Cannot say enough about the eloquence of this letter. Should be required reading on Athletes for Equity in Sport Go Fund Me page.
#ByeDiane
8 Likes
http://www.telluridefarm.com/schedule.html
I do note sheâs giving a Pony Club clinic, PC has also adopted SS training. She sits on a lot of boards, according to her About page. Just noting, with disappointment.
7 Likes
and people think these big name trainers have no power over people, right?
10 Likes
Interesting to see that on the list of all the donations, Diane Carney donated a whopping $50 to the cause. Disappointing to see some of the names on that list.
6 Likes
I think we do have a culture problem in our sport, where many professionals, especially ones who have never worked outside of the horse industry and never taken any training outside of it, really donât understand how to conduct themselves professionally.
By this I mean that humans are a continuum. Some are going to behave badly or well no matter how they are socialized, but some learn âhow to be important/successful/establishedâ and how to conduct themselves from their mentors when they are young. And in some cases, people have learned that it is normal and appropriate to use drugs to win ribbons, to use illegal drugs themselves, to apply painful practices to horses, to yell at and belittle students, to search for sexual partners among the clientele, to lie about sales prices, to pad show-day bills, etc.
Out in the world we have HR departments and other trainings that are more transparent and more standardized. But a sole proprietor learning from a sole proprietor may never be exposed to any of those ideas, may not even be aware that the accounting they do is unethical or that hiring that cute girl as a working student with the hopes that sheâll have sex with you is not actually acceptable.
As such I donât think you have to look very hard to see that our industry is full of people who left their spouses for 19 year old students or assistants, sometimes once a decade. Or people who have been sexually involved with most of the people who worked for them one way or another. Or people who were not safe to be alone in the barn with, because they thought nothing of using their power in the situation to indulge themselves even if just a grope or kiss or verbal innuendo. It is my sense that many of these people simply had no idea that what they were doing was unwanted or harmful. Even though it was in fact very unwanted and very harmful - there are some cases where it was just that they were so wrapped up in themselves and maybe saw someone they admired acting this way that they were unable to parse someone struggling to get away or even saying no as - THAT PERSON REALLY WANTS YOU TO GO AWAY. Add in drugs or alcohol and/or a student who has been conditioned to always obey the coach and it is worse. That doesnât even get to the next step, where the dynamics of helping someone in distress can lead to weird and confused feelings towards someone who is a mentor or rescuer, which is why for example doctors and attorneys and teachers are not allowed to have sexual relationships with patients, clients, or students, even adult consensual ones. They are taught to understand those dynamics and to use their power to say no.
So I think, yes, our industry probably has dozens (maybe hundreds) of professionals who have made these kinds of mistakes. Those who havenât probably know and love and respect someone who has. And theyâre looking back at their own histories, and are frightened. Suddenly that assistant trainer or working student that they cornered in the barn has power over them. The ex-wife that he married at 18 and left for another young student when she was 28 has a new potential weapon. After all, itâs really uncomfortable when someone has power over you and might use it capriciously⊠amirite?
Some of us have had experiences like these, of this capricious power over our heads, all our lives, and some are learning about it now for the first time.
So I donât think theyâre really worried about a random person making a wholly false claim. After all, in theory they have this over their head all the time from law enforcement and all of society. I think theyâre worried about ex-partners and ex-clients making claims that are true.
(Just one example: in addition to the sexual misconduct charges against George Morris, there are hundreds of incidents that are on video and/or witnessed by hundreds of people of him violating SafeSport code about bullying and harassment, in addition to what he wrote in his book. Lots of people modeled their teaching after him, though few were so brazen about it.)
Thatâs a tough thing to live with, all of a sudden.
They are not going to be successful with their lobbying to stop SafeSport. The congress is bipartisan on this issue and thereâs no appetite to make things better for abusers in sport.
My best advice is to take this moment as a time to learn, and do better. To help others to do better. Most of the time, these long time accusations come forward because the victim is not only still hurting, but sees that person continuing to harm others. If youâre one of these people looking at your life and realizing that youâve participated in these damaging behaviors, do what you have to do to do better. Donât use the influence you have to cover for other people who have harmed others or to allow these harms to continue.
32 Likes
In all of these discussions on COTH, has anyone mentioned the connections between this Athletes for Equity dumpster fire nonsense that were also running in the horse insurance killings circle way back when (https://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/forum/discussion-forums/hunter-jumper/2744-paul-valliere/page23). Compare the names on the gofund me list and the ones in that thread from 2004. There are no coincidences. Sex, drugs, and money. Blackmail. Extortion. These folks have a lot at stake and A LOT to hide. It is a cesspool and it is going to take a massive upheaval to clear out the scum (years and years and years of immoral behavior).
29 Likes
Meh. Iâm sure sheâs given many hours of her time and incurred many expenses on her own dime. Of all the issues I have with that organization, thatâs not one. One hopes the people who contribute are also contributing money to all kinds of better causes.
1 Like
That is a very insightful post, poltroon.
I think you obliquely touch on a concern we keep hearing that is, in fact, true: some conduct that is prohibited by SafeSport was perfectly acceptable for a long time. (Iâm NOT talking about sexual misconduct involving a child). One example is a sexual relationship with a power inbalance. As the grandchild of a man who, at age 50, married his 18 year old secretary (as so many business executives of that era did), I can tell you my grandfather would be quite shocked if someone tried to levy a sanction on him decades later because there was a âpower inbalanceâ!
Iâve watched much of the SafeSport broadcast, and I think Michael Henry is absolutely terrific. He seems to have a deep, good faith commitment to eliminating sexual misconduct from sport and a nuanced understanding of the balancing act between protecting victims and fairness to the accused. Heâs an attorney well-versed in evidentiary issues, and it shows. I actually would place a high degree of trust in him. It is not lost on me, however, that a huge theme of his presentation was âTrust us!â SafeSport has tremendous âprosecutorial discretion,â and he is seeking to reassure us that it will be exercised judiciously.
5 Likes
You are wrong if you truly believe that such behavior was âperfectly acceptable.â When your grandfather, at age 50, married his 18 year old secretary, I promise you that a large segment of his social circle was appalled. Perhaps no one ever said anything to his face, but behind his back, there was absolutely a whole lot of âIsnât that awful?,â âThatâs disgraceful!,â and âHe should be ashamedâ going on among most of the women, along with quite a few raised eyebrows.
16 Likes
There is a big difference between conduct being the subject of gossip (âTsk, tsk, can you believe heâs going out with that young thing⊠what is he, having a mid-life crisis?!â) and conduct being understood to be a basis for the imposition of sanctions.
2 Likes
Your grandfather would never have faced sanctions beyond fraternization from his company and even then not really but people would talk. Adults with a power imbalance is light years away from an adult and minor.
I am glad you finally watched the presentation. When it was posted I immediately tagged you so you would know it was available. And yes we have to trust their process just like people trust you and any legal procedure you guide them through.
I think it speaks volumes that you do not trust others in your profession.
5 Likes
it mirrors what is happening right now to the elite pedophiles too, as the truth trickles out, there is mass panic over all the blackmail material they know exists.
10 Likes
Where did you get that from?! Was it the part where I noted that Michael Henry is a lawyer and commented that I DO trust him to a high degree?
Maybe I miss interpreted. I also didnât mean that as a comment towards you, more you work within the arbitration process a lot so it made me wonder why you speculate so much. My apologies.
I was just thinking about this and although the secretary executive fits the power inbalance scenario many of the marriages of the younger bride and older groom in the early to even mid nineteen hundreds did not. People married those available especially in rural areas or areas where many younger men were killed at war.
Applicable to safesport in that people use it as âthe times were differentâ argument while conveniently forgetting the power inbalance present in these violations. I find it weird that people canât grasp that simple thought. As a coach someone has power over you. One should not have a sexual relationship in those instances.
5 Likes
Many of the antis sit on boards. The culture is deeply embedded in the sport. It will take more than Safe Sport to clean up this disaster. People will have to stop patronizing abusers and their apologists.
15 Likes
All of this
7 Likes
Poltroon - Agree with you. The doors are blown open now. The H/J world will never be the same. It will take a long time to clean out the mold created by the âold guardâ but it will hopefully happen.
5 Likes
Thatâs not what you said. I was responding to your claim that such behavior was âperfectly acceptable.â It wasnât. It wasnât illegal, it had no sanctions attached to it, but it was not âperfectly acceptableâ in society.
5 Likes
Interesting turn of events for the ice skating coach; Safe Sport lost in arbitration.
"The lifetime suspension was reduced because the sexual misconduct dates back to the 1970s, when laws regarding those crimes were far less stringent than they are now.
" âWhen the allegations pre-date the U.S. Center for SafeSport, the Center has to use whatever rules and laws existed from the sport, the U.S. Olympic Committee or state and local government at the time,â SafeSport spokesman Dan Hill told USA TODAY Sports on Monday night."
