Circling actually gives the horse the impression that he is moving YOUR feet, instead of you moving his. Barn employees at the place I boarded my horse when he was a 3 year old used to try the circling thing with my rearer, which is how his rearing habit became ingrained and dangerous. Then I moved him to a farm that had stallions, and he was handled correctly in the manner I described above by the stallion handlers. Mostly solved the problem.
From somebody who handles stallions on the daily for work, he needs to be led with a stallion shank. The SECOND he starts to get sassy, he needs a quick pop with the shank. I growl at my guys as well. Do NOT let him get in front of you, because then you’re screwed. I’ve used the backing method with great success, but to echo others, you HAVE to have forward momentum right away. You also have to know when to stop.
If you are not 110% confident in yourself and your handling abilities, don’t even bother trying, because it won’t be a good experience for either of you. Stallions can be intimidating and they typically know it.
Fun times. When I was learning to handle stallions, the horse in question was pretty well behaved, then began to rear and yank away once I got him to the paddock. As it turned out, someone else who was handling him was encouraging this behavior. BM had a fit. While correcting this behavior, the BM taught me how to prevent it as well.
He had me use a shank, keep the horse close, and when we got to the gate I was to put the horse’s nose right against it. I opened the gate and kept the nose right on the gate, then moved the horse in a sidepass/ turn on the forehand move so that he pivoted around the end of the gate. This way, his nose was always against the gate and he could not charge forward on me. The lateral movement gave him something to think about besides going up. Then, I could remove the shank and step away.
Number 1, the young person needs basic horse handling lessons.
How to apply a chain.
How to hold the lead.
Where to hold the lead, up short on right hand, free lead in left
Where to always place your body.-at the shoulder at all cost.
This is just basic, but it is amazing to me how many people have been handling horses for years and just never do it.
[QUOTE=merrygoround;7975010]
Number 1, the young person needs basic horse handling lessons.
How to apply a chain.
How to hold the lead.
Where to hold the lead, up short on right hand, free lead in left
Where to always place your body.-at the shoulder at all cost.
This is just basic, but it is amazing to me how many people have been handling horses for years and just never do it.[/QUOTE]
Good advice. I am a stickler for manners and if a well timed tug on the lead or shank doesn’t get the point across I am not afraid to take it up a notch with a whack on the chest with the free lead in my left hand.
[QUOTE=Angelico;7974798]
Hire better help. He’s not a problem for anyone else, that tells you everything you need to know.[/QUOTE]
Nah. Or at least, not yet.
Horses can test people, stallions especially so. Besides leading him in a chain (and at least gloves, maybe a helmet for the handler), the best that the New Help can do is keep the stallion well under her thumb. If he so much as looks away from her, she ought to remind him that she is his biggest problem, his Alpha and Omega, and he ought to pay attention.
So many “big mistake” behaviors like rearing have smaller precedents. They are there if you look for them. With a stallion especially, where you need a combination of power and tact, the handler needs to pay strict attention and to insist on more obedience that you would from an easier horse. Nip any cheekiness from a rearing stallion in the bud… well before he even thinks his front feet could leave the ground. When he’s good, the handler gives him a softer treatment.
Frankly, I’m bumming on this thread. Between the pellet gun/fired at the balls advice and everyone talking about equipment and behaviors like backing up, No One has yet talked about the thought process of the horse.
I care because too many people are afraid of stallions. They bring “weaponry” and defensiveness. Too often, they are kept alone and are frustrated. If folks would just give these Grown Men the respect-- care and thoughtfulness-- they demand, I think they could figure out how to handle them safely and fairly.
Actually, MVP, I talked about keeping the horse’s attention in my very first post. Goes hand in hand with holding the shank closer to the horse’s face so you have more control over his head.
If the stallion is going to behave like this, the girl shouldn’t be handling him. Not good for his training and not fair to her.
One thing I’ll add to the above is to not try to pull on a horse that is going up or discipline them while they are up. They are more likely to pull against you and go over, which is dangerous for everyone. I’ve seen people (usually inexperienced men) who think they can hold the horse down or pull the horse down. You cannot. They get slack when they go up (keeping the shank away from them getting a foot over it if you can) and an arse kicking when their feet come back down (assuming you couldn’t mitigate them going up in the first place).
Example of a handler staying out of the horse’s way when they go up: http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/videos/13454/bc-2014-california-chrome-feisty-in-paddock
[QUOTE=jetsmom;7974935]
I think they were telling a fish tale. I mean seriously…think about the logistics of what you are saying…You would have to carry a bb gun with you when turning out a horse that presumably is being fractious. Then you would have to be able to (while still holing lead rope) take aim when they go up, and move into a position for a clear shot at an object about 8" in size. Then you would have to fire at a moving target.
The chance of successfully doing that is slim to nil. I think the person telling you that is making it up.[/QUOTE]
I doubt it. I’ve seen them shoot, and they are good. :lol:
Not every rider at the Olympics shoots like a stormtrooper
In my experienced, the BO should not be letting anyone other than one who is proficient in stallion handling handle her stallion.
I’ve had stallions (still do) for 20+ years. All of quite different personalities. Regardless, they were expected to behave in human hands. That said, I would never put a new person that has no proficient handling experience in that situation. Ever.
Shame on the stallion owner. :no: Most experienced stallion owners would never put a new person with a stallion without major training in that venue.
BTW, when the daylight gets a big increase between now and though Feb, even the nicest, sweetest stallion can get a hormone surge and “act out” as the “sap” starts to flow. :lol: Nothing to be taken personally, that’s just the way it is.
Why do you think the stallion tests are done in November… libido drops as the light goes away. It’s just nature.
The time to turn a stallion over for handling in and out for a greenie is the fall through. December. Not now. I feel sorry for the new person.
Boo. Hiss. To the SO.
[QUOTE=jetsmom;7974935]
I think they were telling a fish tale. I mean seriously…think about the logistics of what you are saying…You would have to carry a bb gun with you when turning out a horse that presumably is being fractious. Then you would have to be able to (while still holing lead rope) take aim when they go up, and move into a position for a clear shot at an object about 8" in size. Then you would have to fire at a moving target.
The chance of successfully doing that is slim to nil. I think the person telling you that is making it up.[/QUOTE]
I’m sure that this is a simple task for someone who went to the Olympics.:lol:
I have worked at barns with stallions. The same person handled them daily. Why would a new girl be near a stallion in the first place?
I had a student take her stallion tom an indoor for a winter. She was at the barn twice a day,took care of his feeding and stall cleaning, and all handling. He had a sweet temperament and she didn’t want him learning any bad manners from frequently clueless barn staff.
[QUOTE=tewhann;7974759]
WTF?? OK, I’m going to be radical here and suggest that you not shoot the horse for bad behavior.
The problem in this case isn’t the horse, but a person who lacks the skills to handle all types of horses. She needs to get more confidence on other, quiet horses before she handles a stallion.[/QUOTE]
You’ve never had a horse act up on you when leading? Seriously?
Why don’t people get their panties unwadding and go have a drink or go ride or something. It’s crazy how many people get so upset at some of these threads. :lol:
[QUOTE=SnicklefritzG;7975535]
Why don’t people get their panties unwadding and go have a drink or go ride or something. It’s crazy how many people get so upset at some of these threads. :lol:[/QUOTE]
Well, nothing calms people down like a bb in the genitals!
Never handled a stallion, likely never will.
I had a horse who never reared in hand unless you put a chain around his nose band. He was a gentlemen in all aspects except if you used a chain.
I’m guessing chains are introduced to most stallions early on and are part of everyday tack.
Chains over the nose are like choke chains on dogs: benign when all is well, a control method when things get edgy. Not cruel by any means-horses are far stronger than we are and sometimes we need the upper hand. Any horse can become silly on occasion, even the sweetest school horse so naturally we all need to be paying attention when we are handling them.
I also find that a good growl can get a stallion’s attention.
[QUOTE=SnicklefritzG;7974717]
Get a pellet gun and ping him in the nuts if he does that again. I know one guy who did that to a horse who used to rear when you went in the stallion’s stall. It only took one time to cure the horse of that bad behavior.[/QUOTE]
Awesome on the stupidity scale.
Just one more thing to add - wear gloves. If this horse managed to pull the lead out of her hand (even though he was in the paddock) and get away, you can bet he’s going to try that one again!
