Del Mar Live Stream

[Just1Alter]

I haven’t read all 34 pages, so forgive me if I repeat anything that has already been said.

Putting her lack of skills needed for 3rd level or above aside, my biggest concern is how she attempted to punish her horse many times throughout her rides. She sharply jerks the reins/bit several times. A horse’s mouth is extremely sensitive and this should never happen, in the show ring or at home. It is just plain cruel.

I sent an email to the USEF pointing out what I saw in the videos. I know it isn’t the most official form of communication, but at least I tried.

Thursday Ride:
Around 4:50, you can see her use quite a bit of force with her left rein to jerk the horse in the mouth as she passes C. A similar action occurs around 6:44 when she walks past C and jerks her house in the mouth with the reins.

Friday Ride
Around 0:45, you can see her use more force with her right spur and use a harsh right rein aid a few seconds later.
Around 1:57, she harshly kicks her horse with her right spur when her horse was already walking as expected.
Around 2:22, when she passes K she, again, jerks the bit in her horse’s mouth. This occurs again around 3:40 before the right turn with her right rein.
Around 4:00, she harshly kicks her horse with her right spur.
Around 4:25, she jerks back on the right rein to yank the bit in the horse’s mouth.
Around 4:56, she jerks back on the right rein to yank the bit in the horse’s mouth.

If the hunter rider who lost her temper was fine because she attempted to cause pain to her horse, then SB should most definitely be fined for yanking on her horse’s mouth to punish him. It happened way too often on Friday for it to be a coincidence. Even if you are having a bad ride, you don’t yank the bit. Ever. If your ride is going that bad, you are better off dismissing yourself from your test instead of going through with it.

This horse is truly suffering in those videos. Plain and simple.
And that should never be allowed.

Yes, I am deliberately using an alter.

[Joanne]

What is not shown on the Friday video, because the end got cut off in the video that is currently out there, is that after she saluted and was walking out, she yanked the right rein and then the left rein. The horse was merely walking out and did absolutely nothing for that.

[AZ_TD]

@pluvinel

Forewarned is forearmed…the new, revised Qualifying Rule is coming to you soon…from the article…

Ms Griffin added that apart from a minimum score required to qualify for freestyle competitions, USEF “does not have rules in place regarding riding standards or qualifying requirements to move up the levels”.
…
“Dressage performance standards and qualifying requirement proposals have been and continue to be explored,” said Ms Griffin. “A 2008 proposal generated a great deal of debate but received little support, however over the past several years, discussions have taken place to re-visit these topics. We look forward to working closely with USEF affiliate, the US Dressage Federation, in obtaining feedback and coordinating forums on this issue.”

There was no mention of the poor judging that allowed this rider to receive +50%.

Crappy riding was the reason given for the 2008 proposal for a qualifying rule.

The horse rider combo earned 3 scores over 60% in 2017. Probably within any qualifying rule.

[pluvinel]

@AZ TD

The horse rider combo earned 3 scores over 60% in 2017. Probably within any qualifying rule.

I rest my case.

Put a qualifying rule in place and people will find the horse that will let them get “qualified” … And then you have the current ride.

The DelMar ride that created the uproar for “bad riding” should have been judged appropriately. It wasn’t.

The uproar should be for how bad the judging and scoring was.

[Bellathemustang]

@Just1Alter

I haven’t read all 34 pages, so forgive me if I repeat anything that has already been said.

Putting her lack of skills needed for 3rd level or above aside, my biggest concern is how she attempted to punish her horse many times throughout her rides. She sharply jerks the reins/bit several times. A horse’s mouth is extremely sensitive and this should never happen, in the show ring or at home. It is just plain cruel.

I sent an email to the USEF pointing out what I saw in the videos. I know it isn’t the most official form of communication, but at least I tried.

Thursday Ride:
Around 4:50, you can see her use quite a bit of force with her left rein to jerk the horse in the mouth as she passes C. A similar action occurs around 6:44 when she walks past C and jerks her house in the mouth with the reins.

Friday Ride
Around 0:45, you can see her use more force with her right spur and use a harsh right rein aid a few seconds later.
Around 1:57, she harshly kicks her horse with her right spur when her horse was already walking as expected.
Around 2:22, when she passes K she, again, jerks the bit in her horse’s mouth. This occurs again around 3:40 before the right turn with her right rein.
Around 4:00, she harshly kicks her horse with her right spur.
Around 4:25, she jerks back on the right rein to yank the bit in the horse’s mouth.
Around 4:56, she jerks back on the right rein to yank the bit in the horse’s mouth.

If the hunter rider who lost her temper was fine because she attempted to cause pain to her horse, then SB should most definitely be fined for yanking on her horse’s mouth to punish him. It happened way too often on Friday for it to be a coincidence. Even if you are having a bad ride, you don’t yank the bit. Ever. If your ride is going that bad, you are better off dismissing yourself from your test instead of going through with it.

This horse is truly suffering in those videos. Plain and simple.
And that should never be allowed.

Yes, I am deliberately using an alter.

It is sad you have to use an alter for this. What is with users on this forum white knighting horrible and abusive people? When did judging someone for abuse become worse than abuse?

[Equibrit]

@yaya

There was no letter mentioned. Sounds like it was a conversation with Hallye Griffin.

Sorry. My ham fisted way of saying it SHOULD have been on the USEF website.

[pluvinel]

@Bellathemustang

It is sad you have to use an alter for this. What is with users on this forum white knighting horrible and abusive people? When did judging someone for abuse become worse than abuse?

Why the pile-on on this rider?

The criticisms should fall squarely on the judges for not marking appropriately and on the officials who let this rider continue.

[SendenHorse]

@pluvinel

Why the pile-on on this rider?

The criticisms should fall squarely on the judges for not marking appropriately and on the officials who let this rider continue.

NOPE, it’s the rider who needs to be held accountable…

the judges made the problem worse by letting her get by (however do you realize she WAS disqualifeid!!??!?!)

… but SB performed the actions and made the choice to abuse the horse in this manner.

[Bellathemustang]

@pluvinel

Why the pile-on on this rider?

The criticisms should fall squarely on the judges for not marking appropriately and on the officials who let this rider continue.

Abusive riding is not ok. It is not ok at a show or at home. It is not ok if the judges catch it or if they don’t. It is never ok. One more time for the people in the back, abusive riding is not ok. Yanking your horse around by the mouth when they are doing nothing to warrant it is abusive. Especially when you are a proficient enough rider to know better.

I don’t give two steaming piles of manure about her scores. I care about horses. And people riding horses like that is not ok.

[Equibrit]

All the judge needs is to know the rules and have the cojones to enforce them by eliminating the competitor.
Having done that there are further penalties. https://www.usef.org/media/press-rel…lty-guidelines

III. Cruelty/Abuse/Neglect – Includes excessive riding, lunging, training and showing, deprivation of water and feed, striking with an object, unintentional death, and violations of the 12 hour injection rule involving forbidden substances for purpose of competition.

• First Offense - Suspension of 12 months and $12,000.00 fine
• Second Offense - Suspension of 24 months and $24,000.00 fine and must appear before the Hearing Panel and provide proof of rehabilitation before being eligible to regain membership
• Third Offense – Suspension of 60 months and fine of $60,000 and must appear before the Hearing Panel and provide proof of rehabilitation before being eligible to regain membership
• If there are multiple horses involved, the penalty should apply to each horse and run consecutively

Seems to me that, if a rider can ignore a 12 month suspension and $12000, they deserve evrything that follows.

GR839…
5. Any action(s) against a horse by a competitor or an exhibitor, which are deemed excessive by a Federation judge, Federation steward, technical delegate or competition veterinarian, in the competition ring or anywhere on the competition grounds may be punished by official warning, elimination, or other sanctions which may be deemed appropriate by the Show Committee. Such action(s) could include, but are not limited to excessive use of the whip or spurs.

DR122…
l. Any resistance which prevents the continuation of the test longer than 20 seconds is punished by elimination. However, resistance that may endanger the rider, horse, judges or the public will result in elimination for safety reasons earlier than within twenty (20) seconds.

DR124 Elimination

1. In the Dressage division “disqualification”, as defined in GR117, includes elimination, except for designated qualifying classes for regional or national championships where scores may be disqualified for championship qualifying purposes and the entry may retain the scores for class ranking and reporting purposes.

2. Horse and rider combinations shall be eliminated from the competition (for .a, .f and .i, below) or from the current or next class depending on which is closest to the time the incident occurred (for all others), under the following circumstances:
   a. Misrepresentation of entry or inappropriate entry (GR907 and DR119);
   b. Dress code violations inside the competition ring listed under DR120.1-5 at the discretion of the Judge at “C” except elimination is mandatory for failure to wear properly secured protective headgear. Elimination is mandatory for violations listed under DR120.6-16.
   c. Use of illegal equipment (DR121);
   d. Unauthorized assistance (DR122);
   e. Three errors of the course and/or test (DR122);
   f. Horse’s tongue tied down (DR122);
   g. Late entry into the arena (DR122);
   h. All four feet of the horse leave the arena with or without rider (DR122);
   i. Cruelty (GR839);
   j. Marked lameness (DR122);
   k. Resistance of longer than 20 seconds (DR122);
   l. Concern for the safety of rider, other exhibitors or their entries (GR1033.11 and .12);
   m. In FEI freestyle classes, performing movements which are not allowed (DR129);
   n. Evidence of blood on a horse in the competition arena shall be cause for elimination from the class by the judge at “C”. Evidence of blood on a horse outside the competition arena shall be cause for elimination by competition management, after consultation with the technical delegate, from either the last class in which the horse competed or next class in which it is scheduled to compete, depending on which is closest to the time the incident occurred. Environmental causes such as insect bites shall normally not be cause for elimination.
   o. Failure to wear competitor number (DR121.11 and GR801.9);
   p. Fall of horse and/or rider (DR122.7(f))
   q. Any situation where a direct rule violation can be cited. Where a violation cannot be cited, a competitor is not eliminated.

3. When a judge suspects a violation or ineligibility listed under any GR or DR rule, in particular DR120, DR121, DR122 or DR124, the judge must request, as soon as possible, that the ring steward and/or TD investigate the possible infraction.

4. Except as noted below, only the Judge at “C” may eliminate a competitor for a rule violation listed under DR120 or DR122, only from the test in question, and (except for late entry into the arena) only after the competitor has entered the arena. Members of the Ground Jury have no authority to eliminate under any other circumstances, except during a class or test, the Judge at “C” has the authority to eliminate for use of illegal equipment, non-compliance with protective headgear rules, not wearing a number, cruelty and abuse or leaving the arena without the judges’ permission. Authority for rule enforcement outside the competition ring rests solely with the Show Committee (see General Rules, GR1217). Competition Management/Show Committee has the authority to eliminate for use of illegal equipment or violations of protective headgear rules during a test that is discovered after the competitor has left the arena. Competition Management also has the authority to eliminate entries and/or remove individuals from the competition grounds for violations of protective headgear rules as described in DR120 and GR801.

5. For USEF High Performance Championships, USEF High Performance qualifying and selection trials only: If the Judge at C suspects fresh blood anywhere on the horse during the test, he will stop the horse to check for blood. If the horse shows fresh blood, it will be eliminated. The elimination is final. If the Judge through examination clarifies that the horse has no fresh blood, the horse may resume and finish its test. If the Technical Delegate discovers fresh blood in the horse’s mouth or in the area of the spurs during the equipment check at the end of the test, he informs the Judge at C, who will eliminate the competitor. If there is blood elsewhere on the horse, the majority of the veterinary panel is to be called to recommend if the horse is fit to continue in subsequent classes for which it is eligible. Refer to Selection Procedures for the current championship year requirements.

[SnortyPants]

@DownYonder

Who gives a flip whether we are “a huge embarrassment in the Netherlands”? :lol:

Yeah, at least we don’t eat our horses!! Just export them

[RegentLion]

When did Axel delete the “bullies won” post on his FB page?

[AZ_TD]

@Equibrit

All the judge needs is to know the rules and have the cojones to enforce them by eliminating the competitor.
Having done that there are further penalties. https://www.usef.org/media/press-rel…lty-guidelines

III. Cruelty/Abuse/Neglect – Includes excessive riding, lunging, training and showing, deprivation of water and feed, striking with an object, unintentional death, and violations of the 12 hour injection rule involving forbidden substances for purpose of competition.

• First Offense - Suspension of 12 months and $12,000.00 fine
• Second Offense - Suspension of 24 months and $24,000.00 fine and must appear before the Hearing Panel and provide proof of rehabilitation before being eligible to regain membership
• Third Offense – Suspension of 60 months and fine of $60,000 and must appear before the Hearing Panel and provide proof of rehabilitation before being eligible to regain membership
• If there are multiple horses involved, the penalty should apply to each horse and run consecutively

Seems to me that, if a rider can ignore a 12 month suspension and $12000, they deserve evrything that follows.

GR839…
5. Any action(s) against a horse by a competitor or an exhibitor, which are deemed excessive by a Federation judge, Federation steward, technical delegate or competition veterinarian, in the competition ring or anywhere on the competition grounds may be punished by official warning, elimination, or other sanctions which may be deemed appropriate by the Show Committee. Such action(s) could include, but are not limited to excessive use of the whip or spurs.

DR122…
l. Any resistance which prevents the continuation of the test longer than 20 seconds is punished by elimination. However, resistance that may endanger the rider, horse, judges or the public will result in elimination for safety reasons earlier than within twenty (20) seconds.

DR124 Elimination

1. In the Dressage division “disqualification”, as defined in GR117, includes elimination, except for designated qualifying classes for regional or national championships where scores may be disqualified for championship qualifying purposes and the entry may retain the scores for class ranking and reporting purposes.

2. Horse and rider combinations shall be eliminated from the competition (for .a, .f and .i, below) or from the current or next class depending on which is closest to the time the incident occurred (for all others), under the following circumstances:
   a. Misrepresentation of entry or inappropriate entry (GR907 and DR119);
   b. Dress code violations inside the competition ring listed under DR120.1-5 at the discretion of the Judge at “C” except elimination is mandatory for failure to wear properly secured protective headgear. Elimination is mandatory for violations listed under DR120.6-16.
   c. Use of illegal equipment (DR121);
   d. Unauthorized assistance (DR122);
   e. Three errors of the course and/or test (DR122);
   f. Horse’s tongue tied down (DR122);
   g. Late entry into the arena (DR122);
   h. All four feet of the horse leave the arena with or without rider (DR122);
   i. Cruelty (GR839);
   j. Marked lameness (DR122);
   k. Resistance of longer than 20 seconds (DR122);
   l. Concern for the safety of rider, other exhibitors or their entries (GR1033.11 and .12);
   m. In FEI freestyle classes, performing movements which are not allowed (DR129);
   n. Evidence of blood on a horse in the competition arena shall be cause for elimination from the class by the judge at “C”. Evidence of blood on a horse outside the competition arena shall be cause for elimination by competition management, after consultation with the technical delegate, from either the last class in which the horse competed or next class in which it is scheduled to compete, depending on which is closest to the time the incident occurred. Environmental causes such as insect bites shall normally not be cause for elimination.
   o. Failure to wear competitor number (DR121.11 and GR801.9);
   p. Fall of horse and/or rider (DR122.7(f))
   q. Any situation where a direct rule violation can be cited. Where a violation cannot be cited, a competitor is not eliminated.

3. When a judge suspects a violation or ineligibility listed under any GR or DR rule, in particular DR120, DR121, DR122 or DR124, the judge must request, as soon as possible, that the ring steward and/or TD investigate the possible infraction.

4. Except as noted below, only the Judge at “C” may eliminate a competitor for a rule violation listed under DR120 or DR122, only from the test in question, and (except for late entry into the arena) only after the competitor has entered the arena. Members of the Ground Jury have no authority to eliminate under any other circumstances, except during a class or test, the Judge at “C” has the authority to eliminate for use of illegal equipment, non-compliance with protective headgear rules, not wearing a number, cruelty and abuse or leaving the arena without the judges’ permission. Authority for rule enforcement outside the competition ring rests solely with the Show Committee (see General Rules, GR1217). Competition Management/Show Committee has the authority to eliminate for use of illegal equipment or violations of protective headgear rules during a test that is discovered after the competitor has left the arena. Competition Management also has the authority to eliminate entries and/or remove individuals from the competition grounds for violations of protective headgear rules as described in DR120 and GR801.

5. For USEF High Performance Championships, USEF High Performance qualifying and selection trials only: If the Judge at C suspects fresh blood anywhere on the horse during the test, he will stop the horse to check for blood. If the horse shows fresh blood, it will be eliminated. The elimination is final. If the Judge through examination clarifies that the horse has no fresh blood, the horse may resume and finish its test. If the Technical Delegate discovers fresh blood in the horse’s mouth or in the area of the spurs during the equipment check at the end of the test, he informs the Judge at C, who will eliminate the competitor. If there is blood elsewhere on the horse, the majority of the veterinary panel is to be called to recommend if the horse is fit to continue in subsequent classes for which it is eligible. Refer to Selection Procedures for the current championship year requirements.

DR117.4 Riding with both hands obligatory for all tests…goes on in more detail that if rider momentarily uses one hand to pat horse or swat at a fly, no problem, but if rider uses hand off the reins to try and produce more impulsion then grounds for elimination.

[Equibrit]

@DownYonder

Who gives a flip whether we are “a huge embarrassment in the Netherlands”? :lol:

People with self respect and pride really don’t care to be associated with such shameful acts.
We all represent our countries.

[Equibrit]

On Friday the Judge at C was Cesar Torente, who is an International judge from Columbia. I guess it’s possible that he was not familiar with USEF rules governing national classes.
On Thursday the Judge at C was Charlotte Trentelman (FL) who eliminated her…

[SendenHorse]

@Equibrit

People with self respect and pride really don’t care to be associated with such shameful acts.
We all represent our countries.

This is not a national olympic pair nor were they representing the US in any capacity. One AA does not represent anything.

I think this transcends national pride… I prefer to think of horse welfare as a global issue.

This rider let the horse down. End of story. Bad press yes, but let’s keep it in context.

[Equibrit]

@SendenHorse

One AA does not represent anything.

On the contrary, that video has circled the world with the word American attached.

[ToN_Farm]

@Equibrit

On Friday the Judge at C was Cesar Torente, who is an International judge from Columbia. I guess it’s possible that he was not familiar with USEF rules governing national classes.
On Thursday the Judge at C was Charlotte Trentelman who eliminated her…

You’ve got things mixed up. The bad ride on Friday has Trentelman at C and the rider was eliminated after the class ended. The Thursday ride has Cesar at C and was scored.

[Equibrit]

@ToN Farm

You’ve got things mixed up. The bad ride on Friday has Trentelman at C and the rider was eliminated after the class ended. The Thursday ride has Cesar at C and was scored.

Sorry! In a hurry.

[keysfins]

@Equibrit

On Friday the Judge at C was Cesar Torente, who is an International judge from Columbia. I guess it’s possible that he was not familiar with USEF rules governing national classes.
On Thursday the Judge at C was Charlotte Trentelman (FL) who eliminated her…

I thought she was eliminated on FRIDAY, and AFTER her ride. Did you find something different? I know several people are confusing the two days/rides.