Degenerative disc disease, facet arthritis, labral tears and hip and spine arthritis

Thank you and I’m always happy to discuss ideas even if the thread wanders a little!! It just might be something that someone reads and gives them a nudge to create something new!

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Please forgive me if I step on some toes. I know that many of you are dedicated horseback riders who want to ride their horses RIGHT.

I think that a doing a lot of the sitting trot damages the spines of both human and horse. I also think that it damages the Central Nervous System of the rider.

With every stride of the “proper” sitting trot the human brain is subject to micro-concussions as it more or less gently bounces against the skull bones. The rider’s spine is also concussed and twisted as the rider’s seat follows the horse’s back.

With my Multiple Sclerosis and after several concussions I am now very protective of my brain, my spinal cord and my spine. My limit on a horse whose back is relaxed, accepting and swinging is no 6 strides. On less perfect horses it is 2 or 3 strides. At most I do it 2x during a 30 minute ride, and I do it rarely it is my goal to NEVER have to do it. I use it to explain something to the horse about its back, to encourage the horse’s back to come up under my seat, to learn that it is safe for the horse to relax his back, and to encourage swinging. I use it to prove to the horse that if I DO have to sit down temporarily he will not have to worry about me making his back hurt.

Thereafter I sit maybe the last 3 strides in our downward transition to the walk or halt.

Back when my spinal column was still bothering me from my car wreck I ended up wearing the BOT back brace every day for several years. By protecting my spinal column by not doing much sitting trot after a few years of wearing this brace I took it off and use it just maybe 2-3 times a YEAR.

If you have back problems reconsider doing the sitting trot. When you stop it your spinal column, spinal cord and brain will have a chance to HEAL. Tincture of time.

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I have DDD in my cervical and thoracic spine as well and recently some pinging in my lower back. We are in the early stages of rehabbing through laminitis so I am not currently riding. Im curious to see how I feel when we are able to start riding again. I have been doing Riders Pilates Club since March and that has been absolutely excellent for my issues and getting rebalanced.

Jackie I agree with you on the sitting trot. I can post all day but I don’t have much sitting in me these days. Often times, my lower back is also much more comfortable at the canter in two point.

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That is correct. However getting the pain under control enabled me to work on improving my biomechanics and strength.

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Got it - I shouldn’t have made it sound like I was down on it, just that I wanted to make sure I understood which aspect of the issue it tackled. There are so many!!

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Thanks Jackie and no stepped toes on here. I haven’t been able to do a true sitting trot in years. Maybe a jog on a very smooth jogging horse.

But even that might be too much for me now. I haven’t ridden in at least a month, so we shall see how it goes.

You are in my boat. Horse down for the count, us down for the count. I’ve done a few rider fitness programs (DressurFit and the other Australian lady one - is it just Rider Fitness?) and they were both worthwhile.

Hopefully everyone finds a pain free solution soon!

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Jingles to all!!

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For me…I’m down for the count. Horse is perfectly sound and wants to work :angry:. My body woes started 11 years ago (I am currently 68). They are still going (all different joints/areas). Yes, getting older sucks. I am to the point where I am afraid to exercise :stuck_out_tongue:…afraid of what will go out next. Oh well, have to keep going. Some day I will be bionic :joy:. One foot in front of the other, even if I have to use a cane. Dr’s appointment this month to see if I need a hip replacement…I also have 2 torn tendons in that hip so have no idea what complication that throws in.

I can still manage to mount my horse and grit my teeth until my hip stretches out and will continue to do so. My horses used to be self care board but I decided to do feed board or full board. My back was bad and it helped a lot to quit abusing it so badly by stacking and wrestling with hay. Hard to do if you have your own place…I never have had my own.

Jingles you can find some relief. I have already had one hip replaced. It was straight forward and I was back on my horse in 4 1/2 weeks…just doing walky pony rides but it wasn’t long until I was back to regular riding. I have also has a microdiscectomy on L4/5 and so far that has been very successful. For sure try non-surgical options but sometimes, surgery is the answer. Good luck.

Susan

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Being sound at the same as your is sometimes a challenge!

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I will say that re-hiring my part time helper to do stalls has improved things tremendously. I can now actually get out of bed and touch the floor without feeling like things are just going to fall off.

I haven’t tried going for our long walks (that we normally do) post dx because I wanted to get in front of the neurosurgeon before we did, but even just stopping lifting heavy things has helped a ton.

Next I’ll try working on the hips while my back is NOT in pain to see if I can improve ROM.

I hope that you continue to heal and get to pain free too! <3

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Went to PT eval yesterday with a new PT. She did a weird routine to realign my public symphysis (I didn’t know that was possible) and while it didn’t help my back, my gait was improved some.

However, I was left very sore (she did a lot of pushing on my tailbone) and had a lot of trouble sleeping, which had gone away after I had calmed down on the cleaning of stalls etc. I’m not sure exactly what that means.

She also said I was very very strong, and that part of the issue with my hips is likely in part because of just how strong my legs are and some parts of my core. Which makes sense, I rode hunters for many years and my leg was always super tight. I’ve been trying to work the opposing muscles, but in truth, that would be really hard to do while continuing to ride as much as I always have because my inner legs just continue to get stronger and more out of balance. The arthritis of course is something she can’t fix, but if I can back off the riding for awhile while we work to rebalance things that might help that a bit. Here is hoping.

My other appointments for my back aren’t until the week after next, so I’m still waiting there. The issue is that the orthopedic doctors in this system don’t treat backs, and the spine doctors (neurosurgeons) don’t treat hips. I strongly feel that my two problems are related, due to where they are, but those are the restrictions in the system. It is telling that it has taken me awhile to get to the back pain clinic - usually in this town appointments are pretty immediate, but back pain is such a common beast. I guess it’s the perils of walking bipedally.

Anyway - walking straighter than I have in years is a plus, even if I was sore last night. I could see it on my security camera footage from when I went to do night check, I’m still knock kneed and pigeon toed but my right foot is decidedly less so.

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I hate this…I feel like one gets ‘parted out’. Hard to find someone to look at the big picture. I pretty sure my feet (major over supination) are the root of my issues further up the chain. Could I get anyone (even multiple PT’s) to address that. Nope. They just treat what they have orders for.

Heck, I have had a terrible time getting anyone to address my hip tendon issue. I called one sports medicine MD that the clinic’s poop sheet said he did arthroscopic hip repairs. When I called, the receptionist put me on hold for a bit then came back and said…”we don’t deal with that”. I told her they needed to revise their information. Apparently he only deals with labrum and FAI issues. They get so uber specialized. :roll_eyes:

Many jingles navigating the system.

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Thanks for the thoughts and I hope you get sorted too!

The parting out is brutal. We know from working with horses that if your feet are screwed up, that’s going to cause issues the whole way up the chain (similarly if your back is screwed up it will screw things up the whole way DOWN the chain). I think the PTs have a better understanding of this than the physicians do, although I’m not sure they are all created equal. This group that I’m with now is hecking better than the first ones that worked on me prior to and post my last hip surgeries.

I do understand that I really do want a specialist for the surgery itself, but someone needs to figure out which thing is causing which issue. Where’s Dr House when you need him? LOL

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A really good physiatrist is your best bet for this. They’re just super ring leaders.

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I haven’t found one yet - still looking! I’ll need a psychiatrist (reference to the earlier message) too after all of this nonsense! :smiley:

It’s definitely tough! Hold out for a good one that you mesh with!

I consider surgeons “fetch a stick” doctors. They’re really good at their one very specific thing. You go to them, with a stick, and they fetch. You go to them with a ball and it doesn’t work. They have one job. :laughing: Sometimes you get lucky and find a surgeon who’s interested in you as a person and cares about more than just taking you to the OR for their favorite procedure. But man that’s rare.

So much better to use the physiatrist to figure out what’s up. They have all the tools to order imaging and do injections and confirm the path, then when conservative measures are no longer enough, they can send you to whichever surgeon is best for your current stick.

But I empathize a whole lot with the challenges of finding just the right one! Yes to the psychiatrist (and also to a glass of wine, lol.)

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The PT asked me if anything took away the pain and I said “well, Wine & Advil do a pretty good job if I drink enough wine”.

She was not as amused as I was by my statement, and I had to explain that I really was joking. ROFL.

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It seems that most physiatrists practice out of major rehabilitation hospitals where they sort out survivors of catastrophic trauma. I looked for years and couldn’t find one outside that setting.

I haven’t found that to be the case at all.

Here’s a good resource:

https://members.aapmr.org/AAPMR/AAPMR_FINDER.aspx