Canter Lead "Issue"

[SpicyPRE]

Background
Older, upper level trained PRE (screen name is the horse in question) who decided earlier this year that he only has a left lead canter undersaddle. He will happily do a countercanter to the right undersaddle. In hand, lunge line and in long lines, he has no problem with the right lead, and very interesting is that if he picks up in the incorrect lead inhand can be queued for a flying change to the correct lead. Given that this horse is a bit older, I did do a thorough vet exam earlier this year and no unsoundness/physical reason was found. I have also used 2 different body workers who havent found any physical reason for the unwillingness to canter on the right lead. I have tried different saddles, shoes on and off behind and have continued with regular body work. Issue happens with both me and my trainer.

Any ideas? I really dont want to think that the right lead is gone forever…

[SuzieQNutter]

If you have ruled out pain then the only thing left is training.

We have one at our riding school that my instructor gave me to ride and I was told that if I couldn’t teach him to do right lead canter,he would send him off to a professional.

Unlike yours he was not an upper level horse.

The first ride I figured I was not the rider who could do it. NOTHING I tried worked.

As with you I could do a flying change to the right and he was happy to counter canter all day, otherwise.

It was so long ago I can’t really remember. I think we had to sharpen his canter aid so he went into the canter immediately not a stride later. The first time we got it was over a pole. After that when we did get it without the pole their was a burst of speed.

I do remember it had a lot to do with bend. I can’t remember if it was deep or shallow.

As he became stronger the burst of speed diminished. Reports of him doing right lead canter with pure beginners.

Life happened I stopped riding him.

I cannot tell you how disappointed I was when a year later I asked how his right lead canter is.

He doesn’t have one. Once you stopped riding him he wouldn’t do it again. We have decided he is perfect otherwise, so we don’t care.

I visited yesterday. When I saw him he was standing in a stable with his rump towards me. I called him and he recognised my voice and came to talk to me. It is about 3 years since I rode him.

I am open for another horse. Part of me wants to bring him home, but no. He is older now and I am at the part of my life where I would like to start with an upper level horse. SIGH. why can’t we own and ride them all!

[NaturallyHappy]

One trick we use when retraining racehorses is to post on the incorrect diagonal and ask from the trot when sitting. That way, if your timing is the problem, this exercise will fix it.

[Mander]

Since this horse is already pretty well trained it seems, and has no problem lunging to the right, could it be your own position?

I know someone who struggles and struggles and struggles to get horses to go to the right. She finally went to a physical therapist - come to find out her hips are significantly misaligned and the way she sits in the saddle is influencing the horse and blocking them to the right.

[OverandOnward]

If I were having this issue, I would look first to myself, my riding. I think I’m doing things correctly, but possibly something is slipping.

With a lead sometimes this could be how the rider is sitting, which seat bone, is the rider’s body straight or twisting, and so on. The rider may not be balancing properly for the lead and doesn’t realize it. Sometimes the rider is even starting to have some physical changes of their own that are affecting their seat, and hasn’t realized it.

The leg position, the weight in the stirrups, etc. Some horses are very sensitive to these changes and misses and take them literally.

I’d focus on myself and see if I couldn’t figure it out. If I weren’t making a difference within a couple of rides, I’d hire a very keen instructor to come in and take a look.

Also, having a really good pro ride the horse could yield a lot of information. Or another correct and insightful rider who is forthcoming about what they think.

And for whatever it is worth, if the rider is regularly riding more than one horse, sometimes another horse has the rider doing things a bit differently, and it’s unintentionally coming over into other rides,. If one of the other horses is needing certain things to get the lead then maybe the rider is inadvertently taking that on as a new habit. In my experience a green horse can have a rider over-compensating, and the rider starts doing that on other horses as well.

[steelerino]

I am gonna go with something physical older well trained horses don’t "forget’ how to pick up his right lead. He’s not picking it up because he is uncomfortable doing it with a rider. My now retired horse went from not wanting to pick up left lead canter with a rider to refusing to canter under saddle at all. I went through 3 vets to find the kissing spine. He never palpated back sore.

[Knights_Mom]

It’s your position most likely. Keep the inside hip forward and that leg at girth. If that doesn’t work there is an exercise to correct it.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

How long have you been riding the horse?

If he’s an old partner, have you had any physical changes?

Could the saddle be an issue?

[sascha]

@SpicyPRE

Older, upper level trained PRE (screen name is the horse in question) who decided earlier this year that he only has a left lead canter undersaddle.

Horses don’t “decide” something like that when it’s already well-established without very, very good reason. Tack (think teeth/bridle as well as saddle), your riding (are you naturally crooked, etc), and some sort of physical something or other (from ulcers to soft tissue to arthritis - and think neck, not just leg joints) can all be factors. Don’t leave a stone unturned in your quest. There is a reason - the hard part will be finding it. In the meantime, carry on with in-hand work, longeing, and long lining and keep your eyes (and ears) peeled for any slight hint he may give you as to where he may be uncomfortable. Yes, ears, I had one that kept his crap so well together that nobody could see the lameness, but I could hear it when I rode him because although the strides all appeared the same, his hind legs were landing just a tiny bit harder than they should have been. Sadly that one turned out to be a Wobbler.

[MissAriel]

I know you said you have tried other saddles, but have you given him some time to “reset” before trying the new saddle? If this has been brewing a while, he may be anticipating pain in the new saddle, and acting as if it hurts, even if the fit is better.

When my horse was having canter lead issues it took a second vet who was a dressage rider looking at the saddle on the horse to say it didn’t fit and a complete refit by a competent independent fitter, then a few months of basically starting over and rebuilding muscle until he stopped worrying about the pain from the poorly fit saddle. It took a few months to really recover.

Just our experience, but first vet was stumped (even after a full body bone scan ), body workers didn’t pick up anything , and numerous appointments with the saddle rep who sold me the brand new saddle then proceeded to charge me multiple times to “adjust” the fit only to give up and tell me to try a shim pad .

Listen to your horse and keep trying different professionals until one finds the problem. It’s happening with you and trainer, but not on the lunge, my money’s on the saddle.

[lenapesadie]

@SpicyPRE

Issue happens with both me and my trainer.

I’d keep looking for physical causes then. Unless you want to try a different trainer

[SpicyPRE]

This resonates with me. We have swapped saddles mid ride or just from ride to ride but no real time to “reset” I have recently received a new custom saddle that does not fit like I would prefer and need to have the fitter out and am thinking about using someone new. That might just be the ticket.

[SpicyPRE]

5 years. I immediately had the vet out as this was not happening prior to this spring

[Huntin_Pony]

Would you or your trainer be able to ride him bareback for a while?

[cayuse]

I’m betting the answer is yes, but did the vet check his teeth?

[SpicyPRE]

Yep. He is checked regularly.

[SpicyPRE]

Interesting thought…I am not sure my horse has ever been ridden bareback.

[MissAriel]

@SpicyPRE

This resonates with me. We have swapped saddles mid ride or just from ride to ride but no real time to “reset” I have recently received a new custom saddle that does not fit like I would prefer and need to have the fitter out and am thinking about using someone new. That might just be the ticket.

Good luck! I wasted a huge amount of time and put my poor horse through all that pain thinking it couldn’t be saddle fit, b/c we had it “professionally” fit regularly.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

It sounds like the saddle is the biggest change. Based on what you said, my guess would be that there may be pressure on his shoulder that’s blocking him. Although getting someone else to ride him might be helpful, it can also be unfortunately a bad combination of you and the saddle (it doesn’t mean you’re riding him incorrectly, just that the saddle isn’t setting the two of you up for success to get the lead). It might even unfortunately have “taught” him that lead is uncomfortable, however unconsciously, and now he’s resistant, even with different saddles and on the lunge.

Have you talked to a fitter about this specific issue?

[Night_Flight]

Have you tried lunging with the saddle on? And how about lunging with a rider on?