I have a huge pad collection and they work just fine with my EQ Saddle Science saddle 
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Same price as any well made saddle nowadays, foam or not. I priced and tried Devocoux, CWD, Stübben, Täkt, Voltaire and a few others recently. All about the same. And the flaps are leather on mine which was not extra IIRC - would be surprised if EQ offered vinyl flaps.
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That’s what I said, they’re the same price, if not more. But on the EQ, what is custom besides the tree and seat? None of the other parts have to be custom made - stitched, leather, designed and measured? You move the panels and cups around to fit the horse right?
And yes, you can use any pad with them, but then you have the panels showing. So are you limited to their white pad or black one with florescent green piping for showing? Or do you show with the panels exposed?
I’m not arguing the value to anyone else. I’m arguing the value for ME.
To be fair basically everything can be customized. They have basic seat models in terms of slope of the seat, but the width and shape of the twist can actually be adjusted based on what you like, all the angles and shape of the tree are made to measure to the horse and then if you pay extra you can get adjustable stirrup bars, custom stitching and all sort of cosmetic upgrades. You can also easily adjust the balance or fit with the disks unlike a foam saddle, but it also doesn’t require the 6-12 month recommended flocking adjustments that are needed for a wool saddle.
A lot of companies say their saddle is “custom” but in reality a 10k Devoucoux Harmonie is just a standard tree that is closest to your horse’s size with the foam shaved to fit them after that. And there are 2 seat styles to choose from (1 even more expensive) and aside from how many inches long you want it and what color sparkle you want on the back, that’s it. They won’t change the twist for you, they can’t change the stirrup bar and you are dependent on the fitter shaving foam or mailing it away to have the tree melted and reshaped if it’s not working.
Also I do think with an EQ you’re paying for the open head/no tree point technology which can he a game changer for fitting horses who need the extra shoulder space. Honestly I could care less about the flapless aspect of it. For me it’s that this doesn’t get in the way of my horse’s shoulder and anytime I told them this is uncomfortable, my horse doesn’t like this, etc they work to actually create a set up that does work instead of telling me “you’re just getting used to it” or “your horse has to poop”, etc. I will say maybe I’ve had an exceptional experience because I’m local and get to work with Carmi in person, but it has just been head and shoulders above what I’ve seen from other saddle trying and buying experiences.
And I’m not trying to talk you into this saddle if it’s not for you, I’m just putting this out there for others who are on the fence and are reading this whole thread to help make their own decisions.
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Nope:
I’ve been hands on with at least 6 different EQ saddles and have sat in at least 4 that I can remember. Like I said, I’m not trying to diminish the value of these saddles at all because I’ve seen what they have done for horses that were ridden in bad saddles for too long. I even stated that my horse went lovely in them, but of all the ones I tried, they didn’t work for me. I am also local to a rep and did a remote fitting with Carmi. I recently recommended trying an EQ to a friend who’s gone through 3 custom saddles that didn’t work for her horse.
I believe I touched on “paying for the technology” as well. And for the record, I wouldn’t touch a Devacoux or any foam saddle for that matter. As I said, I have a complicated to fit horse, so I tend to stick to brands that can customize options for what he needs. I’ve had the opportunity to work with 3 separate independent fitters, so I know exactly what my horse needs in a saddle. Not everyone does.
Your original post asked for experience and opinions on the brand and those were mine. I gave the good and bad from MY point of view.
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Yea…no thanks. Lol. Glad there’s more than the 2 though!
Lol.I agree the pad situation could be improved. I actually talked to Carmi about making a cover for the panels with some sheepskin rolls on the front and back to basically make it look like a sheepskin half pad when it’s used with with a traditional saddle pad. It would be great if the custom pads could also come in different fabrics and with a square corner, but that seems like a more complicated/expensive fix, especially with COVID supply issues plaguing manufacturers.
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Stay tuned on that!
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(sorry if this should be quoting @Equibrit instead!)
The hypothesis (described in the peer-reviewed article linked above) was that the lack of flap allowed better adduction of the rider’s thigh (less flexion/abduction/external rotation of the hip joint), among other rider kinematics. Other factors are certainly possible, and even likely, to contribute. The challenge is determining what should be assessed, and then figuring out how to measure it. The Pliance system in the article above, which is a pressure mat, doesn’t really allow for measurements in three dimensions, so has its own limitations in trying to truly capture the dynamic forces on both the horse and the rider during movement. It’s a fascinating area of research that is sadly under-explored, although EQ is still testing and hoping to publish more papers.
This is very interesting, but I would like to know more about the rider. Specifically, was this a male or female? There are anatomic differences that might result in different findings.
I think I might be interested in trying this saddle.
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The thing that caught my eye on the study is that they used different blocks for the saddles and it looks like different seats from the pictures. That alone with affect rider’s stability and position. I would like to see the same saddle and rider. One with a flap and one without.
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In this study it was a female professional rider.
Wicky, we’re close enough that I’m happy to talk more in person (I’m ‘Beorn’ from UDDB). There is also a fitter who comes to MA.
That’s a great suggestion! In this particular case, the ‘own saddles’ were a variety of other brands fitted specifically for the individual horses. The flapless saddle used to generate the data analyzed was actually a single configuration - same block and position, although different saddles (4 horses had the same saddle; 1 horse had a different saddle, but it was the same tree/seat/block).
That totally makes sense. I love the work being done, but there is a lot more to be done.
I would love to see multiple horses, each horse with the same rider, ridden twice. Once in a flapped saddle, then the same saddle model without a flap.
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Hey there, long time no see! ATM, this is theoretical… I just retired one horse and the other will go Monday to Tufts and will probably end up with a myelogram… not sure what the future will hold for him. Crushing…
I have been looking at several horses to replace the retired one, after spending a small fortune on saddles. With my own neck problems, something that decreased my movement would be wonderful. So let’s get together. Will PM you my email info.
Here are the pics. One with the bar down and one with the end of the bar flipped up. As you can see the adjustability doesn’t affect that aspect of things. These are set to the 3rd position counting from the front (out of 4).
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So none of my traditional pads, girth or stirrup leathers will work with this saddle? I’d have to buy from EQ and that’s it?
All accessory equipment works fine with the saddle. Some of the panel shows if you use a regular pad but that’s purely cosmetic and not noticeable at all with a dark pad.
It has normal billets and normal stirrup bars. You can add on adjustable stirrups bars if you want those, but those still function like a normal stirrup bar with the leathers. Honestly you could ride in the saddle with the flap attached 100% of the time and a small cover over the panels and no one would have any idea it was an EQ unless they knew to look.
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