Horse Allergic to Common Feed... Help!

[Peggy]

Aren’t ingredients supposed to be listed in order of decreasing amount present? If so, there are some other differences between the US and Australian versions of the HygainZero, aside from the mystery roughage that’s listed first.

My insulin resistant horse with allergies (including alfalfa, barley, and whatever milo is) gets timothy, bermuda hay pellets, Coolstance, flax (obviously not an option for the OP’s horse), beet pulp, and a ration balancer. I think. He’s currently rehabbing out of my direct care and custody.

[freshman]

Have you considered or tested for environmental allergies that could be causing the hives and perceived itchiness or other behavior? Those are actually far more common than food allergies in horses. In any case, both blood and intradermal allergy tests are both actually fairly unreliable and have high rates of false positives.

Still, it might be worth pursuing intradermal allergy testing for your horse. I recommend having it performed/read by an actual dermatologist or other veterinarian that either specializes or does a ton of them and is actually very educated and skilled at reading and interpreting the nuances of the results.

Obviously you know your horse best and may have already tried other options. If not, then I just wouldn’t be ready to all my horse allergic to all those feed ingredients based on the one blood test and resign him (and myself) to a lifetime of strict feed limitations/avoidance that might be completely unnecessary. This can potentially become very, very challenging in real life if/when he rejects what you can feed him, perhaps needs more calories or whatever at some point in life, or it becomes impossible to find a boarding/care situation that is able to comply with his many restrictions.

Not that environmental allergies are easy, either. Even if you know the trigger based on test results (again, not always accurate) so many are actually difficult to avoid in real life as a horse. Personally I would start this horse on a course of Zyrtec and see what happens. You might be able to manage him through this episode on Zyrtec. Hopefully he’ll get over whatever is triggering him now and then taper him off the med. Some horses are sensitive and do this over and over, either seasonally or just randomly, and the actual cause is never known. If he can be managed successfully with periodic Zyrtec, then I would call it win!

[Peggy]

FWIW when my horse was tested via blood (yes, I know, not as accurate) they tested for both environmental things (plants, bugs, molds, bedding, etc.) and feeds. I then did the allergy shots, which only treat for non-food allergens, and eliminated the food allergens from his diet. It has made a major difference as he went from being so itchy he removed skin to being occasionally slightly bumpy. The vet noted that, while they don’t test for, nor treat for, all the possible things and the test might not be 100% accurate, treating for some allergens and removing others will lessen the overall allergic response as it’s cumulative.

[BrendaJane]

as uneducated bystander, I would think that a horse in work, without grains, should be Ok on alfalfa.

Allergies suck!

[ScarlettTrinity]

@Postandrails I have sent an inquiry to Hygain about the formula and if it was good for my needs as well it’s possible use for my older Cushings horse. I expect I’ll hear back from them Monday or Tuesday hopefully. I’d like to know about their vitamin mix too so I don’t potentially over supplement to balance everything out.

@cardinale that was not on the test. Same with chia seeds. The feed he came with did have sunflower seeds. What’s great about BOSS for horses?

@Peggy I expect there are some differences due to regional nutrition needs. LMF does that as well but they have soy in everything. How much Coolstance do you feed? I feel like I need a lot of it in order to stop feeding rice bran for my Cushings horse.

@freshman like @Peggy said, there are environmental things on my test as well, from trees to grasses and insects. He has 33 allergies that popped not including the food and the indoor category. There was a tree that came up positive for him that are all around the property. I think the shots are going to be my best option. Thanks to some of the posts here, I’ve found a few ration balancer options that are strictly vitamins and minerals without the filler soy.

My mom’s horse was tested years ago and we did the allergy shots with her. They made a big difference for her and when she was retested years later, some of the things she was positive for (including rice bran) were no longer an issue and it was a more sensitive test that the previous one.

Thank you @Ponycatraz!! That’s super helpful. I also found a site called FeedXL (https://feedxl.com/) that helps you figure out what’s missing from the diet, if the ratios are good, and it helps you find cheaper options if necessary but getting the same nutrition. It’s not free but it looks like a good resource do those of us (like me) who go nutso over this stuff but aren’t chemists or nutritionists. It looks like something to take the guesswork out of it.

@BrendaJane I’ve actually heard from vets that alfalfa has the highest rate of spores and such between all the hays. It’s also not as nutritional as something like timothy or orchard hay and it’s kind of a hot feed. It’s super tasty but my old man can’t have it, it makes him crazy! But yes, allergies 100% suck.

[ScarlettTrinity]

For anyone curious, I’m currently trying out Hygain Zero (looks safe), along with Copra meal, SmartLytes, a liquid vitamin e, bitters (to help with his stomach), timothy cubes, Triple Crowd chopped hay, and a vitamin/mineral balancer is TBD until I do more research about lysine and such. And I’m very much considering using https://feedxl.com/ for some help.

I also had to change out his treats. Flax is in everything!

[Peggy]

I honestly don’t know how much Coolstance he’s getting.

FeedXL is excellent. They also have a great Facebook group and even recently dis a free webinar on ulcers.

[BrendaJane]

@ScarlettTrinity

I’ve actually heard from vets that alfalfa has the highest rate of spores and such between all the hays. It’s also not as nutritional as something like timothy or orchard hay and it’s kind of a hot feed. It’s super tasty but my old man can’t have it, it makes him crazy! But yes, allergies 100% suck.

It does of course not work in all applications.
It should work in a situation when pretty much all concentrated feeds are off the table.

[Ghazzu]

@Peggy

The vet noted that, while they don’t test for, nor treat for, all the possible things and the test might not be 100% accurate, treating for some allergens and removing others will lessen the overall allergic response as it’s cumulative.

That has generally been my experience–there appears to be a “threshold effect” wrt allergens in many horses, and if you can quiet some of them, you can lessen the impact of others.

[doublesstable]

I was reading your post because of the questions on the Hygain Zero “Roughage Products” and what they are. I am feeding the Hygain Zero to a few of mine that have PPID and EMS. I wondered if you received and answer from Hygain on the Roughage Products? Thank you.

[ScarlettTrinity]

Hi! This is the answer I got back from Hygain when I inquired…

“So, the main ingredients for Zero are roughage products(Canola meal), Sweet Lupin Flakes(a protein source out of Australia, not the poisonous one found here in the states), and Rice Bran Oil. It’s a low NSC, so it’s recommended for Cushing’s horses. That should hopefully work for both of your horses.”

[Scribbler]

I would be uneasy if they couldn’t give me an actual NSC or at least a range.

[ScarlettTrinity]

According to this site, it’s less than 5.5% https://krusefeed.com/product/hygain-zero-44-lb/

And considering the ingredients and how low their starch is, it’s a safe bet this is the lowest on the market. From everything I looked at before, industry standard lowest was around 11% and that was the Triple Crown feed. Even the Triple Crown feed had a lower NSC in their senior formula than their low starch one.

[Scribbler]

That’s impressive. 5.5 per cent NSC is lower than most cool season grass hays.

[Postandrails]

From the Hygain Australian website:

HYGAIN®Feeds also offers two forage-based low starch feeds completed with vitamins and minerals: HYGAIN ZERO® and HYGAIN® ICE®.

HYGAIN® ZERO® is a unique Low Carb - Low GI feed for all horses, with less than 1.5% starch, less than 5.5% non structural carbohydrates (NSC) and absolutely no grain or grain by-products. HYGAIN® ZERO® was developed to support the specialised dietary requirements of horses and ponies with conditions such as Obesity, Insulin Resistance, Laminitis, Cushings, Tying-Up or Grain Intolerance. The unique Low Carb – Low GI profile however is suitable for any equine requiring a low sugar and starch diet.

[ScarlettTrinity]

So, I’m in the USA and we don’t have the ICE formula here. I tried the Zero on my older Cushings horse and he would not go for it at all. My younger horse is the one with allergies and the Hygain Zero is the only feed that I can give him as everything else has something he’s allergic to. My older Cushings horse gets a mix of Cavalor Strucomix Senior and Fiberforce as well as Coolstance to keep his NSC down. He was previously on the Triple Crown Senior but started to go off that feed and was needing a lot to keep his weight.

[Postandrails]

Yes, the Zero is fairly bland and many horses don’t take to it straight away without adding something else to it. In my experience it has been more that they find it lacking and they can be uninterested in it, rather than they refuse to eat it . I’ve known quite a few horses which have transitioned over to Zero by starting out with small amounts added to something else. Zero plus Coolstance has worked for many.

[ScarlettTrinity]

Yeah, I tried small amounts with my old man with the coolstance. He wouldn’t touch it. He’s gotten very picky in his old age

[Postandrails]

@ScarlettTrinity

He’s gotten very picky in his old age

In their old age, pickiness is forgiven.