EN did not make Boyd. If anything, it was the other way around. He was one of the first big name riders to support the site, and kindly shared himself back in the days when EN had 300 daily page views. It wasn’t for his own benefit then, though as the site grew it certainly didn’t hurt him. Until now. Thus he is no longer a friend of EN.
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Let us say that everyone is willing to agree with the fact that EN made high up eventers popular and such.
The last part (would do well to remember that) makes it sound like you think because some media source does a little good then we should bow down and always just go with what they do, because they did that good?
Does this theory hold true for everything?
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No absolutely not, but in this case EN is fighting for what they believe is the better good, whether you agree with that method or not. Just seems ironic that one minute they are loving the attention and work EN is doing then the minute they think it negatively effects them EN is basically the devil? It does effect some UL riders, and I don’t doubt for a minute it is stressful and upsetting but I think the point EN was trying to make is that the name makes some folks feel that way too (whether ppl think they have the right to be upset or not it doesn’t matter). So to cry about how awful it is losing an event while at the same time saying sorry no - no one should be offended by the name is a bit rich.
Everyone is acting like entitled babies, including EN. Our sport looks terrible right now, and mr popular Boyds public stance is not helping. Why is he now inserting himself into this and creating more drama? If he has the emails that make EN look as bad as he says he should release them, not sit behind his computer and talk about them.
@EventerAJ He might have given EN his time when they were new, but over the years his popularity has risen incredibly. He is a wayyyy bigger name now then he was when EN first started.
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I’m going to take this opportunity, and attempt to inject a little more levity into this discussion. Just because I like jokes.
I wasn’t annoyed with the “Boyd for President” shirts. Mostly because we have an ongoing feud with a neighbor… for reasons I won’t get into… but it’s a nightmare and has now involved lawyers, etc. And this season… they have decided to plaster their yard with political signs that our driveway runs by, just to irritate us. They seem to suspect that they do not share the same affiliation as we do. And I suspect they are correct about that.
I say that they are only doing this to irritate us… because we both live more than a quarter mile off a public road, and we share our private side street with only one other family, and our farm is at the very end of the street, so we are the only people who drive past all the political advertising.
When it went up a few weeks ago, I told my husband that I wanted to spend on getting a bunch of yard signs made up, advocating for our dog for President in 2020. I got the idea off a funny meme that has been going around Facebook. I want to have full color photos of the dog, “Roofus for 2020” on the signs, “Nicest Candidate Ever” etc. And post them all along the private road we all share.
My husband says it will only make the ongoing feud and tension worse. I think it’s really funny, and a little laughter might alleviate tension and bring people back together.
Oh well.
Maybe they should have made up a funny t-shirt about an upper level horse for President instead, and that would have been weird… but had more people laughing. If I had to vote? Bug. I’m obsessed with him… SUCH a cool horse 
Less politics, more dogs and horses!
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Did you really just say all that?
Thanks for your reply, and working with me on trying to find if we can identify some “common ground” during the course of this discussion. I concur strongly with what I bolded from your original post.
I feel really strongly about the issue of undocumented labor in equestrian sports and on farms in general, as my personal experience is that everyone I know of who employs it, almost always does so, because they are trying to cut costs, and they can pay lower rates overall. The reality is that some of the folks with companies utilizing undocumented labor can skip paying things like workman’s comp, etc, and then undercut the competition on bids.
My better half and I own a small farm and are in the process of retrofitting it, and have a significant number of projects going on at present… one after another, as we gradually turn it into our version of a “dream hobby farm.” It will be a several years long process. We have bid out multiple projects now, and almost never take the low bid… for a number of reasons. But one of which is that we do not like supporting any business, big or small, that treats their own employees horribly. And it’s a BIG issue with contractors in Northern Virginia… this is a very diverse area, and we have found over the years that even when you do your homework and hire a licensed and insured contractor, they can and do show up onsite with labor who are immigrants, that they are clearly treating HORRIBLY. And it is not something we will support.
Many years ago, before we had a farm, we were replacing a deck at our home at the time, and it was a bit of a tricky project with code, etc. We bid the project out, and chose a contractor who was a Middle Eastern immigrant, but licensed and insured, and who had great reviews and portfolio showing good quality work. He was not the low bidder. When the crew showed up at the crack of dawn, however, they were dropped at our house, with tools and necessary supplies, but no water or anything else. Then the van drove away. It was the middle of summer and an outdoor project and brutal. The crew and their foreman spoke ZERO English. They were very polite, and the work was going fine and according to plan, so that wasn’t an issue for us. But we got worried about them by early afternoon, and started calling the contractor on his cell, to see if anyone was going to show up to take them to get some lunch. He didn’t answer his cell. We decided to provide them all gatorades and ice water, and showed them photos of pizza, just to see if we could order it for them, get them something they would like, and at least feed them something and treat them like fellow human beings while they were working in our backyard. They were baffled by us at first when we approached them offering to provide drinks and food, and the language barrier was a challenge. Then one guy stepped forward and pointed at the pepperoni pizza on the pizza menu and made a face, indicating “Please… not that.” And we smiled, and nodded, and got them some pizzas that had no pork products on them and they smiled and were really grateful, and took an hour long break to drink and eat and rest and cool off. And it’s a good thing we did what we did, because the contractor ducked our calls all day, and left the crew at our house until almost 10 pm. Then he came and picked them up, and we paid him out for a job well done (the quality of the work was excellent), per the terms of our signed contract. But we tipped the crew who had done the work all day individually, in cash. It was a tense situation in some ways, but we chose to not make a big stink with the contractor himself, because we were concerned he would retaliate against the guys working for him after they left our property.
Anyway, the whole thing still upsets me when I remember it. And ever since then, whenever ANYONE comes to my husband and I’s property to do any sort of work, big or small, we always offer them a cold drink throughout the day while they work, or to provide lunch, or set out a box of donuts for breakfast if they get going early, etc. Because I’m our opinion… it’s the little things like that which can show kindness, sensitivity and care when it comes to fellow human beings in any number of situations, and make a difference in their day, and be part of a change in how we all interact with one another.
Just my perspective. I do not disagree at all with what you are saying about the importance of “upstream” factors in terms of achieving positive societal change. But to be honest, I don’t have much faith in the government doing a great job at much of anything. Because big bureaucracies can move really slow, and screw stuff up with poorly thought out policy, for unintentional reasons… and then the “downstream impact” becomes a case study in unintended consequences. So I admittedly often focus intently on my ability to do something downstream, in my own small way in certain situations, just to treat other human beings, no matter who they are, where they come from, or what their occupation and net worth is, with a certain amount of dignity and respect. I’m certainly not a perfect person though, and don’t mean to come off sanctimonious. Just to share a different perspective with you, in case it is of interest.
When it comes to wealthy white female equestrians treating grooms poorly, or behaving as though they are invisible, for one reason or another, it bothers me tremendously. I’m not wealthy enough or good enough to have grooms of any sort. But for anyone who is reading the thread who does… and who wants to be part of a more positive, kind and inclusive sport that is less elitist, maybe consider offering those who work in the barn for you lunch more regularly, and actually sitting down and sharing a cup of coffee, donut, Gatorade or sandwich with them in the barn. Seriously… break bread with your fellow human being. No matter the race, creed, or socioeconomic background. Breaking bread together is an ancient human gesture of sorts. A simple thing that anyone can do, if they so choose, to be more inclusive, less elitist, and more welcoming. It won’t fix the world, but it might really make someone else’s day a heck of a lot less miserable.
Sorry for going on too long. Just wanted to share that thought since I first raised the whole “Mexican groom” story.
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Except that’s not their job. No one appointed this site or its employees the spokesperson for a sport or for anything else. Op eds and thought provoking articles? Certainly. There was a lovely article written by an African American gentleman that was thought provoking, and I appreciated and valued his contribution. But that will be the last thing I read on EN.
That’s different than a “journalist” deciding to go on a personal vendetta and rampage. Unfortunately, Boards are bound by certain rules - and board communications are private. But what we do know is that this “journalist” (and yes I’m putting quotes around the word for a reason), attempted to coerce, threaten, and intimidate.
That’s not journalism. That’s extortion.
And she made good on her threats by going to the New York Times - who of course put an election and partisan spin on her version of the incident, further embarrassing the landowner and the Board. If there was any possibility for detente - that evaporated when the journalist went to the press. I thought that was rather childish. “Oh, yeah? I can’t have what I want? stomp stomp stomp get me the editor of the NYT, that will show them.”
A rather chilling comment by the owner of EN is that he knew the demise of this extremely important venue was a potential outcome. And he was fine with it. But again - who made him the arbiter? Was he tasked by the USEA to root out unbelievers? Was he given a list of venues to target? How about sponsors? I didn’t call the guy up and tell him to sic the dogs on the landowner. Did you? Did anyone? No.
Or did this publication simply take its own line, abandon some pretty darn basic journalistic principles, attempt to force a desired outcome that was impossible given the timeline they demanded, wave their di** around, and walk away after making good on threats and destroy a venue that is a pivotal one for everyone - from the beginning eventer, to the cash poor ammie struggling to pay entry fees, to newcomers from ALL walks of life who are interested in the sport.
One of the ways you know you’re dealing with fanatics is how they minimize and devalue the impact they have on others. If the person is willing to destroy other people for “the cause” - you’re dealing with a fanatic. If the person is willing to engage in smear campaigns against innocent people, go on rampages, threaten, you’re dealing with a fanatic. (right wing left wing doesn’t matter). Or, at the very least, you’re dealing with someone who may be emotionally unbalanced. Regardless - it’s destined to be a disaster. And oh look. A disaster happened. Even the knuckle draggers on Twitter had a field day with it. Way to promote the sport!
There is an art to diplomacy. If there was a serious issue with this venue, what was called for was tact, reason, respectful discourse, with a goal to arriving at a mutually agreeable outcome. Even if private discussions were strained or difficult - the most likely outcome would have been a compromise.
And everyone would have come out of this a winner. For the sport, for diversity and inclusion, and for reputations. That’s not the luxury of looking at this incident in hindsight, or Monday Morning Quarterbacking. That’s basic common sense.
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Wingstem for President!
May I suggest you choose Bug as your running mate? Such a neat horse. If he’s unavailable given his competition obligations, my dog says she will happily step in. She’s a sweetheart, and as kind and loyal as they come. But does have a troubling tendency to shove her nose in people’s private personal space, uninvited, and then take a long deep sniff… and that probably COULD be a liability on the campaign trail. :winkgrin:
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I am voting for SMOD.
(Sweet Meteor of Death)
Just end it already.
Seriously though - I’m not picking on an individual poster or honestly held opinions written by them. I am merely drilling down to the very core issue. The core issue isn’t actually diversity and inclusion. The core issue that that this publication screwed the pooch.
And for the recent poster who noticed that EN is promoting Morven Park - yes it is ironic isn’t it.
Had EN and its journalist simply owned up and accepted responsibility for causing a furor, regrouped, and approached the subject differently, perhaps people wouldn’t have been so angry. But it’s interesting to see that they don’t accept any responsibility for the incident, even though they are in fact responsible for the entire mess. That’s very telling to me.
I work with and evaluate a number of people who, because they are new, are going to make mistakes. Bad ones. Potentially dangerous ones. It’s ok to make mistakes. What I tell these people is that yes, you are going to make mistakes. How you DEAL with those mistakes, and how you DEAL with failure and constructive criticism is what matters. For the people who make mistakes, accept feedback, work to improve - those people will be successful. For the ones who are petulant, insist it’s someone else’s fault, refuse to accept responsibility… they don’t last long. It’s all about attitude.
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EN went on a rampage? 
Because they tried to foster discussion for several months? They may not have gone about it the best way (I have no idea if they did because I still don’t think we have enough info to judge) but this seems like an extreme take on what happened.
Do you really feel Boyds reaction is helping the cause? Can posters here really support that type of petty back and forth between both parties?
So the best method to fix this, for all the UL riders who don’t support EN now is for them to demand they not be covered? How does that help eventing, the community, or anyone at this point?
Riders can keep saying “EN is just a blog” all they want, but in reality they are the biggest news source in NA focused on eventing. They are more than a blog these days. They are trusted news source for us all.
Those who know me know I have never been a huge supporter of EN, I hate that they ignore the big issues like ML, and horses being bought for riders who repeatedly break them down, or those who are total jerks at events. But I have a hard time wanting to boycott them for them pressing an issue they felt was right.
It seems from the outside that people who knew the owners knew he would freak out about this, and so they are really mad that they would dare tickle that bear, knowing he might explode.
Waiting for Boyd to drop those emails he says he has to back up how horrible EN is. Until then I’m stuck on a fence thinking both sides made mistakes in this.
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Wingstem for president!
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- There appears to have been no discussion. It was a demand. The board cannot divulge board communications but having served on plenty of boards and knowing what constraints they have to work under - I can read between the lines. Combined with the comments by EN (including the journalists FB posts which if she is smart - will never make similar posts again) indicate that EN was not acting in a journalistic capacity - but furthering a personal agenda and literally picking a fight where no fight needed to happen.
When I see journalists and their publications acting in this manner - it affects their credibility. In fact - I go back to another piece written by this journalist about her being a victim of sexual abuse, as well as a recorded interview. I just don’t find her credible anymore. And once a person has lost their credibility - good luck getting anyone to listen to you. You may feel differently, which is perfectly acceptable.
I don’t know Mr. Martin, and his writings on this subject are colored by a bias - as he sits on the Board. But… knowing what constraints he must work under… again I can read between the lines.
EN did in fact threaten the landowner and the Board. That was a grave error.
I’m not calling for a boycott - it’s immaterial to me what people choose to read. Perhaps EN will recover some of the credibility that it’s lost. Or perhaps eventers don’t care as long as there’s a chance their name and photo will appear in the publication.
The ones on the sidelines who watched this incident unfold are the ones you need to worry about. Sponsors, advertisers, and landowners. Your sport is nothing without the support of the horse industry as a whole. A publication that feels comfortable targeting a landowner is one that will target a sponsor, advertiser - anyone.
A prospective venue owner might not want to get involved in a sport where this sort of thing happens to an innocent person. A lot of you googled this landowner, trying to find out more about him. Which is fine. Now… turn the tables. Someone working in advertising, someone who is approached about opening up their land, googles eventing or some of the key players - to learn about what they’re getting into. And what pops up is an article in the NY times, perhaps this thread, and the other articles written about this landowner.
Now… think about this from the owners perspective. Will they say yes - bring all these people onto my land, build the jumps, I’ll make the enormous personal and financial commitment, go through all the headaches with insurance coverage, permits, traffic control, etc, and hopefully I won’t get sued or have my family name smeared across the NYT.
Eventing is like having the crazy hot girlfriend. Yeah, she’s hot and all that but is it worth the crazy.
This sport appears to put some effort into cultivating newcomers, and broadening appeal. And yet - that’s not what appears at the top of a google search, unless you google the definition of eventing.
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I see Boyd’s reaction more along the lines of - You (EN) have shown me recently that I can not trust you to print a fair article about a topic so I am choosing to not be interviewed by you.
Some people do not feel like you do, that just because EN did good in the past that they have to blindly go along with them now. EN showed a side that makes it fair that some people want to look the other way and not play in their sandbox anymore.
A topic I do not know about, but more than one person has stated here that the board can not legally share those communications. I wonder if EN could share them?
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Does anyone remember the below editorial Eventing Nation (and all the other Nation Media channels) published in early June? Did you read it? It’s… troubling. A couple word choices struck me as problematic at best and tropes at worst (bolded for easy scanning). I emailed them at the time asking them to consider revising, as did many others presumably. Leslie Wylie replied personally to say she hadn’t read the piece carefully enough before giving it the green light. They revised by changing around some words (what you’ll see on the website if you look today), but the thrust of the piece remained unchanged.
Based on timelines I’ve seen thrown around, it seems that EN began pushing for the Plantation name change just a couple weeks after publishing the below piece. How does a news site go from publishing an apologists’ manifesto like the below to leading the charge against an event’s incorporated name in just 3 weeks?? Or… maybe more to the point, how is it that a news site can go through an internal about-face but be seemingly unwilling or unyielding in allowing any other entities the same opportunity to revise or reconsider??
Part of the Greater Community
June 3, 2020
2020 has certainly been a year to remember, in more ways than one. Glaciers continue to melt, but new dinosaur species have been discovered. The COVID-19 pandemic struck, and the stock market crashed. Horse shows stopped, but now they’re beginning again. Businesses suffered, and some won’t recover. Some major equestrian events won’t even return. On top of it all, this past weekend, we’ve seen protests, riots, and outrage over police brutality incidents – most recently with the death of George Floyd. On Friday night, May 29, rioters’ actions were so intense that the President and his family were taken to the White House bunker for safety.
Riots, looting, and further violence are breaking out across the nation — and they’re not just confined to big cities. I live in a suburb that backs up to cornfields in Illinois. Only a few minutes’ drive away is an affluent suburb where further violence took place last night in the cute little downtown area, including explosive devices and trash cans set on fire by looters. Naturally, the poor shop owners who were looking forward to opening again as Illinois enters Phase 3 in the COVID-19 recovery aren’t able to welcome residents looking to enjoy the day.
It’s time that humans looked beyond the violence. I call these people in the streets “rioters,” not “protesters,” because protests involve perhaps a march, signs, organization. There is a true purpose to whatever the protest is about. A riot is when things go too far. There is a point where the primal side of humans claws through the skin like a parasite emerging. It antagonizes. Fear begets fear.
Differences are a natural part of merely existing — our planet is enormous, and with that comes people of different races. Institutional racism has long threaded its way through history with its pointed needle and lack of thimble for protection. Across communities, people have been driven to the breaking point with acts of racism and repeated incidents of police brutality. “Enough is enough,” they say.
Rebellion has been used many a time in the past to defend liberty. Look at the Boston Tea Party. Say good-bye to massive crates of English tea being thrown into the harbor. I wish, though, that there was a way for humans to act like “people,” as we theoretically evolved away from the cavemen versions of ourselves thousands of years ago.
Why am I writing this on a site that covers hunter/jumper news and the equestrian community? The answer is simple. At times, we do live in an isolated community. We go to the barn, ride our horses, have a San Pellegrino in the lounge with our barn buddies, and go home. However, we make up a part of a wider community — one that’s determined, at least in part, to destroy itself. Freedom of speech, equality, and peace are what this country was founded on. It’s not where we’re heading. I want to get us mulling on how to speak our minds, but without the violence. It’s time to stop the madness.
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In my opinion, no one has acted immaculately in this entire situation, but this has to be the most ridiculous response from anyone. Do you think Marilyn Little was having a lovely time when photos of her and her horses’ bleeding mouths were scattered all over internet blogs (including, but not limited to, Eventing Nation)? Of course not. But at least she didn’t post all over her Facebook page about how she revoked her permission for people to publish images of her that they owned. That they took of a public figure at a public event. At least she recognized that such a statement would amount to nothing more than a publicity stunt.
Boyd doesn’t have a great history of being concerned about the problems of other people. Women in the sport who struggle to get owners, including those at a time they might have family? Not sure what their problem is, it’s not like they have a disadvantage. His teammate who doesn’t feel supported by the federation on questionable judging calls? He sounds like a dick, he’s should stop whining. (I’m not paraphrasing or being crass. He quite literally called his teammate “a dick”).
And before I’m asked: he said all of this point-blank in just ONE interview with the Major League Eventing podcast. He’s reinforced these views and more elsewhere, but if you need a direct source, I recommend starting there.
He’s an exceptional rider and a very hard worker, but I wouldn’t consider him overly concerned about barriers faced by others in the sport. To a certain extent, it’s not his fault – to be as successful as he is, you need to believe that you alone can control the outcome. If you recognize that the starting blocks for you are in a different place than they are for some other people, that undermines your mindset. But not everyone is fortunate enough to have what Boyd was born with, and I’m not talking about innate riding ability.
You are fortunate to have a choice (that is awarded to you by the colour of your skin).
If you choose not to look at the world through a lens of those who have privilege and those who do not, you might hurt some people’s feelings. If a black man chooses not to look at the world through a lens of those who have privilege and those who do not, he’s likely to be shot the next time he’s pulled over by police (you know, for “being scary” or something).
That difference in consequence is privilege, whether you choose to see it or not.
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Just a few posts from more recent pages that really hit home for me – thank you for your contributions.
Agreed completely on all counts.
Your whole post was excellent. But this, in particular, was perfect. In a very troubling sort of way.
This thread has been really difficult for me, too, but I am so glad you have made the contributions you did. Long before I became a user on the forums, I read along and considered them a litmus test of what the community as a whole was thinking. Without posters like you, this thread starts to look very one-sided to the outside observer. Thank you for contributing your thoughts, even when it’s upsetting.
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It’s so weird the things people will conflate.
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This, I can agree with.
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That is NOT how I feel at all. Please don’t put words/feelings in my mouth. I was pointing out the entitledness of it all, happy with En for years and years for the good press, tantrum over the bad press. As an elite athlete in the public eye who is a roll model you have to be able to hold yourself together a little better than that.
We have no proof EN threatened to go to the big media, do we? Or that they threatened the land owner or extorted them. Or have ya’ll seen something I have not?
An article in the NYT is not proof of this. Plenty of equestrians who are journalists out there who may have taken an interest. It is very possible they did, but it is also possible they didn’t. We don’t have the info.
We don’t know if the board can share emails, that would be in their by laws. Often they can, in the name of clarity if there is a vote in agreement to do so. But, none of us here are privy to their by laws.
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