It is not as much the saddle (since a rider can be very secure in both saddle) but rather the too open joints (too long a stirrup and too long a leg w/o all the joints being elastically stretched into the heel). And it is also a question of whether rider is over the center of motion vs behind it, it is the later the buck will propel the rider out of the saddle.
Yeah, I also wasn’t expecting it this time. I had already been riding for about 20 minutes and did not realize this was bubbling under the surface. I usually know what I’ve got.
[QUOTE=FineAlready;7915529]
Yeah, I also wasn’t expecting it this time. I had already been riding for about 20 minutes and did not realize this was bubbling under the surface. I usually know what I’ve got.[/QUOTE]
I don’t know your horse, but with mine that’s a flag of ulcers. I always joke that he’s honest about his bucking, at least. Gives plenty of warning before any dramatic fits… if he doesn’t, it’s either because he legitimately spooked and thought something was after him, or ulcers. For the record, I believe he learned the bucking during ulcers, and it became a go-to misbehavior because he’s a big bucker out in his field, too…
[QUOTE=FineAlready;7915346]
My analogy is this: riding in a jumping saddle is like being a coin in a dish - lots of places to go, you can kind of slide around and still reposition; riding in a dressage saddle is like you are a plug in an outlet. Once you are out of the outlet, you’re just OUT. [/QUOTE]
I always say that our stability in the saddle is like the stability of a statue. The wider the base of the statue (or the shorter the stirrup), the more difficult it is to knock over.
Yeah, I agree 100%- some people go around claiming that western saddles, or deep-seated dressage saddles are much harder to fall or be bucked off of, but in my experience it’s so much easier to stay on in a flat, tiny postage-stamp jumping saddle with shorter stirrups. Western saddles are the worst- you can’t even grip with your knees if you have to to stay on, there’s no way to stay on if the horse won’t cooperate, and grabbing the horn really doesn’t help; if you go up and land on the horn, you’ll wish you had fallen off instead.
Bucket-seated big-blocked dressage saddles are very similar to western saddles in this way- even if you drop your stirrups and pull your legs up to grab on you can’t grip with the knees because the blocks get in the way. If you go up, you won’t be able to get back on, the blocks or horn or cantle throw you off.
On a flat jumping saddle, you can slither and grip and rock and wiggle as needed to stay on. None of which is exactly good equitation, but hey, it’s an emergency situation.
I think it’s all a matter of what you’re used to. I started out in western and that was always what I felt the most secure in. Dressage became a close second. Riding one of mine in a jump saddle now - since we’re learning to jump - and I feel less secure in that, but figure that will change with time as I find my balance in the new saddle.
Glad. I’m not the only one!!! I am much more secure in hairy situations in my jump saddle.
I am glad to read this thread. I think I agree. My horse tests me about once or twice a year and he has this drop shoulder/buck and has gotten me off several times. I have been entirely gob smacked about this - I am known for not being able to be dislodged - in polo I was given the whacked out horses because I could ride anything. My first mare would almost cartwheel at a gallop with me and I’d stay on. I have never been gotten off until dressage. Its a conumdrum.
Just scanned through a few of the replies.
Let me first say I’m so sorry that your buck actually sent you ER. Take care of yourself.
IME, it’s not a saddle issue at all, unless you are too dependent upon the saddle for balance.
Regarless of the saddle, stirrup length is important do give you a “base” until you get a really secure seat, saddle or not.
One thing that irks me is that when one thinks about “dressage” they immediately think longer stirrups.
Those only come when your seat, hands and legs and have earned that freedom, physically, to keep yourself seated and safe. The longer stirrup is “earned”…not a “look”.
But then there are some just rank bucks that can get you off, not matter the leather between you and the spicy, young or uncomfortable horse. :lol:
Take good care!
I did consider that he might be ulcery, but I think it is more likely that I was just missing his “tell” this time that he was too fresh. The horses were in the two days prior (and he had not been out yet that day before I rode), plus the temperature dropped like a rock overnight.
I feel like I have a pretty decent seat. I’ve been riding for 29 years now, since I was 5, almost exclusively hunters/eq until now. My junior hunter back when I was showing a lot was a serious bucker. My current horse can buck pretty hard when he wants to, and it frankly just goes on for a while sometimes even when I’m proactive about stopping it. I don’t really want to go back to riding him in my jumping saddle because it doesn’t fit him as well and I’m really switched over to dressage now. But this does have me a little spooked. Maybe I will take the blocks off of my dressage saddle for a few rides.
Shorten your stirrups for now.
In my experience, yes. But I am definitely more comfortable in a jumping saddle. IMHO, one factor is that once you’re dislodged out of the seat it’s harder to find your way back in in a dressage (or western) saddle.
[QUOTE=sid;7915764]
Shorten your stirrups for now.;)[/QUOTE]
They are honestly not all that long. Plus, I had been gradually lengthening them even before I got the dressage saddle. Although I’ve had the saddle 5-6 months, I’ve been taking exclusively dressage lessons for a little over a year. But I do think I might shorten them a hole for my first couple rides back.
[QUOTE=Peggy;7915782]
In my experience, yes. But I am definitely more comfortable in a jumping saddle. IMHO, one factor is that once you’re dislodged out of the seat it’s harder to find your way back in in a dressage (or western) saddle.[/QUOTE]
YES. This is how I think he got me! In my jumping tack I can do all of these crazy ninja moves to get back on. I’ve made some pretty impossible saves in my life - shimmying my way back into the saddle from basically under his neck, for example.
Ugh. Well, time to stop thinking about it!
[QUOTE=FineAlready;7915466]
Thanks for the feedback, guys. To respond to the person who asked: it is a Schleese HK which is custom fitted to him and me. My jumping saddle is/was a County Stabilizer, which is pretty minimal and open. I also rode him in my old PDN (very minimal) from time to time.
I think part of it is that I do ride out bucks in a bit of a half seat normally. I don’t think I can do that in the dressage saddle. The evidence suggests I can’t, anyway. Ouch.
The icing on the cake is that I also got rear ended by a hit and run driver at a stop sign today (I am cleared by my doc to drive). I’m afraid to leave the house now. I really want to get back on my horse sooner rather than later, because I don’t want fear to set in. But I can’t until my new helmet arrives and my concussion fully resolves. I lunged him today. He was fine for that.[/QUOTE]
That’s a bummer of a day! 
I have the same saddle and a similarly minimalist close contact (Butet.) While I don’t feel like my Schleese locks me in at all - in fact, that’s one of the things I like about it, compared to other dressage saddles I’ve tried - I do think the position used for dressage, with the longer leg & less emphasis on a deep heel, could be a factor.
I think that is particularly true for those of us whose muscle memory was developed in hunter land, where we’d maybe anchor ourselves with those deep heels and kick that horse up in front of our leg.
The good news is that if you feel like you need more “freedom” in the seat… your fitter can probably make that happen. As you know, I spent hours and hours working to get my HK set up the way I wanted it, but at this point, from a seat perspective, it feels quite similar to my Butet. I am not locked in at all.
Jingles for a quick recovery!!!
When I first switched from riding in a CC saddle consistently to riding in a dressage saddle consistently last year I felt like a hot mess. My legs were all over the place, and I just couldn’t get a real feeling of being secure in the saddle. It took some time and now when I switch back to my jumping saddle I feel like I am on a slip and slide compared to my Wintec Isabell, and I also don’t feel nearily as secure in that saddle as I use to. I use to feel rock solid.
I think it just takes some times to adjust to having a longer leg, riding more upright instead of more forward. I hope you feel better soon! My last fall resulted in a concussion and it was not fun, especially since the DR said no computer screens and I work in billing. :no:
It’s easier either way with a secure balanced seat.
I think you have your answer, OP, but I’m glad to hear that you weren’t seriously hurt! Coming fun is always a crap shoot regarding how you land.
For me it isn’t abou which saddle I feel more secure in. I’m very “secure” and comfortable in my dressage saddle (as well as my jump). It has to do with how I ride through a buck and how to correct one. A buck is more similar to jumping. It is harder to really ride through shenanigans keeping your seat in the saddle. It is much easier to get off their back and stay above them. That is why a jump saddle is easier.
But it if they catch you unprepared or really turn themselves inside out or jerk you down and unbalance you…doesn’t really matter what saddle you are in as you likely will not be in it long.
OP hope you are better and I would just stop worrying about it.
I think it depends on your comfort and seat in a saddle, more so than the type of saddle. I personally sit bucks far better in a dressage saddle because my center of balance is lower and my legs wrap around the horse to keep me on. Plus I’ve developed one hell of a seat thanks to a fantastic trainer and a challenging horse, who does handstands just about every ride in the colder weather.
I’d guess you just don’t have the same good balance/seat yet in the dressage saddle.
