Feed/ration balancers/suppliments

[JB]

[QUOTE=3Spots;7176121]
Hi JB!

Thanks for chiming in. Actually, I am looking at Horseshine, too. It has the highest Omega-3 content of all the flax-based products out there. Most that I have looked at are 7-9 grams of O3 per daily dose. Heck I take that much myself. I think a horse needs 7x my dose, so I look for Omega 3 in the 50-60 gram range.

Horseshine is closest to that – if I did my math right (84000g/lb = 185g O3/g x 235g/cup = 43g O3/cup)

So I am looking at Horseshine for it’s Omega 3 content rather than it’s fortification. (It would seem that if folks were okay with serving 7-9 g/daily dose, they would feed 1/8 of a cup and the bag would last 8 times longer than it says – making it much less expensive.)

At least that is my logic for today, lol
jan[/QUOTE]
So why not just feed whole flax? Much cheaper, more Omega 3

@Dune;7176126

This is getting boring, lol! I agree with JB on ditching the RB and just going with a vit/min supplement. I’ve been feeding mine Adeptus Augment, I mix it with a couple cups of Timothy pellets that I soak and they eat it right up! I’m curious, JB, why you recommended the 2 v/m that you did and how they stack up against the AA that I feed?? TIA!

I’m going to have to say something I know you will disagree with just out of principal

in a quick glance at AA (it’s been a long time since I looked at Adeptus products) I don’t see anything offhand that makes either of the 2 I mentioned better or worse. One thing I was trying to get away from was the sometimes really high iron content of commercial feeds, including many v/m supplements. High Point doesn’t have any. AA only has 80mg, so that is pretty low among the ones I’ve looked at recently that had some. For example, Grand Vite has 250mg. Accel has 106gm. Select II has 175mg. I’m sure there are some products out there that have very little or no iron, I just know HP doesn’t I did just double check and unfortunately the EP does have iron. 350ppm is 159mg per pound, but you’re not feeding 1lb for most horses, but the closer to the 1oz/100lb you feed, the more iron you’re feeding. When I fed it, I only used about half the dose.

Other than that, it just boils down to some of the other nutrients that might be specific to your needs. I need more copper and zinc, and could use some extra selenium. I need to keep iron low.

[SuckerForHorses]

[QUOTE=Kay;7176156]
…
And would you stick with the triple crown lite?

I would prefer to not soak or add hay cubes or beat pulp.

I also just want to stress we are talking about a 13.2h drafty healthy pony 7yo that is in heavy work. But it’s still a struggle to keep weight off with a muzzle and next to no feed.[/QUOTE]

Why would you stick with TC Lite? Many posters are telling you that no, you do not need a real “feed” you need vitamins and minerals without the extra calories.

Just use a regular vit/min supplement, or something like EquiPride, or High Point Grass from Horsetech, or something like that.

I like Mega-Cell for a multi-vite, or anything from the HorseTech line.

A pelleted vitamin/mineral supplement would probably go right down the hatch with a pony! Just scoop, dump, consume, no need for beet pulp or hay cubes.

[3Spots]

Hi SAcres -

Is there a source of unfortified flax that is stabilized? I won’t be able to grind it prior to feeding, so I need something I can baggy up.

JB - you are the best! Appreciate letting me pick your brain!

jan

[JB]

You don’t have to grind flax If there are teeth issues, then ground would be better, and the best place I know is Horse TEch, their Nutraflax

[Nezzy]

i am surprised how few people here approve of Ration Balancers. Both of the local vets that work in my area have recommended them to many of us at our barn, b/c our horses have full access to hay at all times. I would suspect the vets of knowing what they are talking about…

[2tempe]

[QUOTE=Nezzy;7176415]
i am surprised how few people here approve of Ration Balancers. Both of the local vets that work in my area have recommended them to many of us at our barn, b/c our horses have full access to hay at all times. I would suspect the vets of knowing what they are talking about…[/QUOTE]

I consulted an equine nutritionist at Univ Florida after my mare’s colic surgery and d she was fully supportive of the RB in addition to her T/A hay, no problem. Only thing she added to the diet was a pre/pro biotic.

[SuckerForHorses]

i am surprised how few people here approve of Ration Balancers

They can speak individually if they want, but my interpretation for THIS THREAD is that the OP has a chunky pony that doesn’t even need the additional 1000 or so calories that a ration balancer provides; not that so few people here approve of them. They just don’t think a ration balancer is the best option in this case.

[tinah]

So how does Source stack up as a vitamin? It seems to be lot cheaper per serving than a lot of them, but I know it’s been around forever, so. . . Is it worth getting when I’ve got 2 chunky QH’s, one high strung WB, and a hard keeping senior TB?

[SuckerForHorses]

[QUOTE=tinah;7176554]
So how does Source stack up as a vitamin? It seems to be lot cheaper per serving than a lot of them, but I know it’s been around forever, so. . . Is it worth getting when I’ve got 2 chunky QH’s, one high strung WB, and a hard keeping senior TB?[/QUOTE]

A hard keeping senior TB is going to benefit more from a true “grain” feed, fortified concentrate, whatever you want to call it. Like TC Senior, Blue Seal Sentinel Senior or Performance LS, etc. And that, if fed at teh daily recommended amount, will provide the horse with adequate vitamins and minerals with no need to add the Source supplement (provided the rest of the diet doesn’t leave any gaps of course).

Vitamin/Mineral Supplements are for horses who don’t need any more calories. Like overweight ponies, easy keepers/air ferns, etc.

Ration balancers are for those horses who won’t be negatively affected by ~1000 or so calories addional each day and need vitamins and minerals. More calories than a supplement but less calories than a fortified concentrate/grain/meal whathaveyou.

A true feed is for horses who need calories to keep weight on and vitamin and mineral requirements. Like TC Senior, TC Complete, even TC Lite.

[JB]

[QUOTE=SuckerForHorses;7176514]
They can speak individually if they want, but my interpretation for THIS THREAD is that the OP has a chunky pony that doesn’t even need the additional 1000 or so calories that a ration balancer provides; not that so few people here approve of them. They just don’t think a ration balancer is the best option in this case.[/QUOTE]

Exactly

[SAcres]

[QUOTE=3Spots;7176272]
Hi SAcres -

Is there a source of unfortified flax that is stabilized? I won’t be able to grind it prior to feeding, so I need something I can baggy up.

JB - you are the best! Appreciate letting me pick your brain!

jan[/QUOTE]

Either grind it before feeding or just feed it whole. I have 6 horses on whole flax, aged 7-21, none have issues with eating it and I have a barn full of shiny dappled horses…I guess it is doing something for them!

@Nezzy;7176415

i am surprised how few people here approve of Ration Balancers. Both of the local vets that work in my area have recommended them to many of us at our barn, b/c our horses have full access to hay at all times. I would suspect the vets of knowing what they are talking about…

I don’t think anyone here disapproves of ration balancers. I have 4 horses on ration balancers in my barn! But your typical air fern easy keeper doesn’t need the calories a RB provides, so it makes sense to go with a multi-vite. Plus they’re “usually” a little cheaper than a ration balancer.

@tinah;7176554

So how does Source stack up as a vitamin? It seems to be lot cheaper per serving than a lot of them, but I know it’s been around forever, so. . . Is it worth getting when I’ve got 2 chunky QH’s, one high strung WB, and a hard keeping senior TB?

Personally I would not feed source in place of a multi-vitamin. I’m sure people do and have lovely results with it, but the guaranteed analysis is seriously lacking so you really have no idea what exactly your horse is getting.

[JB]

Source is not a complete v/m supplement like is typically talked about. I DO think it’s a nice product to be cycled in and out of a yearly diet, maybe 2 weeks out of each month, or for a month out of each quarter, something like that.

[Dune]

Triple Crown also carries a ground flax product now, about $30 for a 25lb bag. That’s on my grocery list right now.

[SuckerForHorses]

[QUOTE=Dune;7177574]
Triple Crown also carries a ground flax product now, about $30 for a 25lb bag. That’s on my grocery list right now. ;-)[/QUOTE]

I fed this, OmegaMax I think its called. Really, after I realized that I can get 50 lbs of flax seeds for only $32.00 where I am, I stopped paying lots of money for fancy flax and let them chew up their own seeds to save me money. They look just as good.

[pattnic]

@pattnic;7175994

Is High Point a pellet or is it more powdery/crumbly like Equi-Pride and most of the other Horsetech products (BioFlax, Glaenzen, etc)?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=JB;7176091]It’s a meal type, but closer to a powder than, say, the meal type that rice bran can be, that Equipride is. You can also have HT flavor it.

Hmmm… any ideas on a good pelleted vit/min supplement? I’ve tried the flavored Horsetech products; I think they taste fine, but the horses don’t seem to think so. So sad… I really love Horsetech - they’re an Iowa company with great products and great customer service.

I feel like there are fewer choices for vit/min sups now than there were a few years ago. I used to like the SmartVite line, but now that they’ve changed it so much, I’m not sure so I’m a fan.

[JB]

I know several folks who like the Uckele v/m, though I have no idea how mineraly they smell or how palatable they are.

[fordtraktor]

That’s what I use, JB (the Sport Horse Grass ones) and they are reasonably palatable. All my horses eat them fine.

I tried buying flax in bulk once and mine smelled strongish/bad after about a month. Anyone else have that problem?

[SuckerForHorses]

I tried buying flax in bulk once and mine smelled strongish/bad after about a month. Anyone else have that problem?

Was it whole or already ground?

I get whole seeds, I don’t grind it at all, and it lasts me two months without any issue at all. Probably would last longer, that is just the time it takes for me to feed it out so I don’t know how long it would go without an issue.

[JB]

[QUOTE=fordtraktor;7177732]

I tried buying flax in bulk once and mine smelled strongish/bad after about a month. Anyone else have that problem?[/QUOTE]
Whole flax will stay fresh for a really long time, as long as it’s kept dry enough. Was it whole flax you got? I’d say moisture got to it if it was smelling funky at only a month. If it was ground, then unless it was also stabilized, yes, it will start going bad fairly quickly

[fordtraktor]

It was whole, and should have been dry but it was spring so maybe it was a bit humid. Anyway, it was in my tack room, in a bucket, on a concrete floor. I was a bit mystified and soured on the whole flax endeavor, esp since my horses don’t like the taste as well as they like HorseShine.