. You want a jumper, here you go here’s 10 of what you want in one place. And if they are unstarted they won’t be dressed up to the nines. They will be in great condition but not stepping into a hunter ring ready.

It doesn’t take me that long to get Abba ready for a jumper show while tending to all the other horses and chores and the dogs and cats. I’m finding that a bit hard to stomach.

I’ll tell you what this weekend I will bring scruffy yearling in out of the field. She IS NOT FOR SALE. Her mane is loooooong and wild. I will clean her up for pics and even wash that tail. I will tell you how long it takes me to get her ready for pics and then show you the pics. I might even put her in the arena so we can upload a few clips of her paces. She has been living wild for ages now. Then you can critique and say what you like and what you don’t about the pics. Honestly not concerned if you like her as she’s mine and not for sale. It’s more about the getting something done for a purpose exercise.

Terri

[fordtraktor]

Honestly, as a buyer I don’t care if a foal has ear tufties or not. Heck, half the registries think you are barbaric if you do clip them. I don’t pull baby manes, I shorten them with a blade or scissors/thinning shears. Takes 5 minutes and they look fine. I pull the show horses’ manes.

I just want to see some video of the thing moving around for a decent amount of time at each gait, maybe with the mud knocked off but even that’s optional. It’s a baby. Need not be fancy but I want to be able to see the horse.

[Xanthoria]

Terri, have a go at making a Google Sites site for her too - just to see how long it takes and if it’s easy for you.

[Equilibrium]

I might do that because I am the most useless person at anything technical so if I can do it, anyone can! I can’t even multiquote on COTH and I’ve read how a thousand times! LOL!

But I don’t want to get people thinking she’s for sale. I could never sell The Cupcake! Funny enough a friend of mine was telling me about his Vancouver yearling. He was saying she will end up quite small. I told him I bred mine to be small but don’t think she will be as small as I hoped. He’s like, well we can do a trade later on if you like. I didn’t say anything but in my mind I was like, is he for real, does he really think I’d trade The Cupcake?

Terri

[fordtraktor]

Terri, I love her already…awesome name, The Cupcake! :lol:

[Bent_Hickory]

[QUOTE=Backstage;5862676]
Well, firstly, I think the simple reality is that regardless of the amount of time it takes, its very much a necessity if you want to sell youngsters. It needs to be done and sellers simply need to govern themselves accordingly or expect that sales will be slow non-existent.[/QUOTE]

And therein lies the second big disconnect from three separate posters: I’m not trying to sell youngsters! Even if I were, the vast majority of people likely to buy from me require them to be going under saddle or at least old enough to start. So spending any time marketing them is pointless, much less responding to the whims of a shopper. As noted earlier, I elect to spend my time with more productive sales channels. Plain and simple.

[Perfect_Pony]

I have to laugh at sellers complaining about the time it takes to get pictures and video of a horse for sale. Hell I spent ENTIRE WEEKENDS and hundreds of dollars going to look at a single lame horse. I also wasted days of vacation days from work driving all over yonder to look at lame and/or misrepresented horses.

Horse buying and selling does take time and effort and money, get over it.

[Bent_Hickory]

[QUOTE=Perfect Pony;5862748]
Horse buying and selling does take time and effort and money, get over it.[/QUOTE]

Agreed. I just elect to minimize the time, effort and money spent on people not likely to buy a horse.

[smokygirl]

Everyone says that they just want the mud knocked off, and to see it moved and they can look past winter fuzzies… but the vast majority of them don’t really mean it.

[Backstage]

[QUOTE=Bent Hickory;5862745]
And therein lies the second big disconnect from three separate posters: I’m not trying to sell youngsters! Even if I were, the vast majority of people likely to buy from me require them to be going under saddle or at least old enough to start. So spending any time marketing them is pointless, much less responding to the whims of a shopper. As noted earlier, I elect to spend my time with more productive sales channels. Plain and simple.[/QUOTE]

I’m glad that you have found channels that work for you and that you won’t be on here complaining about your inability to sell youngsters.

[YankeeLawyer]

I completely disagree with the notion that it is effective to show videos or photos of a horse that is not clipped, mane pulled, etc. Not if you want to get competitive prices for the horses. I would rather have no media than mediocre media. The fact if the matter is a lot of buyers can’t get past those details - just as many home buyers obsess on immaterial factors like paint color and what furniture the sellers have (yes, I watch HGTV) . Conversely, a single great photo or compelling short video clip can generate a lot of interest.

[Backstage]

[QUOTE=smokygirl;5862766]
Everyone says that they just want the mud knocked off, and to see it moved and they can look past winter fuzzies… but the vast majority of them don’t really mean it.[/QUOTE]

Funnily enough - there is no one-size-fits-all solution. There are always going to be unreasonable buyers who can’t look through some fuzzies or an awkward stage. C’est la vie.

But lets all be a wee bit realistic…winter fuzzies aren’t really attractive. You still want to put your best foot forward and show off your youngstock and the winter fuzzies are not conducive to that, even where reasonable buyers are concerned. This is why it is REALLY REALLY REALLY important to do some planning. You don’t want to be taking pics for a buyer in the dead of winter - your youngsters will be at their least attractive. And if you don’t have an arena, you REALLY don’t want to be taking videos outdoors on frozen ground. Your lovely moving horse will look unsound and choppy.

The solution? Plan a nice fall afternoon photo/video shoot. Then, as you receive inquiries through the winter, you have recent and attractive photos/footage. You will, no doubt, have a buyer ask for more recent photos. Thats fine - grab a quick shot and apologize for their fuzziness. The bulk of the photos have will be relatively recent and attractive.

By the same token, plan a spring clean-up photo/video shoot. Then you will have new material for the spring/summer inquiries. I promise, this is not rocket science.

[Perfect_Pony]

@YankeeLawyer;5862775

Conversely, a single great photo or compelling short video clip can generate a lot of interest.

Agreed 100%. That clip of Simba showing in hand is just wow. Another friend of mine had a 3 year old for sale with no luck whatsoever. She took the mare to an inspection and got a great video and was inundated with requests.

I know I also have dreams about Mary Lou’s gorgeous filly from just this one picture, it’s enough that if I were shopping for a filly that age I’d be tempted to buy her sight unseen
http://www.homeagainfarm.com/images/romi_frnt_insp_trt.jpg

One cannot underestimate the power of a beautiful picture or video that captures the essence of a nice horse.

[Backstage]

[QUOTE=YankeeLawyer;5862775]
I completely disagree with the notion that it is effective to show videos or photos of a horse that is not clipped, mane pulled, etc. Not if you want to get competitive prices for the horses. I would rather have no media than mediocre media. The fact if the matter is a lot of buyers can’t get past those details - just as many home buyers obsess on immaterial factors like paint color and what furniture the sellers have (yes, I watch HGTV) . Conversely, a single great photo or compelling short video clip can generate a lot of interest.[/QUOTE]

I don’t necessarily disagree about the value of good photos/videos - they can be really helpful. If you were to really ask for my opinion, I would probably say…if you are asking 10K+ for your youngstock, spend the damn money and gets some good material. Its worth the investment.

But I disagree that NO MEDIA is a viable solution if you are trying to sell your stock outside of your immediate vicinity. That is not the world we live in anymore. People are not willing to travel much without something to go on. And decent is better than nothing. I know people who have traveled (and ultimately purchased) upwards of 6 hours off of video footage that showed a super mover or jumper - even though the video wasn’t superb. Ultimately, you need to get a warm body in the door. A

With respect to that one great photo/video clip, when you get a lot of interest based on one super photo (which I agree happens) - unless the buyer lives around the corner, you are going to need to back it up. I, and many other buyers, WILL NOT fly or drive long distance off the strength of ONE photo or short video clip that doesn’t show all the horse’s paces.

Edited to add - there is a thread right now with a poster asking about the value of the following horse:

5 year old warmblood mare, has sport horse papers, not super fancy but cute, decent mover, 16.2 HH. By an approved premium Oldenburg stallion (approved in multiple registries) who competed successfully in GP dressage and by Donnerhall. Mare is out of a sport horse mare with so-so pedigree on the dam side (canadian sport horse bloodlines) and by Wendland I. Mare has been sitting on the farm this entire time and is halter broke, good manners, etc., but has been nowhere, maiden mare and has not been started under saddle.

The numbers are being thrown around in the $2500-3k range. Now, many of the breeders on this forum are breeding horses that sound much nicer. But there are breeders out there with this sort of horse, and some of those breeders cannot get their stock sold. I feel that a some pictures, video and initiative could have gotten this horse sold years ago for a much better price. There is a market for this sort of horse - breeders need to tap it.

[system]

Thank you for sharing guys an very interesting topic

[smokygirl]

[QUOTE=Backstage;5862796]
Funnily enough - there is no one-size-fits-all solution. There are always going to be unreasonable buyers who can’t look through some fuzzies or an awkward stage. C’est la vie.

But lets all be a wee bit realistic…winter fuzzies aren’t really attractive. You still want to put your best foot forward and show off your youngstock and the winter fuzzies are not conducive to that, even where reasonable buyers are concerned. This is why it is REALLY REALLY REALLY important to do some planning. You don’t want to be taking pics for a buyer in the dead of winter - your youngsters will be at their least attractive. And if you don’t have an arena, you REALLY don’t want to be taking videos outdoors on frozen ground. Your lovely moving horse will look unsound and choppy.

The solution? Plan a nice fall afternoon photo/video shoot. Then, as you receive inquiries through the winter, you have recent and attractive photos/footage. You will, no doubt, have a buyer ask for more recent photos. Thats fine - grab a quick shot and apologize for their fuzziness. The bulk of the photos have will be relatively recent and attractive.

By the same token, plan a spring clean-up photo/video shoot. Then you will have new material for the spring/summer inquiries. I promise, this is not rocket science.[/QUOTE]

True, but all buyers want recent (i.e. someone was told 3 weeks ago was too old)… well I don’t know about you, but in MN, fall and spring are more than 3 weeks apart.

And YL, as a fellow HGTV enthusiast… Exactly. so many are sooo concerned about how the paint is, or the flowers in the yard… and you can just see the Real Estate agent wanting to pound them into the wall… lol.

But it’s true, better to have no pictures than bad pictures.

[Equilibrium]

Again, it was stated that when looking at youngstock, not started. If you feel you won’t get any interest in these types without spending 2 hours cleaning them up then I would venture to say people are more looking for that hunter on the line horse. If I was shown a well taken care of youngster with fuzz in an upload with correct gaits and an ability to jump. They have the pedigree and are all there. Then I was shown a glossy youngster with everything there but not such a great pedigree, the glossy photo session is not going to sway me. If those pics are what sway you then that is what you’re looking for. Personally I like a horse being a horse. It’s the utmost importance for a career in sport so I’m actually going to be swayed by breeders who treat their horses as such.

But even if that’s the way you choose to do your business then you just have to make plans to get it done and spend the money. Don’t whine and complain about it. Just get it done. And going to a show does not take me as long as what you people are saying. She is kept so her mane is done and tail are done regularly. In general she stays body clipped year round. So bath the night before or morning of depending on weather. I turn Abba out for an hour while I’m doing chores. Any clipping needs done in advance. So if you are getting ready to put your horses up for sale then get it all done before you go to sell. Don’t leave it until the last moment when people start wanting pics and an upload.

I’m starting to think the buyers you’re trying to attract are not the buyers who are going to Europe to shop. So I would quit worrying about them alltogether and just concentrate on the the buyers you are trying to attract. Do what it takes and get your horses sold.

Terri

[Backstage]

[QUOTE=smokygirl;5862848]
True, but all buyers want recent (i.e. someone was told 3 weeks ago was too old)… well I don’t know about you, but in MN, fall and spring are more than 3 weeks apart.

And YL, as a fellow HGTV enthusiast… Exactly. so many are sooo concerned about how the paint is, or the flowers in the yard… and you can just see the Real Estate agent wanting to pound them into the wall… lol.

But it’s true, better to have no pictures than bad pictures.[/QUOTE]

I think I’m close to done here.

You, as breeders, can decide how you want to run your businesses. If you feel you will sell more horses/make more money by making absolutely no arrangements to have photos and videos easily accessible to your potential customers, there is nothing I can do about it.

If you think responding to an inquiry asking for video with no video or MONTHS late is preferable to slightly out of date footage, that is your prerogative. Of course there will be always buyers asking for more. That is human nature, particularly in the horse world. All you can do is give yourself you best shot at dealing with it. And that includes saying no in some circumstances. No one here is saying that all buyers are always right. Far from it.

If I were to receive an inquiry in the dead of winter asking for more recent video footage, I would simply respond with a polity response along the lines of:

[i]Dear Buyer:

As previously indicated, the most recent video of Snookums is from November 15, 2011. As we knew winter would be approaching and the ground would be hard/icy, we wanted to have a video that would allow you to see his super mouvement. As you likely noticed, we made sure that you could see all three of his gaits in both directions. The ground is now frozen and Snookums is enjoying his winter vacation in all his hairy glory. As a result, we will not be able to prepare any new footage.

That said, we would be more than willing to provide additional information. Furthermore, if you have any specific concerns, we can try and assist you. For instance, if you are concerned that Snookums may not be sound - we can trot him up in hand on a hard and level surface.

Please let us know if we can be of any further assistance. If you would like, we can send you fresh footage in the spring, but obviously we will not be able to hold him for you and he may sell in the interim.

Thanks, [/i]

And finally, I would never advocate for POOR or BAD or UNFLATTERING pictures/videos. But the thing is…you can make a good video or take a good picture without spending a lot of money. Frankly, my iphone takes a pretty nice video/photo.

[Xanthoria]

So what I am reading is this:

Sellers: “We don’t want to spend hours cleaning up horses so we can sell them.”

Buyers: “Please don’t! We don’t care about a bit of hair or mud.”

Sellers: “You do care - I’m not even going to try to do as you ask, even though it’d take little time and potentially bring in money, because what you say it untrue and I feel I can get more money later on by doing more work… or not doing it…”

Buyers: “Please - we want to give you money! We want to buy American horses!”

Sellers: “Liars!”

Buyers: “Oh eff this… Where’s my passport…?”

:lol::lol::lol: :no: