Horse sent to Mill Creek farm Retirement not doing well!

[uphill]

Lynnwood…I think I read in another thread that your husband’s job was affected by the gov’t shutdown?? If you need some help with Max…ask. There are wonderful people on this board who would step up to the plate to help Max. I wish I could contribute more than just my two cents worth of opinion and emails. I am assuming that you can not /are not contacting an attorney? perhaps due to finances? there are also lawyers on this board.

I hope my emails help and not hinder Max’ situation. I know there is advice to breathe deeply…but …

I PM’d you my tel #

[uphill]

email was returned from sherriff’s and mayor’s address. I need to find better addresses.

[Lynnwood]

Thank you Uphill. I do happen to have a few friends who are lawyers on other states and they have provided me with preliminary injunction forms and advice how to go about handling through the civil system if the rescue owner doesn’t play ball.

Lucky for Max he taught a lot of lessons for a long time and has a lot of friends who are all willing to help as needed.

I am literally just waiting to hear the out come of the Sheriffs visit to the horse today and then will make moves accordingly.

As for my husbands situation yes he is one of those who lost his job not just furloughed due to all this government nonsense.

I just wish I was a little closer geographically and not my daughters sole care taker at this point. It makes driving all over the state to file things in person a bit difficult.

We will make it work and do what is best for the horse. Just hoping that the rescue owners also have this mentality.

[BellaLuna]

Just reading this thread now.
Best of luck to you and this horse. My heart aches for you and Max.

[microbovine]

Lynnwood, I’m not sure how much I can help now that school is back in session. I am two counties away and travel the other way to take our boy to school.

Here are a few, hopefully not too random, thoughts.

If it comes down to a euthanasia, call Moses. He is very good at humane euthanasia and hauls away for a minimal fee because he can make use of the animals after they pass. If you have no idea who I am talking about, PM me and I’ll pass on his number. It’s a family business that has been around for many years and very dependable. This would only really apply if you were somehow given control of Max.

When the sheriff emails or calls, please explain, in the briefest way, the medical issues the horse has and what a vet should look for to back it up. That could help, if they decide to build a case.

Above all, I am really sorry this happened to you. If peoples’ damn pride wouldn’t get in the way, these poor horses would be returned to their previous homes before the fit hits the shan.

[uphill]

I talked to the Deputy who went out to see the horse

Lynnwood you called yesterday at 2PM - CAD incident # 100713-0617 Deputy Condy Jones went to see Max today. No report was filed…but here is what Jones said to me:

Horse is a 3 (!!!) and was thin in the pciture dated Aug 3 ( 2 weeks after arriving at Millcreek). Vet suggested that the supplements donated with the horse were not working and decided to eliminate them…not Millcreek’s owner deciding not to give them. Jill ( the Vet) will be going out again today to recheck horse. Dep. Jones is off tomorrow and the next day so it will probably be the weekend before any further report.

The file said that Jones had tried to contact OP 2xs without success. Jones said he had indeed talked to her yesterday and emailed her today at 3:40 after her email at 3:12.

I told him I would send the pictures ( posted on here) so he could see that the horse HAD lost a lot of weight. I told him that pictures rarely show the gravity of the situation and that the pictures show a horse that certainly is not a 3.

He thought it odd that ‘so many people have called about this horse’. I told him the horse had been a lesson horse and had a lot of fans.

He also shared a few things I don’t want to write on here without checking with the OP. He did say he wouldn’t be a party to a previous owner trying to obtain custody of a horse. I explained that everyone is concerned about the horse’s welfare and that OP’s husband’s job was affected by the shutdown. I think he got the picture. And I told him I would be following this closely. ( OK another county in which I will have to drive the speed limit!)

[CVPeg]

Seems to me there is more [edit]. From your FB page,

“They have continued to pay his sponsorship and buy his supplements.”

Then the deputy interviews the owners, and they admit,

“Vet suggested that the supplements donated with the horse were not working and decided to eliminate them…not Millcreek’s owner deciding not to give them.”

So what are the owners doing with the money sent for supplements?!?

And, frankly, this Sheriffs’ Dept should have the ability to intercede in an obvious abuse case, and not sit idly by while someone has 2 days off. Fine, that’s where the media can come in. :mad:

Oh, and they need to be educated about euthanasia?!? Of course they don’t - not when they get paid while he’s on his feet, and the cost of euthanasia is, of course, another expense. I don’t care if they’re 80, or 18. And frankly, I wouldn’t be surprised if there was some younger family member, or “volunteer” condoning this attitude to keep the $$$ rolling in. Who’s next in line/otherwise benefiting down-the-road to get this property? Nice loan for their land from a benefactor who thinks they’re still doing the right thing. Who was that? Can you e-mail/contact/send them the pictures?!?

And, of course, others will take their side with less information. And without understanding that there should have been options if, in fact, he was going downhill. No, appears to have been well cared for before the move - considering his age. They just truly don’t “care for” retired horses. They just let them linger.:mad:

Edited to add: Shared on FB.

[Roxyllsk]

Does everyone remember what happened to that skinny horse that had
twins and ended up on TV ? The public outcry about the condition of that
horse had a lot of authorities looking into the situation.

Try showing up and talking to the old people who own the farm, and if
that fails then contact the media.

[Lynnwood]

[QUOTE=uphill;7202884]
Lynnwood you called yesterday at 2PM - CAD incident # 100713-0617 Deputy Condy Jones went to see Max today. No report was filed…but here is what Jones said to me:

Horse is a 3 (!!!) and was thin in the pciture dated Aug 3 ( 2 weeks after arriving at Millcreek). Vet suggested that the supplements donated with the horse were not working and decided to eliminate them…not Millcreek’s owner deciding not to give them. Jill ( the Vet) will be going out again today to recheck horse. Dep. Jones is off tomorrow and the next day so it will probably be the weekend before any further report.

The file said that Jones had tried to contact OP 2xs without success. Jones said he had indeed talked to her yesterday and emailed her today at 3:40 after her email at 3:12.

I told him I would send the pictures ( posted on here) so he could see that the horse HAD lost a lot of weight. I told him that pictures rarely show the gravity of the situation and that the pictures show a horse that certainly is not a 3.

He thought it odd that ‘so many people have called about this horse’. I told him the horse had been a lesson horse and had a lot of fans.

He also shared a few things I don’t want to write on here without checking with the OP. He did say he wouldn’t be a party to a previous owner trying to obtain custody of a horse. I explained that everyone is concerned about the horse’s welfare and that OP’s husband’s job was affected by the shutdown. I think he got the picture. And I told him I would be following this closely. ( OK another county in which I will have to drive the speed limit!)[/QUOTE]

So just got off the phone with Jones.

Just as uphill states he does believe the horse is a 3 or just slightly below it.

He also said he thinks based on the photos of prior to looking at the horse in person that he’s only lost about 50lbs (!?!?)

He was annoyed that so many people have called about the horse. Again I told him the horse had been a part of a lot of peoples lives having been part of a large facility /lesson program etc,

He told me I better get them to quit calling and harassing him. That he’d had enough and would not be speaking to anyone about the case going forward.

As for attempting to contact me I haven’t heard from him all day until the email he sent me as a response to one of my many @ 3:40 it was one line that said he’d been out to see the horse and the vet would be looking at the horse tonight.

He called me at 4:09 we spoke for 41 minutes. It was the first phone call I’ve had from him since I filed my report yesterday at 2pm and spoke to him. I’ll happily turn my phone records over to nip that little lie in the bud.

He did say he would be happy if the rescue turned the horse over because it freed up a space for them to take in another horse. However that he could not nor would not get involved with asking the owner to do so. But to wait and see what the vets recommendations are.

I told him I would be happy to release the last 22 years of the horses vet records if it would give this vet a better picture. Yet still find it so odd that this vet (Jill) would take a horse with anhidrosis off One AC and not put him on anything else. Especially a anhidrotic horse living outside in FL over the summer. Makes zero sense.

I think if I said it one I said it a dozen times that I just wanted resolution for a horse that is clearly not thriving. He wouldn’t admit to that just that the horse was a “little” thinner then when it arrived.

[CVPeg]

Well, what will he do if the press gets wind of it? Ask them not to call?!?

I wondered about the suggestion he had called without success. I’ve even heard that one up here. Am honestly a big supporter of law enforcement with several well respected members in my family. But when that lie gets dropped, the credibility of that organization shows what level they’re at. Yes, he could be overwhelmed, but don’t lie on the report…

[Angela_Freda]

[QUOTE=Roxyllsk;7202933]
Does everyone remember what happened to that skinny horse that had
twins and ended up on TV ? The public outcry about the condition of that
horse had a lot of authorities looking into the situation.

Try showing up and talking to the old people who own the farm, and if
that fails then contact the media.[/QUOTE]

You know, thanks for the reminder, I haven’t spoken with that AC in a while to see how they are doing!

[FalseImpression]

If they get the money and don’t use it for the supplements for THAT horse, it should be returned or at least the donor should have been informed. And, really, 12 weeks and that vet says the supplement does not work??? I would call it theft… I still think if the kitchen gets too hot, they may act… but would they relinquish the horse or put him down and then accuse you of harassment/libel/slander whatever applies here.
Again best wishes to you and Max!

[Lynnwood]

[QUOTE=FalseImpression;7202982]
If they get the money and don’t use it for the supplements for THAT horse, it should be returned or at least the donor should have been informed. And, really, 12 weeks and that vet says the supplement does not work??? I would call it theft… I still think if the kitchen gets too hot, they may act… but would they relinquish the horse or put him down and then accuse you of harassment/libel/slander whatever applies here.
Again best wishes to you and Max![/QUOTE]

From what I understand the rescues vet took the horse off the supplements upon arrival not after 12 weeks but on arrival. By the way they were supplements recommended by our/his primary vet who has taken care of him for the last 22 plus years.

Not just whilly nilly lets try this owner feel good supplements.

[betonbill]

I live in the area but I haven’t gone out and seen the farm. However, I do know that it has had a previously good reputation. Sounds like this is not the type of horse that thrives in the type of situation they have there.

That said, I think you need to lawyer up quickly and do everything you can to establish that you are the default owner and that the BO acted out of turn by sending the horse there. Flood the lawyer with all the paperwork you can, let them file the papers saying that you are the owner of record and are legally entitled to possession of the horse. Sniping at the police/retirement facility isn’t going to be as effective as asserting your ownership rights legally.

I think the retirement facility fulfills a basic need. Years ago an acquaintance sent a horse there and was pleased. I think at that time they charged an entrance fee to $2000 or $3000 and that was it–so truthfully, it would not be advantageous for the average horse to live into their 30s and 40s.

Hoping that things can be resolved quickly and relatively pleasantly.

[Alex_and_Bodie_s_Mom]

[QUOTE=Lynnwood;7202943]
So just got off the phone with Jones.

Just as uphill states he does believe the horse is a 3 or just slightly below it.

He also said he thinks based on the photos of prior to looking at the horse in person that he’s only lost about 50lbs (!?!?)

He was annoyed that so many people have called about the horse. Again I told him the horse had been a part of a lot of peoples lives having been part of a large facility /lesson program etc,

He told me I better get them to quit calling and harassing him. That he’d had enough and would not be speaking to anyone about the case going forward.

As for attempting to contact me I haven’t heard from him all day until the email he sent me as a response to one of my many @ 3:40 it was one line that said he’d been out to see the horse and the vet would be looking at the horse tonight.

He called me at 4:09 we spoke for 41 minutes. It was the first phone call I’ve had from him since I filed my report yesterday at 2pm and spoke to him. I’ll happily turn my phone records over to nip that little lie in the bud.

He did say he would be happy if the rescue turned the horse over because it freed up a space for them to take in another horse. However that he could not nor would not get involved with asking the owner to do so. But to wait and see what the vets recommendations are.

I told him I would be happy to release the last 22 years of the horses vet records if it would give this vet a better picture. Yet still find it so odd that this vet (Jill) would take a horse with anhidrosis off One AC and not put him on anything else. Especially a anhidrotic horse living outside in FL over the summer. Makes zero sense.

I think if I said it one I said it a dozen times that I just wanted resolution for a horse that is clearly not thriving. He wouldn’t admit to that just that the horse was a “little” thinner then when it arrived.[/QUOTE]

Those bits in the bold make me pissed. Royally. If you and Uphill have already caught him in a lie – and it sounds like you have, or am I reading that wrong? - then maybe a complaint needs to be filed against him . . . I understand that he can’t talk about an open investigation, but he CANNOT forbid concerned citizens from calling him.

[nashfad]

HAS THE PRESS BEEN CONTACTED??? Yes I can be radical when I believe radical is called for----like this situation. I’d be hounding the press—standing on the side of the street with the before/after pics on a big sign to get the attention needed to get him out. Don’t get on their property and do not block traffic/create a hazard. Have someone video everything that happens.

[minnie]

That poor boy! I’d definotely get the aithorities involved asap!

[uphill]

I emailed the pictures of Max when he arrived…ears up, in decent flesh for his age and the ribby ones 12 weeks later to Deputy Jones. I told him that if he kept in contact with OP that I would not be calling; however, I was keeping an eye on this. I’m sure he felt ‘big deal’.

He did tell me he ‘had been to Millcreek’ when I first asked then I asked if he had been there yesterday or today and he said today. He did tell me he was trained to do a Henneke evaluation and that Max was a 3. I suggested that I did not agree. Of course looking at the various websites that give Henneke evaluation and not seeing the horse in person…it is hard to say. But GENERALLY pictures do not show a situation as bad as reality. So, IMO if he looks like a 2 to me in the pictures, I doubt he could be a 3. I also suggested that perhaps another vet should look at the horse given that Jill took horse off medications sent with him and he deteriorated quickly. I suggested that someone ( maybe some COTH people??) would contribute to pay for that. That got no response.

Now Dep Jones may feel he has to defend his position…sorry but I got the feeling that he wasn’t exactly open to being anywhere near open to the possibility that the horse was on a slippery slope. Arrrggg!

My email to the Sherriff and Mayor did not go thru and I did not remail . I will find the correct addresses tomorrow and add what I know about the case AFTER OP gets vet report…but does that have to be over the weekend?? Ugh, does anyone know the vet in question? of course she may have an interest in CYA too. Can’t people just look beyond and do what’s best for the horse!!!
admitting that there MAY be a possibility that his vet of 22 yrs MIGHT know a bit more about him and that in 12 weeks he sure has lost more than 50#.

If this horse were 21 his chances of rebounding would be better and I wouldn’t worry as much about timing…but a 32 yo TB needs to stay in reasonable flesh or it is becomes a much harder task. Just look at his demeanor!! lost the luster, head down and not at all the same horse as the intake picture!! Sad eyes…I am so sad for him and the people who love him!

[Lynnwood]

[QUOTE=nashfad;7203118]
HAS THE PRESS BEEN CONTACTED??? Yes I can be radical when I believe radical is called for----like this situation. I’d be hounding the press—standing on the side of the street with the before/after pics on a big sign to get the attention needed to get him out. Don’t get on their property and do not block traffic/create a hazard. Have someone video everything that happens.[/QUOTE]

I haven’t contacted the press. Trying to sort out if the Ag officer is not the right direction or going to not be on our side which is the next best step.

I live about 2 hours from the facility and have a child elementary school so am not at liberty to just go picket them at will.

If anyone locally would like to aid in contacting the press I would very much appreciate it.

Part of the difficulties in this case involves geography. Horse came from Naples FL , (my home town) also where BO lives (she is also elderly and 4 and 5 hr trips to Alachua are not promising)

Like I said if anyone can step in and help I would appreciate it.

[microbovine]

I don’t think it’s right to harass this officer. It won’t help the horse.

Lynnwood and Uphill have the matter in hand for now. If someone closer wants to take over, they should go through the OP and Uphill so that the officer will speak with them about the case.

Everyone seems to want to remove a horse immediately, but that is really not possible in most cases. The best way to handle this is to have a local dedicated person drive by and check on the horse once per week. Report any further changes to the officer. There is not enough evidence of a worsening condition, as far as the officer is concerned, but weekly checks should reveal whether or not the horse is spiraling down. Clear heads and a sensible approach will resolve this much more quickly than charging in and expecting immediate results.