Hoof boot help - update post 104, Scoots and Equine Fusion

[fivestrideline]

Update: we are officially in size 2s up front! The flatter foot took some finagling to get on (and a bit of cleaning up the edges of his toes) but with some old nylon socks underneath we got to go on a 20 minute walk with our new boots! No room for pads or pastern wraps so we aren’t turning out in them quite yet.

Anyways, I’m probably projecting some hope on him but I really think he was striding out more in the boots. He always tracks up a good bit behind but has been… short striding? Pony striding? Tiptoeing? In front. I really felt like I could see more reach with his shoulders just in the 20 minutes or so of handwalking in the boots. He was 100% happier to go on the gravel and hard patches, for sure!

Next project is to get boots for the hinds - preferably to fit 2 or 3 degree wedge pads. He’s got flat or negative angles back there, but not much toe to take off. Maybe a month or two in some wedges will relieve his back a bit. I’ll be talking to my farrier first of course!

[fivestrideline]

@RedHorses reviving this thread to ask a question, and since you posted the before and after pics of the Cavallos I thought you might be able to help.

How snug should the uppers be on a new pair? I got some Cavallos for my new horse, and he measures EXACTLY the upper end of the size 0. They pop on with a little force, but crinkle/fold a bit at the heels of the upper part. They’re certainly too tight for pastern wraps and I worry about rubs. However, I also bought the 1 Slims to try, and I can see a pinky width of boot on either side of his foot in those. The uppers of the 1 slims close easier and can fit the wraps, though.

This horse has different pastern conformation than my older gelding (the original horse in this thread), so maybe I’m just not used to the way they fit him. If they break in and “slouch” like your pic upthread, I think they’ll actually be perfect though! I’m just worried about cramming him into a too small size lol

[RedHorses]

Where is he in his trim cycle? Is the wrinkle in the same place as in my picture? at the top at the back?

According to the Cavallo size chart my. horse should be in 3s, but I feel the 2s, broken in, fit better and I don’t have twisting or lost boots that some people complain about. I do have to step up to 3s sometimes at the end of a trim cycle if I need to boot.

I’ve been using 3s lately because the studded boots are 3s. The hind boots sometimes twist because of the extra traction on the barn floor.

[RedHorses]

Which boot did you buy? Simple, Trek, ELB?

[fivestrideline]

Trimmed by the farrier the day I tried them on! Though I am planning to roll his walls and take a bit more off. They’re Cavallo ELBs.

I say wrinkle, but it’s more like bunching - the boot is more upright than his conformation. I feel if it broke in and “slouched” a bit more, it would be perfect. And yes, at the top at the back.

My older guy measured a 3 but fit better in the 2s. He’s just built different in every way.

[RedHorses]

Bearing in mind that I haven’t used the ELBs, I think they would break in fairly well. I’ve used men’s sport socks from the dollar store as protection for the early break in period. I’ve also put the new boots on his slightly smaller hind feet for the initial break in, before finishing on his front feet.

I typically start with a 10-15 minute walk for several days. Depending on how the horse does (checking for early rub signs) I’ll add a bit of trot and go longer. I have used duct tape to protect the rubbed bits for early break in.

I think the slims would probably work as well.

[fivestrideline]

@RedHorses

I think the slims would probably work as well.

Even with the extra room? I’m afraid they’ll spin… but maybe I should hold on to them. I didn’t want to get them so dirty I couldn’t return them, but honestly they’re not too expensive.

Thanks for the break in suggestions! I have some old thin riding socks, but I could steal some athletic socks from my SO to try .

[punchy]

I’d use the pair that best fit the foot shape—sounds like the regulars in your case—and the leather upper will mold to the shape of the foot. My ELBs did, and while they look sloppy or slouchy to my eye on the top, my boy tears around in them with no spinning or falling off (I do use a gel insert). He has never gotten pattern rubs but will have some rubbing on the heel bulbs when he’s in them for longer than usual.

[RedHorses]

“Steal” is the right word. They wear through around the toe very quickly.

I prefer the snugger fit, myself. The Slim fit sounds similar to my horse in 3s, and I don’t have twist or loss issues. The advantage for slims would be letting you use pastern wraps immediately though.

After the first couple of days, when you’ve figured out if/where you need to protect rubbed spots, walk through some puddles early in the ride (or dump some water on them before you start if there aren’t puddles). Getting the boots wet will help break them in, but if you do it too early you may find that wet skin rubs faster. They don’t need to be soaked, just the sort of wet you’d get from puddles or walking through long, wet grass.

[fivestrideline]

The socks hack has been such a help! Thanks!

New minor issue, with boots on all 4 my younger gelding forges/interferes constantly. He sometimes clips the front boot when bare behind but it’s pretty bad with boots on all 4! I’m guessing it’s a bulkiness issue - I have been using the 1 slims up front (breaking them in for turnout) and the 0s behind.

I could get another pair of 0s to try all around, but I wonder if this is a common problem with the bulkier boots? This horse regularly tracks up 2-3 hoof prints worth at the walk, and I’d like to have him in boots all around as the only place to work him when it rains for weeks on end is a very rocky gravel road.

He’s still pretty tight so he doesn’t track up as dramatically at the trot yet, but I do worry about faster gaits with the Cavallos. Honestly though I’ve been thrilled with the peace of mind the boots have given ME, and he moves so much better in them. I turned him out in the 1s with pastern wraps last night so we shall see how that goes, but he was much happier to march through the rock hard gate area, so that alone is worth all this!

[RedHorses]

My horse used to clip the front boots with his hind toes - more at trot, and sometimes walk. I took a good look and he was touching the sole of the front boots with his hind toes. It didn’t cause trouble, and he doesn’t do it very often - not even now when he’s got little muscle after walking for a year and a half. When he did it under saddle he was usually a bit on the forehand. It didn’t take much picking him up to stop the interference.

The weight of the boots may be slowing his front feet down a bit, and yes, the bulk will be a factor when he’s wearing hind boots. As long as he’s bumping the sole of the front boots, I wouldn’t worry about it as he’s not going to be pulling boots off. He’ll adjust if it bothers him.

[fivestrideline]

Haha down on the forehand is DEFINITELY a thing - I’ve just been handwalking him right now.

Thanks for the reassurance! I’ll keep an eye on it

[RedHorses]

Just for extra reassurance - I have been using Cavallos for… um… 15-16 years. In turnout, for hacking over all types of footing, in all types of weather, and I lost my first boot this winter while riding in a foot of hard snow. I have lost count of how many pairs I have worn out.

It was a bigger boot (3), with older Velcro on a hind foot. The hard snow scraped the strap loose, and packed into the front Velcro, pushing the boot far enough open that his foot came out at trot. The other three boots were perfectly fine.

One boot. In countless hours of use Including in fetlock deep, sucking mud.

He lost a Boa boot several times in the years we used them. Usually wet conditions, at speed.

[stb]

I’ve recently had Scoot Boot Enduros fitted for my trail horse. I used a well known and very helpful fitter and the boots fit well, but - I don’t love them. They are sort of a pain to put on and I need to use a hoof pick to get them fastened. I sometimes have twisting issues after a fresh trim, but if I try to use a pad with the boots they don’t fit at all. Recently I had one boot go flying off during a brisk trot after going through mud and water. The boot landed in a ditch and fortunately I saw where it landed or I would never have found it. I couldn’t put it back on because I didn’t have a hoof pick with me.

I have never lost a Cavallo boot during a ride. If I did lose one, I would certainly be able to put it back on without any trouble. The only issue I ever had with Cavallos was that one of my horses will sometimes forge while trotting with the boots on. It doesn’t seem to bother him, and it doesn’t damage the boots in any way, so I’m probably the only one who thought it was a problem.

Anyway, I’m going back to the Cavallos. They are simple and easy to use and they work. They are also much cheaper than the Scoots. I should probably learn to leave well enough alone.

[FjordBCRF]

@stb

and the boots fit well

Everything you said after this indicates otherwise

Fit is what matters most with good boots. The best hoof boot is one that fits your horse well.

[fivestrideline]

I love the low profile look of the Scoots for faster work and jumping. I’m not sure I would feel confident doing tighter figures or jumping in the Cavallos! But, I’ve heard the Scoots are notoriously difficult to fit and they’re not cheap . I’m in one of the fb groups that is run by a fitter that’s supposed to be really good, and 90% of the posts are boots for sale… I know horses grow and people change rides, but dang if most of the boots aren’t almost new!

At least the Cavallos are cheap and relatively easy to put on. Works for me for now!

I AM, however, having heel bulb rubbing problems on one foot despite pastern wraps. It’s a white leg, of course. I’ve given him a break from boots in turnout and the weather has been too crap to ride the last couple of days anyway. Hoping that helps.

[Kyrabee]

@stb

I should probably learn to leave well enough alone

I have this problem too. My girl has worn Renegades for years but I keep wanting to get rid of the Velcro and trying other boots. I had the same issue with Scoots. I sent measurements and they sent the appropriate size. First canter and they flew off. Right now she has Flex boots for the hinds (don’t fit her fronts) but as soon as they give up… Renegades is what fits so Renegades it is.

[stb]

@FjordBCRF you’re right. I should have said that they appear to fit well. The fitter says everything looks great and they should be fine, but they are not. To be fair, they fit better right before a trim (although still not perfect). Part of the problem with them is that I can not just slip a pad in at the beginning of a trim cycle like I can with the Cavallos. Also, my horses are trimmed on a 4 week schedule, and I finally have a really excellent trimmer who has given my horses well balanced hooves - so no big changes are ever made at a trim.

@fivestrideline I agree about the amount of boots for sale in those Scoot Boot groups. That gave me pause before ordering, because I was suspicious about just how many people were selling almost new boots. And the Scoots are really expensive - by the time it was all said and done I could have bought 4 Cavallos for the price of 2 Enduros.

I have used Easyboot Gloves in the past and they worked well when riding, but they are kind of a pain to put on. I was hoping to find a low profile boot that was easier to deal with but maybe there is no such thing. In retrospect, giving a boot a whack with a rubber mallet doesn’t seem like such a big deal. It is actually easier than putting the Scoots on, and faster.

[FjordBCRF]

I trim myself which helps a ton with the fit. I don’t use nippers, just a rasp so any longer than 3 weeks tends to be a lot more work on my end. I do go off boot fit though too, last time I booted the backs were a little tight so trim time it was.

[RedHorses]

If you think about it, most of the boots for sale are likely to be “I bought these boots, but they don’t work, don’t fit, annoy me and I want them gone.” Minimal use.

I won a pair of Scoot boots at an endurance ride, and paid for the other pair.

I ran a 15 mile (3x 5 mile loop) training endurance ride with raw, oozing sores that looked better at the end of the ride than when we started. The sores were caused by Scoot boots - the strap that goes over the back of the foot below the pastern. I did the training ride with Cavallos.

I used a thick layer of zinc ointment (Zincofax), with a non stick wound pad over the raw spots, and vetrap to hold the pads in place. My horse was happy, and I checked them after the first loop.

When I had to boot last fall over raw, bloody, mud fever (because of an abscess) I used zinc ointment over antifungal ointment under the diaper. It really helped the mud fever heal (keeping the mud off, scabs soft).

It’s hard trying to break them in for turnout because you’re going from nothing to many hours of wear. If you can figure out a wrap, alternating days wearing boots and not wearing boots will help him adjust to wearing boots as they break in.

You can just slather zinc ointment on and put the pastern wraps over top. It’s messy, but doable. I find iodine scrub is the best to clean off zinc ointment.

If there’s no broken skin, cheap duct tape can be useful. Tear off a piece big enough to cover the rub and a second piece big enough to cover the first piece with long ends. The idea is to stick the little piece to the big piece, sticky sides together, so you can cover the rub with the shiny side of the tape. Cheaper duct tape is thinner and more flexible so it molds to the horse better. Don’t use Gorilla tape!