I was watching Charles Town last night, and there was a jockey switch while the horses were in the post parade! Is this common at the smaller tracks? Why would there be a jockey change in the middle of the post parade? I know I ask a lot of questions, but thanks for being patient with me and answering them. I really appreciate it.
Maybe the jockey who was initially on the horse refused to ride for some reason and they got a substitute? That would be my guess.
Usually when that happens the current jockey has refused to ride the horse, or has become unable to continue to ride the horse for some reason. For example, I have seen a rider that struck in the face and get a nosebleed when the horse flung its head. He was also dazed and unable to continue, and so was quickly replaced with a substitute rider.
Was there a change āduringā the post parade?? Or was the horse returned to the paddock for change of equip & riderā¦
If returned to the paddock, rider probably just didnāt want to ride the horse whether it was crazy or didnāt feel right to him/her ā but the vet seen no reason for scratch. DURING the parade ā have never seen & donāt think CT would do thatā¦
Iāve seen jockey changes take place after warm-up involving horses that I sure as heck wouldnāt want to rideā¦but never during the post parade itself.
It probably was after the warm up and post paradeā¦I really wasnāt paying attention until they said that the horse was returning to the paddock for a jockey switch, which sent off a red flag to me. They were on the track when the jockey switch was announced.
I suspected that maybe the horse was lame and the jockey did not want to ride even though the vet passed the horse, but I wanted to ask to make sure this does actually occur in some of those situations. Anyway, thanks!
There could have been numerous reasons the rider didnāt feel right on that horse ā but there is a vet that watches the horses warm up & if the rider states the horse feels āoffā, they usually watch the horse jog loose from the pony (if able) & make the decision that the trainer can try & find another rider or the horse is indeed sore & needs scratched. If the horse is just really āstupidā & the jockey feels uncomfortable, then the rider will tell one of the outriders that he just doesnāt want to ride & the horse will be returned to the paddock for a rider change. Every rider has their own tack. I didnāt think it happend āon trackā.
[QUOTE=tbracer65;3946170]
There could have been numerous reasons the rider didnāt feel right on that horse ā but there is a vet that watches the horses warm up & if the rider states the horse feels āoffā, they usually watch the horse jog loose from the pony (if able) & make the decision that the trainer can try & find another rider or the horse is indeed sore & needs scratched. If the horse is just really āstupidā & the jockey feels uncomfortable, then the rider will tell one of the outriders that he just doesnāt want to ride & the horse will be returned to the paddock for a rider change. Every rider has their own tack. I didnāt think it happend āon trackā.:)[/QUOTE]
It didnāt happen on the track. The horses were on the track when the jockey switch was announced as I said earlier. Then, the horse had to walk back to the paddock where there was a tack and jockey change. After about 4 minutes, the horse came back out to the track with the new rider and tack. Then, they raced, and the horse was out of the money.
For whatever reason, the jock didnāt want to ride the horse. Could have felt off or be acting stupid - they cannot force a jock to ride a horse. However, since the horse was returned for another rider and NOT scratched, the vet did not see enough reason to scratch the horse for lameness.
So, the horse returned to the paddock to be resaddled with the new jockās tack. I saw David Appleby pick up a mount like that one night at Penn National, gosh, 20 years ago, and donāt you know he came out of the gate just flying, & won easily. I bet the jock that took off felt really stupid. But that is a rare occurrence to have that happen (jock takes off, new jock wins on horse).
shady āreturn to paddock for rider changeā
Come on people, letās face it. The only ārealā reason they delay the start of the race and have the horse and rider go all the way back is to buy the track more time to take in bets. If you note the total pools from the time they announce this āreturn to the paddockā til they actually close the pools, it can total into the thousands of dollars. Every Charlestown official knows that each minute that passes buy allows bettors to scramble to the windows and get that last bet off.
Itās amazing how these bush tracks get away with this kind of stuff. Itās also quite not surprising how ābigā tracks like Saratoga or Belmont or Keeneland do not participate in this kind of activity. How many times have you seen a horse at Saratoga return to the paddock for a jockey change?
Whatās also amazing is that Travis Dunkelberger, who was replaced as the jockey that night on the horse returning to the paddock, somehow miraculously recuperated from his malady or illness and subsequently won the next race?!!!
How they let this happen is beyond meā¦but I guess, hey, someoneās got to feed those pursesā¦
Sorry to burst your bubble. If there is a lot of wagering, they will just circle the horses for a few more minutes. They do not go to the trouble of changing riders. This is common at cheaper tracks because the horses are generally a lot crazier and more often sore.
The jockey was not hurt. He didnāt feel comfortable with the way the horse was travelling, so he took off. Also the vets at some of these tracks are slow to scratch a horse. At the big tracks if a rider brings a horse to them, it is scratched no matter how it looks to be safe. The vet at our small track will not scratch a horse unless it is dead lame, so this happens fairly often. It is more fair to the public if the jockey takes off a horse he doesnāt feel comfortable than to break from the gates and pull it up.
Differing vetmed ethics?
So from your conclusions, it should be implied that vets at smaller tracks pass horses fit to run anyways, while vets at larger tracks will scratch regardless of whether or not the jockey feels fit to ride?
It doesnāt make sense. I am sure vets must operate on a code of medical ethics where if medical examination/check shows a horse unfit to run, then theyād scratch the horse regardless of who ridesā¦
The ONLY reason horses are returned to the paddock for an āequipment changeā or āchange of riderā is to prolong or delay the minutes to post. And hence last minute opinions/wagers/bets can be accounted for. Often times more than most, this can make or break a raceās profit margins for the trackā¦small tracks at thatā¦
[QUOTE=yipyappyyip;3964724]
The ONLY reason horses are returned to the paddock for an āequipment changeā or āchange of riderā is to prolong or delay the minutes to post. And hence last minute opinions/wagers/bets can be accounted for. Often times more than most, this can make or break a raceās profit margins for the trackā¦small tracks at thatā¦[/QUOTE]
You are entitled to your opinion but my opinion is you are so wrong its not even funny. I have had my own personal horses returned to the paddock for a change of equipment. You think I would have let the track make something like that up so they could make a few more dollars? Would they make more money or less money if there were three hours between races? Then everyone could bet right? It doesnāt work that way.
Iām wondering what other conspiracy theories Yipyap believes in? :lol:
[QUOTE=yipyappyyip;3964724]
The ONLY reason horses are returned to the paddock for an āequipment changeā or āchange of riderā is to prolong or delay the minutes to post. And hence last minute opinions/wagers/bets can be accounted for. Often times more than most, this can make or break a raceās profit margins for the trackā¦small tracks at thatā¦[/QUOTE]
:lol::lol::lol::lol:
Not exactly familiar with the racetrack, are ya?
When a horse IS scratched in the post parade, there will usually be a delay in the start to allow bettors to change their tickets, so that those who bet on the now scratched horse can bet on a different one. In certain instances they automatically switch the bets so that those who bet on the scratched horse will automatically get the post time favorite instead, but I dont know or dont recall exactly when that āswitchā applies - it might just be in the gimmicks, not sure. Hopefully someone else will know exactly when they delay for changing tickets and when they just give the bettors the post time favorite instead.
Notice - I am talking about a horse being scratched, not returned to the paddock for a rider/equipment change.
[QUOTE=yipyappyyip;3964724]
The ONLY reason horses are returned to the paddock for an āequipment changeā or āchange of riderā is to prolong or delay the minutes to post. And hence last minute opinions/wagers/bets can be accounted for. Often times more than most, this can make or break a raceās profit margins for the trackā¦small tracks at thatā¦[/QUOTE]
:rolleyes:
You need to get out more.
Where are Mulder and Skully when you need them? :lol:
[QUOTE=yipyappyyip;3946863]
Come on people, letās face it. The only ārealā reason they delay the start of the race and have the horse and rider go all the way back is to buy the track more time to take in bets. If you note the total pools from the time they announce this āreturn to the paddockā til they actually close the pools, it can total into the thousands of dollars. Every Charlestown official knows that each minute that passes buy allows bettors to scramble to the windows and get that last bet off.
Itās amazing how these bush tracks get away with this kind of stuff. Itās also quite not surprising how ābigā tracks like Saratoga or Belmont or Keeneland do not participate in this kind of activity. How many times have you seen a horse at Saratoga return to the paddock for a jockey change?
Whatās also amazing is that Travis Dunkelberger, who was replaced as the jockey that night on the horse returning to the paddock, somehow miraculously recuperated from his malady or illness and subsequently won the next race?!!!
How they let this happen is beyond meā¦but I guess, hey, someoneās got to feed those pursesā¦[/QUOTE]
Penn Gaming Inc. cares about the handle? Thatās news to me. :eek:
Familiar? I live thereā¦
[QUOTE=Jessi P;3965136]
:lol::lol::lol::lol:
Not exactly familiar with the racetrack, are ya?
When a horse IS scratched in the post parade, there will usually be a delay in the start to allow bettors to change their tickets, so that those who bet on the now scratched horse can bet on a different one. In certain instances they automatically switch the bets so that those who bet on the scratched horse will automatically get the post time favorite instead, but I dont know or dont recall exactly when that āswitchā applies - it might just be in the gimmicks, not sure. Hopefully someone else will know exactly when they delay for changing tickets and when they just give the bettors the post time favorite instead.
Notice - I am talking about a horse being scratched, not returned to the paddock for a rider/equipment change.[/QUOTE]
Um, yes, I am quite familiar actuallyā¦And the switch to the post-time favorite occurs when it is the last leg of a pick 4 wager. This also occurs when the horse in question is involved in a pick 6 wager.
When the wager pertains to the pick 3, there is often a consolation pick 3 payout. It depends on the state rules.
I rode races and trained horsesā¦ Iām really curious as to who you think gives the jockey the orders to return to the paddock (totally serious question here, please enlighten me)!
