Laurierace, very good point.
“Mike”, as you are fully aware, there are a great number of people who have been wronged by Jill Burnell from Gray Fox Farm, myself being one of those people.
It’s obvious you people don’t like her, fine, don’t do business with her!
It isn’t a case of liking or disliking Jill; I personally couldn’t care two hoots about her either way. She shafted me and then I moved on.
For any of her new clients I’d imagine liking/disliking doesn’t come into the picture either; most people do not know what kind of a devious and unscrupulous person she is until AFTER they have parted with their cash.
For those that feel they have a claim, take her to court not some Internet rumor mill. The steps to the Court House are easy to find.
Neither of those options are of interest to me. Besides I live thousands of miles away and I have better things to spend my time and money on. However you can be certain, “Mike”, that I am more than happy to tell others in real life about my dealings with Jill Burnell 
To be fair of course, I also suggest they do a quick Google-search for Jill Burnell, Gray Fox Farms; darn those rumour mills; they appear to be grinding good and strong all over the internet!
As I recall, people have taken her to court, won, but the judgements have not been served. That doesn’t count the many folks who didn’t bother to sue and take her to court, which is expensive and time consuming, especially out of state.
FBI CONTACT??? PROSECUTER CONTACT???
[QUOTE=equinedriver;6509807]
I hate to say it but the BBB is worthless. They have no power to do anything and nothing will come of it and it’s a waste of time. Go to the CA AG and the FBI. You don’t have to any where near CA to do either.[/QUOTE]
instead of everyone calling randomly all over, it would be better if someone could get some specific contacts who actually have the power to take action. Ask around among your contacts and surely somebody in the CotH world has connections that can help with this.
In the meantime, if someone could create a spreadsheet and collect the contact info and and estimated damage amounts / brief summary of damage – via PRIVATE MESSAGE from the victims. I know in another situation, what got the ball rolling was presenting a prosecuter with something like that. It really took a few organized ringleaders gathering the initial info to present to the authorities, and THEN, when there was some hesitation by local authorities, social media pressure.
Just saying everybody calling all over randomly might not be as effective as getting 1 strong (higher up) point of contact.
Given the amounts of money and the interstate nature of this, it seems like an FBI type crime and they would have more resources for this kind of thing, I would think.
ldaziens, you and I think alike 
I just looked up the contact information for the San Francisco FBI.
http://www.fbi.gov/sanfrancisco/
(Their contact info. is off to the right - including their EMAIL)
What if everybody emailed them? I mean really, you start adding it up and it has to be tens of thousands of dollars according to what everyone is coming forward with…if not more when you add up paid stud fees, etc. And if most of the dealings were strictly through email, I would think that would be internet fraud as well?
Wouldn’t they stand up and take notice if they got excessive complaints from a lot of different people? Cloverbarley, I know you said you have better things to spend your time on…but just send an email. Do you honestly want more people losing money and going through what you’ve gone through? This is why so many people are getting ripped off in the first place, because not enough people are speaking up and standing up. At some point, SOMBODY NEEDS TO STAND UP AND FIGHT FOR THE REST OF THE INDUSTRY! Even if it’s just a simple email complaint to the proper authorities.
Man, what a vicious cycle. Sure, this forum is being read by lots of people, but I’m betting even more will never see it, never search Google and just never know…until a bunch of you stand up and say you’ve finally had enough! :no:
I’m sure MSNBC would love this story…
It seems any alleged crimes are either too petty or too murky to really do anything about. Otherwise, I am sure someone in authority would have taken an interest.
Thank God! I am not one of her victims but if I were, I would look into a class action suit. Advertising in the COTH magazine asking for other victims to contact you would be a good place to start. This has gone on too long, someone needs to put an end to it.
If someone takes money from an out of state person and then absolutely delivers nothing for the money paid, and gives no refund, I would think that was pretty cut and dried as far as interstate fraud goes?
But I am no attorney, so I don’t know.
The other stuff, like pretending to be a friendly bystander and emailing negative comments about other stallions is not really a crime, I don’t think.
CRIMINAL VS. CIVIL?
[QUOTE=Sheila A;6509970]
Lastly, to clarify, I am not giving any legal advice here, and am not saying that an involuntary bankruptcy is appropriate in this case. Just curious if it has been considered it based on the number of GFF threads that this forum has seen over the past year or so.[/QUOTE]
Sheila - NOT AS LEGAL ADVICE, understand –
There was a case in New York State against A Ton of Love horse rescue; and they used donations collected under false pretenses to pursue fraud charges. And, then there was a restitution hearing. Now, those were mostly small donations, and the real goal was just getting the horses away from a horrible situation quickly – working through animal welfare wasn’t an effective option.
Anyway, I am just wondering how getting restitution through a criminal trial process compares to people trying to pursue civil claims or force bankruptcy or whatever.
[QUOTE=Zlotych;6510171]
Ah, the mastermind herself!
http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r488/65satellite/7a7d16d8.jpg[/QUOTE]
She is a mastermind…this is not anything near what she depicts with her website.
You would have to get your ducks in a row before you took it to the FBI. They WOULD do something about her. When you start to add up the total dollar amounts she scammed out of people; the numbers would be astronomical. Despite being called out numerous times for her wrong-doing she is still scamming people as we speak. My advice before contacting someone: get a list of people who she has scammed who want to speak and contribute to getting her off the market.
If you ask me, any person who she screwed should be willing to speak (for the sake of this industry, for the sake of the horses in her name, for the sake of the horses she’s flooding the market with, for the sake of the unsuspecting buyers and eachother, and for the sake of the quality of the show world). This woman openly admits to culling animals in her breeding program who do not perform to her expectations: does anyone know where exactly she sends these older, high quality broodmares that she’s sucked the life out of? It’s not like she has run of the mill animals in her herd. She’s had some big names on her website that have just disappeared. I’d be getting a list of people together with signed/notorized letters stating what theyve gone through. Something needs to be done. Good Luck
Nobody is going to get any money back especially if you have to pay lawyer fees. I have sued someone and won three times and never collected a cent. The motivation needs to be putting an end to the endless stream of victims. If someone had done this a year or so ago when these accounts first surfaced maybe those of you who can now count yourselves as victims would have been spared.
I am surprised she hasn’t sent me her trademark PM stating how all I am doing is hurting my filly’s value yet this thread!
[QUOTE=ldaziens;6510142]
instead of everyone calling randomly all over, it would be better if someone could get some specific contacts who actually have the power to take action. Ask around among your contacts and surely somebody in the CotH world has connections that can help with this.
In the meantime, if someone could create a spreadsheet and collect the contact info and and estimated damage amounts / brief summary of damage – via PRIVATE MESSAGE from the victims. I know in another situation, what got the ball rolling was presenting a prosecuter with something like that. It really took a few organized ringleaders gathering the initial info to present to the authorities, and THEN, when there was some hesitation by local authorities, social media pressure.
Just saying everybody calling all over randomly might not be as effective as getting 1 strong (higher up) point of contact.
Given the amounts of money and the interstate nature of this, it seems like an FBI type crime and they would have more resources for this kind of thing, I would think.[/QUOTE]
Okay, I don’t have a claim myself, but I will step up to the plate and organize and file the complaint if those that have been taken want to give me the info/proof.
I think that a nice packet of copies of emails, cancelled checks, contracts, etc from 20 people or more, delivered to the AG and the FBI all together would garner some attention…
PM me and I’ll get the ball rolling. I have a fax for you to send copies of contract etc to. If there is someone on here that has the skills to set up a web site where more victims might be able to find out about the organized effort that would be good. Everyone could post a link on their FB pages etc. The most important thing will be to only post factual proven claims. As long as anything made public is provable, she can scream all she wants, it won’t do her any good.
In my case with the IN AG, they gave him an option of agreeing to a payment plan for restitution or facing criminal charges. He choose restitution (surprise LOL) but has failed to make the required payments on time, so now is faced with paying up or having a warrant issued for contempt of court. It is slow and frustrating, but if you hang in there, it will get results. Everyone filing civil cases one by one won’t result in anything but a bunch of judgements that they are then left to try and collect. I suspended my civil case and opted to go with the AG where the threat of criminal charges and JAIL I thought would be more productive. Perhaps we could get something listed on Horseshowdiva and other web sites to get the word out and collect data from as many victims as possible.
My old boss took her to small claims court for a large unpaid vet bill and passing a bad check. She just never showed up. My boss did not pursue any further because of the time and trouble to do so. This seems to be the problem, that so many of you are out of state and it would be a royal PITA. So she continues to roll onward. Everyone just writes it off and she just preys on new victims.
[QUOTE=Kwill;6510157]
It seems any alleged crimes are either too petty or too murky to really do anything about. Otherwise, I am sure someone in authority would have taken an interest.[/QUOTE]
NO WAY. Everything I can think of took very knowledgeable whistleblowers doing a lot of the legwork before they got authorities motivated to do something.
In the Gray Fox Farms case - A very few people tried to get help from authorities to get a mare back or whatever. I would not think anybody from law enforcement ever had any clue as to the total amount of money involved and the number of people involved. Unless you are in the same business or very familiar with it, how would you fully grasp the amounts of money involved here. Just the math on the semen stuff is mind boggling to me.
Remember, it was only a few brave souls who spoke out; and Jill Burnell threatened and bad mouthed them. And, because of Jill’s perceived clout and credibility within the community, she was able to intimidate and con people.
So I suggest that everyone look back at post#128 ( my first ) and really read what I wrote. This has morphed into me being Jill, supporting Jill, being Jill’s husband etc, I post my number and surprise surprise, it’s quiet!
I’m wondering how many of the people that were “frauded” out of their money paid by credit card? Most likely the majority and how many had the charges reversed which is a simple process? I know, I’ve had to do it with purchases before and it takes a few minutes.
I said the horses looked great, shelter? There’s shelter and you can go to Google Earth and see a picture from May of 2012. How many of you have shelters and your horses won’t go in them?
I said I couldn’t speak for the condition of the inside of the house and that I watched the parents walk out of the house, get in their car and drive away. Clearly they weren’t confined to a bed. Why weren’t the authorities called if conditions were so horrible?
I clearly don’t understand why someone would’nt pursue legal remedy if they were ripped off. It really isn’t that hard and the resulting bad press would force the issue if there is one. Searching for judgements, there really isn’t much to find and for those that have been in business, especially in CA, people sue all the time.
The funny thing is Katboxxx finally got back to me when I requested a contact number and this was the reply: “Sorry Jill, no can do!” Hmmmmm, if that was really the SIL she would obviously know that my area code is 200 miles away from Petaluma which is somewhat suspicious!
If someone would like to call, feel free! I’m not Jill as I have stated, just someone that has been to the facility that can vouch for the condition of the horses. I won’t bite…
Eagle74, there is no shelter in the 2 dry lot pens where the mares and foals are. You want pictures? And anyone can get a cell phone with a different area code. Please why don’t you tell us your connection with her and her family? And yes, her dad does drive, her mom uses a walker. It is sad that she has the power to overcome her family and do this to them. I partially blame her husband too. And do not forget Jill has a great scare tactic to threaten everyone with a lawsuit if they try to pursue or say something derogatory towards her. She is good, and knows how to play the game. Unfortunately none of her threats would stand a chance. And as far as calling you, whats the point?
Why would people call you when you have met the woman a handful of times…what exactly is your connection with this woman? Why do people have to call you?? There is a 20 page discussion happening right here if you have information that proves all of this is just a huge misunderstanding then why not share it and shut us all up once and for all?
Oh that’s right, you don’t.
