Good point. I would love to take some lessons on a dressage schoolmaster but don’t know of anywhere that has any available for lessons. If one can’t take lessons and get their feet wet in the discipline how do they know they want to drop decent money on their own dressage horse? Or even buy a prospect with the intention of taking consistent lessons to bring both horse and rider along? It also seems like one of those disciplines where if you aren’t intending to show and aren’t riding a “nice” horse, you aren’t going to get a trainer to commit to bringing you along, at least that has been my experience.
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The Jane Austen is strong in this sentence! 
Speaking of entry points, anyone remember Groupon? My barn at the time made the mistake of getting on the Groupon bandwagon. Every Saturday and Sunday afternoon, the barn would be invaded by a dozen or so absolute beginners, who had paid maybe $50 for four lessons. It’s impossible to teach that many total newbs, not to mention the strain it put on the schoolhorses. So they roped all available grooms and barn rats, and essentially did a 45 minute lead line class. They took up all the space in the two arenas, making it impossible for boarders to ride during that time.
Out of that grand waste of time, money, and school horses, they got maybe two new clients.
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Ha! I plead guilty to having Jane on the Brain at all times!
I have no right to be sniffy about anything, but I admit when a mom asked me if barns did Groupons so she could get some cute photos of her kid on a horse (with no intention of riding regularly) for social media, I was kind of appalled.
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There might be something to that, though. The first picture of me on an actual equine (not a hobby horse) was taken in front of our house on a busy boulevard. A cowboy with an adorable paint pony and a good camera came door to door selling the opportunity to dress your munchkin up in chaps and a cowboy hat and get a picture taken on the back of that pony. It was thrilling to me and remains my favorite picture of me as a child. I probably would have inherited the horse gene from my father anyway, but it helped that I had that reminder around the horse of a joyful moment.
So as a service barns could offer to get kids interested, maybe not such a bad idea.
I’m copyrighting JaneBrain!
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I’m not surprised. If that was my first experience on horseback, I would not want to return to that stable.
Groupon itself wasn’t the culprit here - poor planning and pricing was. It could have been structured for a reasonable discount that still allowed for a narrow profit for an intro riding package and then scheduled appropriately to accommodate horse and trainer time tables. Why tell a dozen absolute beginners to arrive for a lesson time if not prepared for it?
I’ve done event-based Groupons, and after you buy the Groupon and are given instructions to call the service provider and make an appointment. You don’t just show up at random time waving your printed discount around. Similarly, the provider can limit the amount of Groupons that are given, so whoever planned this at your barn just did a poor job of utilizing this marketing tool.
I know of a small, coastal barn with very basic facilities and tiny staff that used Groupon to their advantage by offering $100 for a 2 hour intro to horsemanship/ beginner lesson. IICR, they used the first 1/2 hour for grooming, teaching about horses, tack etc, then a hour lesson +mini trail ride ended with snacks or a light lunch. It was super popular, and got numerous adult clients for their riding school where the prices were understandably much higher.
Internet-based promotions are not the cure for everything, but with business savvy, they can work.
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This sounds like a fantastic idea! What a great way to get people around horses in a safe, low-key way. I could see this being a fun activity to do for a non-horsey family to entertain out of town friends/family, or even in tourist areas as an alternative to your typical nose-to-tail trail rides.
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By advertising the horsemanship/ education concept in addition to riding, I would suspect that it weeded out the yahoos who just wanted to “run” on the trails. This barn was in a touristy area on the coast so it was a good area to do something like this.
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I’m a born horse nut from a lower/mid middle-class with un-horsey, non supportive family. Like many of you in a similar situation, I’d beg for rides to the nearest barn, which happened to be a small Arabian breeding operation just to shovel frozen manure during the midwestern winter just to be around horses. At the age of 13, I got in trouble for riding my bike by myself 8 miles along the highway to get to the barn. I wanted to ride, but I knew being in “a program” was never an option for me (hell I didnt even know lesson programs existed). This was back in the 90s and my only resource was looking in the yellow pages and cold-calling barns asking if I could clean stalls or tack in exchange for riding. I was jealous of kids in 4H and wanted to join, but my mom would not let me since the meetings were too far away (in her words).
So, I understand the plight of the outsider or newbie who is interested in horses but has a hard time navigating the quagmire of finding a reputable place to learn. My teenage-self stumbled into some real crappy lessons and shady barns that would have turned a less determined person off of horses. What kept me going was that in-the-bone horse bug, and being lucky enough to find some kind hearted people who saw that I was a good kid with lots of try but no opportunities.
I’m not talking about a generous well-heeled sponsor here - I’m talking about a boarder who kindly offered the use of her horse when I outgrew the lesson horse, or the trainer who let me do chores on the weekend for discounted lessons even when he didn’t really need the help. The woman who offered me a wonderful 1/4 lease on her horse not because she needed the money, but because the horse needed a job and I wanted to ride.
In short, I think the key to engaging new riders (of all ages, not just kids) is just to be welcoming. Everyone needs a friend or mentor. I’m not saying to say “yes!” and let everyone who asks to ride your horse - but maybe take that person who is curious about horses to your barn and show them around. Give them the number of a decent lesson barn. Take them with you to a show as a spectator. Show them our crazy, passionate insular little world.
Its only getting harder and harder to be around horses. As many have pointed out, barns are disappearing. For those of us who live in the suburbs (which I would dare say is the majority of AA riders) we have to drive further and pay more for board. We all have stories of barns selling and turning into housing developments or shopping complexes. There are no local riding clubs for each town like there is in Europe.
For those of us who own, we know how precious our horse time is. We know how hard we have to work at our day jobs to afford the privilege of going out to the barn and finally being able to decompress and do what we love. Most of us sacrifice a lot to have that horse and we are very aware of costs, accidents and insurance. Maybe we hold on to our horses a little tighter now than a few decades ago because of those increase costs of horse-keeping and litigious world… But I don’t think we can put the burden of welcoming new riders solely on the “up down” “newbie” teachers.
I wonder how many lifelong riders here have gotten some lucky breaks from kind people who saw someone with desire and gave them an opportunity, even a small or temporary one.
That’s not to say that pros can’t step up their game. As many upthread have pointed out - horse businesses are pretty notorious for being poorly run, or having less than stellar communication. It can be really hard to get your toe in the door and lots of areas just don’t have many options. I’ve always said a trainer could rake in cash if they decided to specialize in teaching working adult ammies who just want to improve themselves and their not-so-perfect horses. There is a big market for that (at least where I am ) of people who don’t fit in big lesson/ show barns and who only have mid-sized wallets but want to invest in their equine education.
Like many things -It boils down to money. Horses are expensive, keeping a school string is very expensive and many trainers are narrow specialists. If you don’t fit in their mould of an ideal client, you wont fit in and there is not a ‘pot for every lid.’ The middle is getting priced out, so there are fewer horses available to growing riders.
This varies wildly by region so YMMV.
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in the early 1990s I was on a US Department of Agriculture committee that recommended changes to the rules of who owned the horse. We recommended to allow a leased horse for a 4H-er (This was an oversight committee as each state has is own governance)
Before I was told the stock had to owned by the 4H member or their family which greatly limited who could show a horse in 4H competitions.
This committee was formed to come up with ideas to make 4H more accessible to kids from the inner-city. We rewrote some of the 4H equine sections to be modeled after the American Morgan Horse Youth program (I was a regional youth direct for the AMHA back then)
We also developed the Model Horse program to allow the kids who did not have a horse or could lease a horse the opportunity to Show a horse. This was specifically aimed at the inner city children.
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That was our barn’s experience too @Bristol_Bay. Same with pony parties. It’s a quick short term way to make a bit of $ if you have the horses and staff, but not an effective growth opportunity for your business … maybe unless that’s literally all you do? @BatCoach I love the example you gave of how it can be made to work with incorporating Horsemanship so you don’t get people expecting a yahoo experience.
I do have a trainer friend who does birthday parties with her mini horses on her days off. Not sure how cost effective that is for her.
@Arelle so the entry point to reining is Western Horsemanship. If you look at the IHSA college circuit, the huntseat equivalent to reining is the 3’6 Maclay Equitation classes. That’s not an entry level point. Does that make sense? Although I get what you’re saying about the limited availability to try new / different equestrian disciplines unless you know somebody who can bring you into that discipline… although to be honest, over the years I’ve always just brought along my boots & helmet especially while traveling and just boldly asked to learn more when the opportunity arose. I always downplayed my skills and although I’m a hunter jumper gal at heart I’ve had the opportunity to ride an FEI dressage horse while on vacation in another country, drove a Belgian team in Colorado, gone fox hunting in upstate New York, and fell into chasing and sorting cows because a cowboy friend needed the help. If there’s a will there’s a way. One of the best books I ever read as a horse crazy kid with parents who refused to support horses financially after I turned 14 was called The Horseless Rider, not sure if it’s still in print
As for people new to the sport (which I think is related but a different topic than existing riders wanting to try different disciplines), the TV Show Yellowstone is bringing newbies flocking to western riding in droves… exposure and visibility of horses and equestrian sports to the public are key I think.
This is an interesting conversation, thanks for starting it.
Edits: so many typos.
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Do you think admissions committees really want “well-rounded” at the expense of a kid who has dedicated himself/herself to one thing?
I got into a brand name university a long time ago and, for a quirky reason, I got to see the notes that the admissions committee made on my application. I think that my day was in-between the “just go to school, you do you and apply as you are” era and whatever trend today produced celebrity parents photoshopping their kid’s face onto another athlete’s body and bribing coaches for a leg up in the admissions process.
I will say that with the two sports that I did (neither of which was going to earn me a scholarship), they didn’t know how to evaluate the level of winning I did in either (i.e. what did it take to be good at a regional or state level in either sport?). But they did want to see some sign of success.
At the time, I was a horseless barn rat who had built a small horse exercising business. The application asked if we had a job. They also asked what I did with my earnings. I said I bought more riding equipment. The admissions committee did try to make room for evaluation the merits of someone who, say, didn’t do sports and volunteering and science fairs because they were earning money that, perhaps, went to help pay family bills.
And when I showed up there in the fall, I did rub shoulders with people who much richer that I was, but also people who came from much less.
The notes on others’ applications sometimes rewarded the well-rounded person (and let’s be clear: You had to pass muster academically first), but not always. And some of these athletes were labeled “filler” in the blunt terminology of notes that were never meant to be seen by the public. That terms meant they would help round out intramural teams or be middling members of varsity teams.
I taught at the university level, at good colleges and some with name recognition. I’d take a student who had that “desire” the OP mentions, all day long. It’s not the well-rounded person (and the one who values that) who finds, say, a lab to work in or decides to write the optional Honors Thesis that fills up their senior year.
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I think you are a bit wrong. I don’t think folks think they can’t “get anywhere” without a half-million dollar horse. But they are quite right that they can’t get to those levels you talk about-- turning a 3’ hunter into a 3’6" hunter, or making up a nice green horse (which you have to have the money to buy, no matter how green) or getting seen by a pro who has a sales business-- without substantial backing.
And if you or your parents know you are part of the middle class, then your #1 day job is to get a college education. That was true for me and I was just one of those whacko kids who was wiling to sleep less and work more to keep the day job AND spend the rest of my time being a barn rat. But giving up the get-into-college day job was not an option for me. And, I think it’ even less of an option for a wider swath of kids today. They really are poorer, while horsing is even more expensive today than it was in the last bit of the 20th century when I was trying to do this.
I did learn to do those things you said, and I didn’t own my first horse until I bought an OTTB when I was in college. But, before, say, my 20th birthday, I never had access to the level of teaching and showing that would have made me useful for a pro who had these better horses or someone who was going to sell me the diamond-in-the-rough-but-has-the-right-stuff baby horse.
I bred one for myself just out of college who was nicer than anything I rode as a kid. And I did almost all of the riding and training on him. I purposely bred and trained him to be very amateur-friendly. But he was not going to be a world-beater, because I had never seen that level of quality.
Today, I buy better. Even though I’m old, I’m happy to start riding one that has 30 or 60 days on it. But it took be decades or riding and several of those spent owning (and paying) for horses, plus life-style trade-offs about what job I have and where I live to be able to do this.
IMO, riding at the level you describe is not accessible by hard work alone, even if you should happen to live in some high-quality horse mecca.
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Yes, but the skills it takes to ride these lesson horses; the ones it takes to ride “any and all” as I did as the hungry barn rat as a kid; the ones it takes to help a horse learn to jump a 3’6" course (where he finally has to find a distance and leap as opposed to jump out of stride); and the ones it takes to make a sales horse look like the lead change is easy as opposed to very green… those are all really different skills. And the one involving the show horse or smoothing around on the sales horse do not come from the same places or tax-bracket as the ones you get in a lesson barn or riding colts.
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This isn’t a direct answer to your question, but it adds a different aspect regarding college admissions…
After graduating from college, I worked in the admissions department for a while. Since I was no longer a student, the admissions staff was a little less guarded re: sharing their opinions with me. I don’t remember the exact words, but I will tell you that they didn’t exactly look favorably upon “horse girls,” as they put it. I didn’t ask why, because I was frankly young, offended, and insecure. But suffice to say there may be some stereotypes against us in the non-horsey world.
I’d be curious if others have either heard this, experienced it, or have any insight.
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When I went to visit Harvard and get the tour plus yada-yada from some admissions officer there, I asked them about something about how they evaluated success in sports. My two cost wildly different amounts of money to be any good at.
She said “horse people aren’t happy here” and moved right the f#ck on. I don’t know if I would have been useful to Harvard, but insofar as I instead matriculated at Harvard of the West and then become an academic, I think she missed my point and Radcliffe missed out on a potential applicant who actually would have come there for, yanno, some actual scholarly reasons. Too few people realize the similarities between the work ethic and pedagogy it takes to teach horses and undergraduates.
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I got directly told by multiple college admissions counselors (this would be 12+ years ago) to talk about anything else but my riding/my horse when I was applying and interviewing at schools (including ivies), with the exception of a couple equestrian focused schools like Sweet Briar College. I didn’t probe too far, but I got told there was a really bad stigma with equestrian young ladies having a lot of money and attitude while lacking work ethic.
I saw the same thing turn up when we were interviewing for interns a few years ago at a previous company. Manager would see that sport experience and immediately have a preformed opinion.
Now, I think we all know this is a blanket statement and not true–there is a tremendous amount of good that comes from the barn and riding–but like, that is the perception we’re up against.
I don’t think the crazy amount of equestrian influencers are helping anything either apart from perpetuating that stereotype of lux life/ride the ponies/pass the hard work off to someone else. Hacking away at ice buckets for two hours in the dead of winter or re-rolling 40+ standing bandages at 6AM doesn’t make good TikTok content, I’m aware–but boy would it be nice to actually see that reality peeled back and more in the open for everyone to understand what typical horse ownership looks like.
p.s. this is an interesting discussion.
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Right, but if someone treats the ice rink like a doll or a rental car or an Airnb, that asset still has value and isn’t sentient such that there’s any ethical weight to letting it get run down.
This is not true for the school horse.
I’m surprised to learn that some school horses work twice a day. I’m also surprised that no one has yet acknowledge that they can’t/shouldn’t work as many days a week as the barn is open.
If I were the BO or trainer running a lesson program, I too, would be pissy about the customers who treated my horses like Dixie cups. Today, that is the common business model and it is economically rational to rent- rather than buy access to high-end assets. You can’t blame the customers for mistaking what you offer as disposable rentals. But to the barn owner who has to care for these horses (and either pension them out or euthanize them), there’s also a legit basis for bitching about the lack of commitment from newbie riding clients.
And as a horse owner, I’m surprised at the lesson barns who advertise for a free lease lesson horse. I have leased a not-showing-sound school master to a trusted pro for this, and for a while. But she was up front about having no money for his maintenance in her budget so when he needed that we were done. Given how much harder lesson horses work today, I wouldn’t send a horse-- and an asset I made/paid for-- into that job assignment. I wouldn’t for both economic reasons and for ethical ones. If they aren’t willing to retire their horse for euthanize him, either am I.
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[quote=“RND, post:106, topic:768465, full:true”]\
This shaming of people for spending whatever limited amount of time they have to be around horses actually riding them instead of cleaning stalls and doing night check is probably why people think that horse people are snobs and go find something else to do with their time.
[/quote]
Let me be the first do double-down on shaming someone who thinks they can treat a horse like a rental car. If they don’t think the animal’s well-being matters then they should go elsewhere. Because here’s the thing: No one who doesn’t feel compelled to care about the animal isn’t going to be worth keeping in the industry anyway. I don’t care if they pay an expert to do care for their animal. But they should care that there is a standard of care. Where would they learn that if we don’t hold them to a high ethical standard?
IMO, high-end hunter pros have been digging a bit of a whole for themselves for the last 30 years or so by replacing barn rats or very involved juniors with professional grooms. It worked well for barn efficiency and their bottom line. It helped them keep the kids of parents who, since the 1980s, started to think of their kids are really cool investments and were willing to shower lots of time, money and effort into making them shine. Those were/are the kids who do things with an eye to a college-worthy résumé. Those are the kids who fill up the specialized, private club sports teams. Those are the kids whose time is too scheduled to allow for lots of time spent at the barn learning a little bit of everything and riding all sorts of horses.
And the pros who grew up this way and had “industrialized” their operations so that their clients weren’t getting what they got knew they were digging this hole; sometimes they wrote hand-wringing articles about it. But they didn’t stop that. They now complain about clients who don’t know enough to know how unrealistic their expectations are for their horses.
I really don’t think that creating accessibility at the expense of horsemanship is worth doing.
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I’ve been riding a horse who, since October, has been used in lessons 2x/per day. I thought this was going to be an issue for this particular horse (who is normally on the annoyed side about having to go to work). He does up/down lessons earlier in the afternoon and seems to have found his happy place packing children around. When I get on for a 2’6" lesson he’s now more willing to move forward and has a significantly better attitude about work. He’s also a lot more fit, which is likely contributing to the improvement in his demeanor. This horse used to be the one in the barn that nobody wanted to ride because he was so lazy. Now everyone seems to be fighting over who gets to ride him. So, for some horses, going to work for a lesson and a half (since up/downs don’t require the same effort as 2’-2’6" lessons) may not be a bad thing. There’s another little mare who is also thriving on the two-a-day lessons with the same mix. It’s not for all horses, but for some it may be a benefit. Both of these horses seems to really love the up/down job, probably because they get to go to the ring and pretty much do their own thing.
I have heard of barns who double up their 2’+ horses who are used in hour-long lessons, and I have the same issues you have with that. It’s too much. They aren’t machines.
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In my area, if they didn’t work twice a day the owner of said school horses would be upside down dollar wise. This is, imo, why things like pony parties, guided trail rides, beginner camps and beginner lessons are such a vital part of local barn economics. It provides a place for school horses to earn dollars without pounding their legs off. This also plays into why “higher level” school horses aren’t a financially viable option for a lot of barns. The higher level horse is more expensive to purchase or produce and less likely to be suitable for packing tourists on a walk on the beach.
I hardly think a second ride of mostly walking is going to harm the average horse.
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