Fake Horse Buyer Scam

[OverandOnward]

ANY payment that is for more than the item price, usually claiming to cover shipping or transport (with a story behind it), is a huge RED FLAG.

This is currently a major scam. The buyer convinces the seller to make the payment to a “transport company”, or pays the hauler in person, because the seller believes they’ve already been reimbursed by the buyer. The transporter leaves with the goods.

The payment will bounce, but the seller won’t know it right away. The seller ends up out the goods and the transport money because the transporter/shipper is part of the scam. This is done with live animals including horses and cattle (they cost a lot to transport so they are a great target), furniture, anything in major quantities.

Right now it is very easy for scammers to pass off bad payments of almost any kind other than cash.

The banking system’s payment clearing processes are antiquated, even if they are on zippy software and infrastructure. There are too many steps, firewalls and ponderous communications steps, especially bank-to-bank. Supposedly all that rigamarole protects assets, but actually it doesn’t.

[TBROCKS]

I bought one of my current horses based off a picture on the CANTER website. Best horse ever. I wouldn’t sell one to someone I never met, though.

[classicrocky]

I have sold horses sight unseen several times and it worked out perfectly. The first time, I flew out there in one instance and met the woman before the horses shipped out and helped her acclimate them. However, I would never take payment that included the shipper’s fee - I agree that’s a huge red flag.

I also will never take payment on horses via paypal. I will take cash, or in the case of long distance buyers, checks or postal money order with the requirement that they don’t leave the property without the check or USPS money order clearing the bank. The main reason I won’t take paypal is the massive amount of money they take as a transaction fee - made that mistake once and won’t do it again! Good to know about the 45 day dispute too, though.

[Nootka]

I was sent a $25000 bank of america check for a 8500 horse. Took bank a min to figure it was fake then the FBI called me. They said it was a person from Nigeria but they were last located in Canada

[Kwill]

You can google a buyer’s name, at least that way you have some idea who they might be if it seems suspicious.

Craigslist is just as scary sometimes … I always meet in a public place but a horse isn’t quite so easy.

I have bought plenty of horses sight unseen but there at least have been a lot of phone conversations.

[OverandOnward]

[QUOTE=classicrocky;8102790]
… I will take cash, or in the case of long distance buyers, checks or postal money order with the requirement that they don’t leave the property without the check or USPS money order clearing the bank. …[/QUOTE]

Here is the gap in this seemingly sound policy. After a standard wait time, banks often make funds available before the check actually clears (pays).

Banks have a standard wait time for available funds based on check amount etc., but they are merely lowering the risk of a bounce, not ensuring a check has time to clear. Of course the bank doesn’t want many NSF’s after funds were already available, but the bank isn’t the party suffering the loss on a bounced check (in fact they make money on fees).

The truth is that the bank customer can never know exactly when the check is truly paid and safe - they will only know if that doesn’t happen and it bounces. And it can take as long as 2 weeks for an NSF to rattle back through the system to the depositor’s account (theoretically even longer is possible).

Scammers are working this system. They know how to use bank location, size, etc to find the longest possible time for true check clearing. But the seller/depositor’s bank makes funds available in only 3 or 5 days. The most effective scams know how to ensure 7 or 10 business days before the grim news makes its way back to the seller/depositor’s own bank. By then the seller’s goods (or horse) are long gone.

For a sizable check from an individual I personally would wait at least 2 weeks before releasing the goods. Of course if it is someone known, local and/or with excellent references, a seller might feel more secure that the check is good.