Gentle reminder of hunt field etiquette (and I'm probably as guilty as the next person . . .)

[mvp]

@Lusoluv

If totally ignoring the chatty know-it-all (regardless of age) wasn’t enough of a hint to shake her off, wouldn’t a polite, “Please stop talking” be sufficient? No need to explain DD’s credentials, make introductions or anything else…

The above statement works well when unwanted advice is offered during show ring warm up, trailer-loading and just about any other stressful difficulty that is encountered with horses

I think it would be rude and ill-advised for a new member or guest to tell and older- and established member of the hunt what to do.

I know it seems odd in the 21st century US of A, particularly with the crass and outspoken person we put into the Oval Office (because, so many voters said, “they didn’t always like what he said, but they liked it that he said it”… but! The hunt field is one of those throw-back, uber-hierarchical places. It doesn’t matter what the established member does wrong: the younger and newbie is supposed to be polite in response.

And the hierarchy being All, if you have a problem with that member that amounts to a non-petty issue, you “go to the proper authority” which is the Master of whatever field you are in.

That’s all, no more, no less. And no saying nothing and nursing a grudge or schooling someone on the interwebz after the fact anonymously.

[Foxglove]

mvp I appreciate your response and that of others. First, this was not our usual hunt group so the older member was unfamiliar to both of us. The hilltop master chose to over look the issue --and is not the same hilltop master who occasionally has opportunity to chide me for talking to my horse too much. If DD and I were to regularly ride-out with this hunt, I would urge her to acquaint herself with the older rider and specifically that she (in the club house) seek the woman’s input, then conclude with, “Mrs. Grey, you are so kind to help me with your suggestions --could we speak again next meet --but please not on the hunt field --I do so worry that talk is inappropriate.” Then should Mrs. Grey again approach her on the hunt field, daughter should hold a finger to her lips and whisper --“oh, do tell me later!” as often as necessary. I think that would “Feed the Need” Mrs. Grey has to show her expertise, and would be polite, and fix the problem. DD could then (mentally) discard all the advise. However, we will likely not be out with this group again for a couple of years . . .

[mvp]

@Foxglove

mvp I appreciate your response and that of others. First, this was not our usual hunt group so the older member was unfamiliar to both of us. The hilltop master chose to over look the issue --and is not the same hilltop master who occasionally has opportunity to chide me for talking to my horse too much. If DD and I were to regularly ride-out with this hunt, I would urge her to acquaint herself with the older rider and specifically that she (in the club house) seek the woman’s input, then conclude with, “Mrs. Grey, you are so kind to help me with your suggestions --could we speak again next meet --but please not on the hunt field --I do so worry that talk is inappropriate.” Then should Mrs. Grey again approach her on the hunt field, daughter should hold a finger to her lips and whisper --“oh, do tell me later!” as often as necessary. I think that would “Feed the Need” Mrs. Grey has to show her expertise, and would be polite, and fix the problem. DD could then (mentally) discard all the advise. However, we will likely not be out with this group again for a couple of years . . .

That’s a very nice way to handle it.

That “disinhibition” of the old folks. I swear to God, someone is going to get slapped. I mean, I spent my whole life being told to respect age for the wisdom it brings. That said, and my having really internalized the habit of valuing competence, knowledge and experience, I find myself way, way unwilling to cut oldsters-acting-like-toddlers the same slack I might cut a toddler.

And then some day— maybe today!-- Someone will read this post and think I’m suffering from disinhibition, too. LOL.

[SWatson]

For the past several years I have been reading about and learning all I can about riding out with a hunt, and today while reading the Hunting forum, a long-standing fear of mine was tackled LOL! I have often contemplated what would I do if someone chatted with me in the field - I’m terrified of breaking etiquette and I just know something like this will happen to me.
I learn so much from all of you. Someday, I hope to put knowledge into practice.

[Foxglove]

Thank you, SWatson --I hope you ride out soon --you are just the kind of considerate, thoughtful person that make a hunt fun!

[Tiramit]

I’ve found completely ignoring rude people who won’t stop talking, no matter the hint, works wonders. As in, not making eye contact, reacting, commenting, etc. That person ceases to exist. No cold shoulder, but it’s as if they vanished. People tend to get embarrassed talking to themselves and eventually clam up.

If someone says something later, make an excuse about being caught up in the beauty and magic of the hunt and failing to notice anything else, lol.

[KBC]

@McGurk

I was out on a very reactive OTTB and we were going through a rough field with tall grass and briars, and horse was humping his back every time something hit his belly. A well-meaning member rode up beside me and said - “Be careful, honey - he looks like he’s going to go up.”

Ya think? And what do you suggest I do about it? Teleport outta here?

.

Bwhahahaha…

[Foxglove]

KBC and McGurk --I may have posted this before (old and forgetful) but the absolute worst of annoying people while hunting --thank goodness this woman is no longer hunting --was a woman older than me at the time (although I am sure I am older than she now) who actually followed me deliberately --constantly saying, “Your horse has a loose shoe, your horse has a loose shoe! I can hear your horse has a loose shoe! Can’t you hear your horse has a loose shoe!” --and no matter how many times I told her he did not --she kept up. And there was a definite tell-tale click, step, click, step when we crossed roads --BUT my horse is UNSHOD --the horse she heard was her own who had a loose shoe! At one point I finally GOT OFF and held up my horse’s foot and said --“he’s unshod!” --her answer --“He must have lost it.” And we were back to to click-step, click-step —and her telling me my horse had a loose shoe. And I could go on about this woman —her rainbow scarf she wore around her neck --because it was pretty --the time she rode out in her PJ bottoms because it was cold --the time her stirrup felloff but she would not put on a new stirrup leather (I carry them as do most fox hunters using them as a belt) because “It was her grandfathers and she didn’t want to change any part of it.” Maybe this should be a new thread --what’s the most annoying aspect of fox hunting —although right now I’d have to say, The Weather!! I’ve so far missed THREE WEEKS of hunting because I can’t get to the hunt club —two weeks ago I actually got half way there when I turned back when my trailer started sliding at stop lights (sideways) --despite all proper hitches and tow vehicle --decided I’d survive a slide into a ditch, but my lovely hunter might not . . .last week ice storm predicted to start right as I was leaving --and 3 feet of snow on the ground --not much point . . . sigh . . .hoping for next week ---- I would put up with an entire field of annoying people telling my my shoe was loose just to hunt out in good weather.

[McGurk]

Oh, Foxglove! I hear you!

When I was working for an MFH and hunting by professional’s privilege, part of my job was to babysit an old, frail and uhhhhh, eccentric! eccentric is a good word! senior member at the back of the field and get gates for her when she chose not to jump.

It was an interesting experience. I tried to remind myself I was the luckiest of people, getting paid to hunt, out on a really good horse on a beautiful day, but sometimes, the fifth time she’d look at me and say “Who are you again? Who are you people?” it got a little old.

I also had to explain to a member very politely that it would be perhaps better to start asking their horse to stop sooner, rather than just continually run her horse into my horse’s rear end to stop. This was after I offered to let her go in front of me repeatedly, and she declined, because the next the horse in front kicked. I believe she actually thought that was an acceptable method of stopping her horse.

[Foxglove]

McGurk --that’s a great story! We have a bar at the hunt club and sometimes people come in from hunt having not eaten, and well, maybe drink more than they should before the brunch is laid. There have been two bar fights in the years I’ve been a member --and the first one was due to a man who said to the woman at the bar --“I love riding behind you because when my horse won’t stop, I just run into yours and it doesn’t kick!” At first it was a pleasant, “I don’t want you to ever do that again,” Then the gentlemen member pressed the issue with a “I’m going to ride behind you every hunt,” and then one of those "Can’t you take a joke’ when she (loudly) called him out on that and told him he was a poor rider --to which he took offence and push came to shove before the staff stepped in and quieted things down . . .the other fight some years later was more exciting, but I suppose one shouldn’t tell tales . . .unless you really want to hear . . .

[KBC]

I haven’t hunted since I was a teenager, and then we were carefully chaperoned, kept away from people, told to “sit up and shut up” ahh those were the days…seen and not heard, and never in the way…

[McGurk]

unless you really want to hear

What do you think? :yes::yes::yes::yes::yes:

PS - Parties at the clubhouse usually had an open bar and some…interesting discussions, but the only fight I ever saw was at a neighboring hunt’s clubhouse and it was two women fighting over a man. Don’t pick a fight with a horsewoman, that’s all I’m saying.

[Foxglove]

Ok, since you’ve insisted McGurk --but first to KBC --we had the pony club out last fall. One tiny rider on an adorable pony was with us. Clearly she had been told not to speak on the hunt field. Master of the Hounds rode by (he’s incredibly regal looking) with the pack and paused in front of her on his grand, tall Thoroughbred. He smiled and said, “What’s your pony’s name?” The little girl was clearly in agony --should she speak? Finally she whispered: “Dandelion” as softly as she could. Huntsman nodded, said “Fine name for a hunter,” and rode off. She was crying! Awwww —thought it was a test of some sort. We told her that one must always answer questions from staff and she’d done correctly.

Off to the most splendid bar fight ever at the hunt club —It had been a long hunt and perhaps everyone was a little tired and the libations flowed rapidly at the hunt bar. A lady member who was on the small side, maybe 5 feet tall was perched on a stool, telling those within earshot that her nice mare had been roughly shouldered aside on a run by a passing gentlemen member, and insult to injury, she’d been totally showered in mud as he passed. We are all used to mud, so that wasn’t so much the issue as the gentleman’s actually making contact with her horse (we are all protective of our horses). The group was sympathetic as the gentleman’s horse was overly bold at times as was he.

When the gentleman in question entered the bar, the lady member stood up and said, to the effect of: "You better not ever touch my horse again! Expletive Name. " He was said, “F*** off.” and pushed by her, making contact with her with his shoulder (not a big man, but a foot taller than she). What he didn’t know, or had forgotten, she was a a former (or current, not sure) kick boxing champion of Michigan. As he pushed by her, she wheeled around and dropped him --boom. Our bar is not large and people and drinks went flying. He got up, and swung at her --another mistake, as she dropped him again --by now huntsman himself was in and with the help of staff took the gentleman outside and left lady inside. Both were eventually told to keep it civil or quit the club. He quit. She was there for awhile longer, then married and moved away but it back now and then. I’ve seen the gentleman now and then, but never hunting out.

And I might add, that this lady member was one I always tried to ride behind --she rode a horse who was questionable over fences --and delighted in that. When she came off --and she did often enough to make it worth watching her jump, she would ALWAYS land on her feet! She’d been a gymnist in college and had incredible balance and control. Fun girl to ride with --especially for someone like me who is conservative and rides an equally conservative horse.

[McGurk]

Foxglove,

Thanks for sharing! She sounds like my kind of girl! To hunt with and to drink with!

In re: the terrified child rider, one year I got roped into chaperoning a bunch of kids at the Junior Meet. These were kids new to foxhunting, but they had attended clinics and had drilled pretty thoroughly on riding in company and the etiquette and were well prepared. The morning of the meet was bitter cool with a fierce wind, and the kids were all dressed in show clothes - those were the riding clothes they had.

One of the mothers was very concerned and wanted to know if they could wear ski jackets over their riding clothes. Parroting something I had heard my MFH boss say repeatedly, I said as long as the jackets were conservatively colored, they were fine - we wanted the kids to be comfortable. No hot pink or fuschia or crazy patterns, but a dark ski jacket was fine.

Still worried and not trusting my answer, mother asked impeccably turned out crusty curmudgeon senior member wearing colors about the jackets and he harumphed and said the kids should have come out properly dressed and why weren’t they wearing long underwear under their show clothes. Said loudly, in front of everyone.

MFH arrives and says, of course, the kids should wear their ski jackets.

Kids refused. They had been intimidated by grumpy senior member.

I ended up ponying one of the kids back to the trailer an hour later, cold, miserable, crying and unable to continue to hold the reins of her excited pony.

We did not teach a lot of new juniors to love foxhunting that day. You know, the whole point of having a junior meet.

[ecileh]

Not a child-rider story, but it’s one of my favorite experiences I’ve had while hunting…

Our hunt does an Opening Day parade in town and, every other year, we invite another to join us. Their huntsman is a wonderfully gallant and charming fellow and, last time we paraded together, I was behind him as he swept off his patey and bowed low over the pommel of his saddle to tell a little girl spectating that he thought her dress was “quite lovely”.

She flushed to the color of his scarlet and practically swooned.

As we kicked into a trot, she managed to shout “YOU’RE BEAUTIFUL!”

[Foxglove]

Great story ecileh! Love it! McGurk --I have given up trying to mitigate the damage some fox hunters (and other members of other groups) do who are so NEGATIVE toward new [or young]potential members --of course it is fear-based: Old member thinks “New person might be better, nicer, more well-liked than I AM so I better make sure EVERYONE KNOWS how important I and I will be SAFE!” But even knowing that, I find it so challenging to understand and forgive the old [mean] member.

I adore my hunt club! It is the highlight of my week during season --but I’ve been a member so long I can at least mentally say “Sod off” to anyone who is unpleasant --but honestly, all the unpleasant people have died off, or moved to FL --the club is mostly people my age and younger (and younger and younger). I am glad to say that “our” generation is nicer to the young folk and new folk. Instead of snickering about poor turn out --we GIVE hunt coats, vests, boots, breeches to new/young members who need those things.

But it isn’t just hunt clubs —I joined a trail riding club for about two weeks —really gave it a thorough try --the MEMBERS literally drove me [and my riding buddy] away with their “funny names” for new comers, their “Jokes” they played on us --the flat out contempt for our “newness” and our enthusiasm was off-putting. And then one of the “board members” came by and asked if we’d be coming to more rides --my friend and I nicely, and politely, explained why we would not --and the answer we were given? “Oh, we do that to everybody who is new.” --like that makes it ok! And they wonder why no one is joining! But --that is enough about the topic --as my mom said: Say nice things to people, talk about pleasant topics, and always compliment the rider’s horse. You’ll have plenty of friends! --and my hunt club friends are among my best and longest friends --so ma must have been right!

[Willesdon]

I am enjoying the way this thread has moved from a post about good manners in the field to a physical punch up in the club house

[McGurk]

Foxglove,

I agree! The MFH I worked for got it! He was very gracious to newcomers and kids, sometimes inviting them to ride up front with him so he could explain what was going on. I will paraphrase him as saying “New members are not going to be willing to ride in the back for 10 years and wait for someone to die before they can move up close enough to see hound work. If they don’t get to see what the sport is about, how can we expect them to love and support it,”

That said, I will now tell a positive story.

Another local hunt, newer and more welcoming, has a connection to our Pony Club, and had a special, reduced Pony Club cap. So I took two of my PC students there, one on her pony, one of one of my schoolies. It was a long haul, and I underestimated, so by the time we got to the meet, unloaded and got on, hounds were moving off. We did manage to greet the huntsman and the MFH properly on our way to the back of the first flight, but still!

To non foxhunters, late arrivals are RUDE for members; VERY, VERY RUDE for guests. You are supposed to arrive in time to find the Field Secretary and pay your cap, and formally introduce guests to the MFH and field masters. Arriving as hounds move off is bad, and we were lucky they moved off towards the trailers, not away, so we could at least say our good mornings.

Well, we had a fabulous day. A near perfect day. Couple of good runs, great hound work, kids were thrilled, horses acquitted themselves nicely. We stayed out until the hounds were called in. We are hacking back to the trailers and it’s only the MFH (whom I knew) 2-3 regular members, me, and these two keen kids left. The kids who are now being chatted up by the members.

I sidle up to the MFH, apologize profusely and try to hand over the capping fees. He shakes his head, reins in, turns to the other members and says “I think juniors who ride this well and stay out after most of the regular membership has gone in should have caps waived. What do you think?”

And the other members heartily agreed.

The kids were speechless they were so thrilled. And thrilled again when I handed the cash back to the parents and explained why.

It wasn’t a lot of money, in the great scheme of the things. And maybe the MFH just didn’t want to bother tracking down the Field Secretary. But it made a huge impression, and both those kids continued to hunt and eventually got their buttons.

[Foxglove]

What a wonderful, kind gesture!

[SLW]

A few years back a sweet Mom contacted me about her two daughters attending our Youth Hunt. Older daughter was suitably mounted but she was befuddled on which pony to bring for her fearless 7 year old. The saintly aged, packer pony who would need bute to get through the hunt or the POA who events. I was like “The saintly aged, slightly infirm mare is PERFECT for the 7 year olds first hunt, just perfect!!”.

On hunt morning I met the girls and the small, fearless 7 year old was going to hunt the POA, in a snaffle. LOL. After she cantered past me about 3 times saying in a sweet, fearless voice “I can stop Dobbin” and laughing (no fear) I grabbed her left rein and ponyed her. The hunt member in the hound truck tossed me a dog leash which made the next 30 minutes much nicer for my right arm. That young girl was just a hoot and astride a wise POA, it was katy bar the door with that team.