for sport and a possible future WB breeding…I know she was an epic failure as a race horse (two starts, dead last by 20+ lengths in both per the owner).
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/cozzey+kiss
just off the track
Any good at all?
I’ll take her
Seriously. She is very good to excellent in her pedigree. She is sport horse in conformation…no signs of the mister prospector in her conformation. Assuming she looks as good from the front and rear as the side and she had a good temperament I would take her and have a ball breeding her for sport. PatO
I wouldn’t kick her out of my barn, either. Love the pedigree.
Columbus, I’m not sure what you mean by front/back, she’s straight behind (as in, isn’t overly cow hocked or toed in, and doesn’t stand base wide or narrow), front she toed out very slightly when I got her, but as her feet have been corrected, and she’s gotten wider (gone from a Med. Narrow gullet in November to a wide in March) she’s straightened up there as well so its extremely minimal and her wearing is even now.
last weekend (first time jumping since a Greg Best clinic in April)
http://youtu.be/7bbsW_0U8Kw
And right before the clinic (she is barefoot here and slightly sore, which I didn’t notice until the video)
http://youtu.be/NRfTHbmLHmM
Would you guys consider her a good prospect for AHS? Her papers came with her when I was given her, so I’ve had fun dreaming up prospective stallions for her for when my current Banderas is riding age (she’s 12 weeks now…so in about 4-5 years). One guy I like for her is Colour Guard depending on how he does, or possibly C. Quito. I was just wondering if she’s the type of quality that would go premium with them, or if it would be better to stick with RPSI.
Thanks Anne 
I absolutely adore her. I’ve had TB’s pretty much my whole life, and have never had one that is this eager to please and willing, she would literally do anything you asked, and can be pulled out of the field with weeks off and act like she’s been ridden all along, even at her age semi-novices can ride her and she just goes with the flow. Its a nice change from my older TB (dam of the filly) who is very exacting in how she wants to be ridden and you have to be very precise.
She’s about 16.1 and just turned 4, I’m hoping to take her in some baby green local classes over the summer, and get her out to the TB Celebration show in Lexington in November.
Kris S? You just hit the sporthorse motherload!
<<<< Knows nothing about TB lines…other then every Storm Cat I’ve dealt with has been a bit on the crazy side, and that northern dancer/Mr. P aren’t good for soundness issues.
Most of the WB registries that inspect and approve TB mares don’t seem to put much emphasis at all on pedigree. They seem to base their decisions on phenotype primarily or from production. AHS may be different, and it wouldn’t hurt to put together a list of sport horses with impressive credentials who share TB ancestors with your mare.
Oops, sorry. Didn’t phrase that correctly. I meant looking at her confo and video’s, do you think she would stand a chance with AHS? I know she wouldn’t have a problem with RPSI, but was curious about AHS since I know they are more stringent.
[QUOTE=vineyridge;5681237]
Most of the WB registries that inspect and approve TB mares don’t seem to put much emphasis at all on pedigree. They seem to base their decisions on phenotype primarily or from production. AHS may be different, and it wouldn’t hurt to put together a list of sport horses with impressive credentials who share TB ancestors with your mare.[/QUOTE]
It always boggles my mind when you say she is 16.1h. She looks so much bigger, or perhaps that is because most of your horses are smaller? 
Nicole I hope you don’t mind if I derail really quickly…
[QUOTE=Iron Horse Farm;5681117]
Kris S? You just hit the sporthorse motherload![/QUOTE]
Is Kris S better to see in a damline or on the sire’s side? My KWPN mare is out of a TB mare, family 10, which is the same as Laudanum, but also very closely related through the damline to Kris S. (As well as the stallion Mansingh, who sired the stallion Langata Express who is approved by a couple registries in Germany).
http://www.pedigreequery.com/kris+s
Everyone always says she looks tall, I think its because she’s so leggy and substantial. Its rare when people say the horse looks bigger, usually I dwarf them!!! (darn height…).
Don’t mind at all Although I think its a rather dead thread.
Why ? She was not athletic enough to stay within 20 lengths of the pack. What makes you think she will be a good producer for the Olympic disciplines with this lack of athleticism ? There is no knowledge about the family with regards to breeding sporthorses. There isn’t any knowledge period.
You have to look at the horse in front of you and that horses family and not the blood on the paper. Just food for thought…
[QUOTE=Bayhawk;5685615]
Why ? She was not athletic enough to stay within 20 lengths of the pack. What makes you think she will be a good producer for the Olympic disciplines with this lack of athleticism ? There is no knowledge about the family with regards to breeding sporthorses. There isn’t any knowledge period.
You have to look at the horse in front of you and that horses family and not the blood on the paper. Just food for thought…[/QUOTE]
Are you referring to my mare? In that case, everyone (including her trainers) agreed it wasn’t a conformation issue, but rather a drive issue, she just doesn’t want to go fast. The trainer told me that she probably could have forced it, but if she doesn’t have the desire, why bother trying to beat it out of her? I know that had offers to purchase her as a broodmare, but they were most concerned with making sure she had a second career post track and didn’t want her turning into a baby machine.
And also I said in the OP (I think) that she wouldn’t be bred unless she has a good sport career, and in any case, it would be 4-5 years from now.
[QUOTE=Jumper_girl221;5685951]
Are you referring to my mare? In that case, everyone (including her trainers) agreed it wasn’t a conformation issue, but rather a drive issue, she just doesn’t want to go fast. The trainer told me that she probably could have forced it, but if she doesn’t have the desire, why bother trying to beat it out of her? I know that had offers to purchase her as a broodmare, but they were most concerned with making sure she had a second career post track and didn’t want her turning into a baby machine.
And also I said in the OP (I think) that she wouldn’t be bred unless she has a good sport career, and in any case, it would be 4-5 years from now.[/QUOTE]
I just think you have some issues in her conformation to overcome if she is to be used as a sporthorse producing broodmare.
I don’t see any major conformation issues, Bayhawk, other than the fact she’s fairly downhill. She appeared a little back at the knee in one photo, but the second one looked to be fine.
Pretty typical TB mare, in my opinion, although she’s very solid bodied and that’s nice. You look like a good pair and I wish her a long and successful performance career!
I will go on record as saying, however, that breeding her probably isn’t mandatory since we have a huge surplus of TB mares in the breeding business. You would probably be better off leasing one that has a proven production record and is already approved.
I realize this is the sporthorse breeding forum, but we have a surplus of horses right now. A better plan would be to find another OTTB to bring along when you are ready.
I love her pedigree! I would consider breeding her to
http://irishdraught.com/horses/profile.php?unid=3376
doubling up on Caro
[QUOTE=Kwill;5687598]
I don’t see any major conformation issues, Bayhawk, other than the fact she’s fairly downhill. She appeared a little back at the knee in one photo, but the second one looked to be fine.
Pretty typical TB mare, in my opinion, although she’s very solid bodied and that’s nice. You look like a good pair and I wish her a long and successful performance career!
I will go on record as saying, however, that breeding her probably isn’t mandatory since we have a huge surplus of TB mares in the breeding business. You would probably be better off leasing one that has a proven production record and is already approved.
I realize this is the sporthorse breeding forum, but we have a surplus of horses right now. A better plan would be to find another OTTB to bring along when you are ready.[/QUOTE]
I do. I agree with you that she is downhill. Her neck is set on too low and deep. Her croup and hip are too short and her stifles aren’t set on properly. All major issues that fight against producing good jumpers or dressage horses.
Just my opinion. There are much better mares out there to consider breeding with that are available for a cheap lease or even free.
Wow. Where do I start to disagree with you. The nicest hunter I ever had finished dead last in about all of his 10 starts. It certainly didn’t make him undesirable to me as a hunter. :lol: If we said that every TB that failed as a race horse shouldn’t go on to other disciplines, why would we bother? Not being a superior race horse doesn’t prove “lack of athletecism” to me in any way. I watched the video…I see anything BUT a lack of athleticism.
AND…Kris S is a very desirable sporthorse line, so I don’t get teh pedigree comments either.
(Sorry, should have multi-quoted) but NO…her neck is very very typical TB. In the video it looks much better than the just off the track photo, but it certainly isn’t a NEST ! Same with the croup and hip comment. The OTT photos show a lack of muscling over the topline, by the video, it is merely a cosmetic hunter bump on an otherwise well rounded posterior. :yes:
My personal opinion? I love her frame and her expressive face. She stands “with a leg at each corner”. She has substance.
I believe that most of the european WB registries would put her in the main book.
I would breed for a stallion to put on a higher neck set and make sure he brings a strong hindquarter to the table. She is lovely and she looks very competent under you.
[QUOTE=Iron Horse Farm;5687788]
(Sorry, should have multi-quoted) but NO…her neck is very very typical TB. In the video it looks much better than the just off the track photo, but it certainly isn’t a NEST ! Same with the croup and hip comment. The OTT photos show a lack of muscling over the topline, by the video, it is merely a cosmetic hunter bump on an otherwise well rounded posterior. :yes:
My personal opinion? I love her frame and her expressive face. She stands “with a leg at each corner”. She has substance.
I believe that most of the european WB registries would put her in the main book.
I would breed for a stallion to put on a higher neck set and make sure he brings a strong hindquarter to the table. She is lovely and she looks very competent under you.[/QUOTE]
You are looking at her to produce or do hunters. I am looking at her for jumpers or dressage. The conformation that I describe is exactly why she goes downhill. I think she is an attractive mare , but not one i would choose to breed sporthorses with.
As far as her pedigree is concerned. When is the last time her motherline produced a top sporthorse ? 60 years ago ?
I stand by my statement that there are MUCH nicer mares to breed with that have a history of sporthorse production that are either very cheap or free to lease.
Thank you everyone…this thread took off, lol.
I would be looking at her to produce an all around hunter/jumper type, with a goal of a horse I could do the smaller A hunters with and not embarrass myself, cross enter into the lower jumpers, and do some derbies. Some of the stallions I’ve got on my “short list” are Cunningham, C. Quito, Escudo, Colour Guard, and Apiro.
however, I have a 12 week old filly right now, if I “were” to breed Kissey, it would be once the foal is under saddle and ready for the show ring, since Kissey is my replacement show horse for the 12 week olds dam, so a minimum of 4 years. I would assume in that time I would be able to ascertain Kissey’s suitableness (or lack thereof) for a sport career. I also believe mares should be inspected prior to breeding, so the inspectors would have an opportunity to weigh in on her suitability as well.
I was also curious if she would stand a chance for MMB Hanoverian approval.
Now as for her downhill-ness, she is only just barely turned 4. I’ve noticed a huge difference in her way of going, and downhill-ness as she’s matured, what are the chances she’d level out more as she matures? I would consider that one of my strongest “dislikes” about her.
