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Horse sport in danger for next Olympics!!

Archives 2018 World Equestrian Games
#21

[QUOTE=chukkerchild;3483077]
No! I don’t want them to take it out! At least not showjumping, I think that is far and away the most popular spectactor sport. An Olympic medal is something sponsors understand-- nobody cares about world championships, they only matter to the people in the sport. I don’t care who won the world championship in swimming, but I think it’s awesome when Canada wins a swimming Olympic medal-- I hear about it. I think taking the sports out of the Olympics will be the first nail in the coffin. Look what HAPPENED to polo. Polo is now a rare sport. I KNOW pretty much everyone who plays polo in western canada-- someone just down the road from me was on the canadian team. Polo has no global visibility and so it’s disappearing… that WILL happen to other sports too, maybe not fast, but eventually. Just my 0.02… :no:[/QUOTE]

IAWTC. Drop it, and you will basically never see equestrian events besides racing on TV again. The perception as a sport for extremely wealthy elitists will be cemented. If necessary, drop dressage, or radically revise the scoring system (this was the ISU’s response to the pairs/dance vote-trading scandal in Salt Lake City 2002. The entire judging system that had been in place for 100 years was dumped and a new system’s been developed. It has its issues, but it demonstrates the sport knows there’s a problem.) But lose the Olympics, and for small sports like equestrian, you risk eventually losing the sport at any meaningful level.

#22

Sorry, Danceronice, I don’t see it. The equestrian sports have had horrendous amounts of adverse publicity for the last 8 years. What the average city person outside our little world “thinks s/he knows” based on the track record of Olympic equestrian sport is that dressage judges are subjective, biased, and don’t know the rules; show jumpers dope their horses; and eventers kill theirs.

This is good for the sport - how?? :no:

#23

Drop all three equestrian sports and replace with Reining.
Popular in Europe, you don’t need to tear up a golf course and nobody dies in that sport.

#24

[QUOTE=War Admiral;3483347]
Sorry, Danceronice, I don’t see it. The equestrian sports have had horrendous amounts of adverse publicity for the last 8 years. What the average city person outside our little world “thinks s/he knows” based on the track record of Olympic equestrian sport is that dressage judges are subjective, biased, and don’t know the rules; show jumpers dope their horses; and eventers kill theirs.

This is good for the sport - how?? :no:[/QUOTE]

Regarding the judging, based on that theory, I guess they will have to drop gymnastics and ice dancing as well then (I do find it interesting that people in the real world are appalled by dressage judging but God forbid you comment on it on the Dressage BB here – you will be told you have no idea what you are looking at). And if the Olympics have room for synchronized swimming and rhythmic gymnastics, among other things, I think they can suck it up and have dressage as well.

Regarding the doping scandals, the FEI is its own worst PR nightmare. And people in the real world think that what is going on is tantamount to the steroid use in baseball, or that there was animal cruelty involved (thanks in no small part to TV commentators stating that capsaican is used to chemically rap horses, without pointing out that there are other benign uses for it as well). Why not address those issues, and FIX them. I think the fact that these issues (judging, drugging, etc) are highlighted and subject to media scrutiny, in part precisely because it is an Olympic sport, is a very good thing. Perhaps it will shame people into doing something about these problems for the greater good of the sport, the horses, and the riders. And by that I mean, you can start with the FEI and revision of their drug policies and enforcement procedures.

Moreover, it is a bit unfair to point to equestrian disciplines as being an embarrassment because of supposed drug problems when participants are held to a wholly different and much tougher standard than any other athlete in the Olympics. Start putting ALL athletes through the equivalent of FEI testing and I can virtually guarantee that there would be exponentially more positive test results across the board than there are now.

And by the way, just because riding is not that popular in the United States, does not mean that it is viewed the same way elsewhere – in fact, it is wildly popular in other countries (in England, showjumping is No. 2 only to football (professional soccer).

#25

[QUOTE=PineTreeFarm;3483369]
Drop all three equestrian sports and replace with Reining.
Popular in Europe, you don’t need to tear up a golf course and nobody dies in that sport.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, all those Western riders are definitely paragons of virtue when it comes to horsemanship.

#26

Reining?

That’s a great idea!

Oh wait–the reiners are in the middle of the FEI-sanctioned multi-year plan to be tested, telling the riders the results of the positives with NO SANCTONS WHATSOEVER --ie, the entire reining world–and take a few years to try to get the sport drug free.

In the meantime, FEI can sharpen its claws by catching the REAL drug criminals–users of anti-chew spray and people contaminated by lab tests and technicians!

#27

[QUOTE=fiona;3483190]
marginally less crappy than having trained, qualified, completed your test to find it was a waste of supreme effort because of “specious judging”?[/QUOTE]

If the judging is a problem, then do something about THAT. Why on earth are people so willing to take crap? I don’t get it. The judging issues are not unique to the Olympics. I don’t understand the rationales being expressed here. So, we get dropped rom the Olympics, focus on WEG instead, and what? Encounter bad judging there, too, but somehow that is okay because it is not as high-profile as the Olympics? If there is in fact no problem with the judging, then do a better job of PR and educating the IOC. Ditto re the FEI drug issues. If that system is broken, FIX IT. Don’t just sit around and say oh well, if you don’t like the sandbox, don’t play.

#28

I don’t know alot of the issues but I think it’s stupid to consider cutting them before the London games. Anything in Europe is going to attract more visitors to the equestrian events than Asia, I mean really. Dressage, Eventing and Show Jumping aren’t the least bit popular in Asia or Africa, so what do you expect? Plus the horses will have an easier trip from North America and other parts of Europe so hopefully they’ll all be in better shape when they arrive. After London, who knows…but I’d try to fix the issues before London and then reconsider.

Yeah and pls dump beach volleyball, rhythmic gymastics and doubles diving :slight_smile:

#29

She has to justify her role somehow.
This way y’all can fawn at her feet when - oh my gosh! - the horse sports are included (as planned) in London.

#30

I don’t believe I said anything about horsemanship. What I said was:
“Popular in Europe, you don’t need to tear up a golf course and nobody dies in that sport.”

What part of that isn’t true?

Was that just a classic defense, insult the other discipline?

#31

[QUOTE=fiona;3483165]
On the other matters - if failed dope tests cause a sport to be dropped by the Olympic movement why are Athletics still in the games? Swimming? Gymnastics? Weightlifting?

The dressage judging hmmm, trickier.
But i have a hard time understanding synchronised diving, how on earth do they score that? rythmic gymnastics? beach volleyball? ladies bmx?!!! i ask you - they are all ridiculous sports to me but i wouldn’t want them dropped, i like seeing something different in the general field of human endeavour once every four years.[/QUOTE]

You know, I love watching things like diving, track and field, gymnastics (not the ribbon dancing!!), and a ton of other sports. The BMX race was killer exciting!

But overall the Olympics feels so old fashioned and self-congratulatory. All of these sports have international championships of their own. It makes more sense to pursue them in that context than to try to bring together a sampler of every sport under one roof. There is no audience in the world that is going to like all the sports in the Olympics, whereas you can be sure that everyone who goes to the WEG loves equestrian sports.

I’d say let the Olympics go where ever it’s going, and focus on the WEG and other existing competitions for equestrians.

#32

[QUOTE=PineTreeFarm;3483515]
I don’t believe I said anything about horsemanship. What I said was:
“Popular in Europe, you don’t need to tear up a golf course and nobody dies in that sport.”

What part of that isn’t true?

Was that just a classic defense, insult the other discipline?[/QUOTE]

No, I was just pointing out that I don’t think reining would be any more attractive than the disciplines currently included. I also lived in Europe for 9 years and it is my personal observation that showjumping and dressage are far more popular than reining ever thought of being over there.

#33

Actually, I agree. I like watching most of the Olympic sports.

All of these sports have international championships of their own. It makes more sense to pursue them in that context than to try to bring together a sampler of every sport under one roof.

What I think makes the Olympics special is that it does bring together all different kinds of athletes from all over the world. I think it is cool that Nastia Liukin and Beezie Patton are in the same competition, and get the same medal. And I do think it is important that equestrian disciplines be recognized as a sport just like the others – no, the riders don’t just sit there.

#34

I vote in favor of keeping the equestrian events at the Olympics. For a number of reasons, including: first, precisely BECAUSE equestrian sports are low in spectator popularity in parts of the world (not in Europe), it is a friendly reminder that horse sports are still around. Second, it’s more fun to watch than rhythmic gymnastics. Third, for any athlete in any sport, just getting to the Olympics is an awesome experience.

But- I wouldn’t be averse to exploring some alternatives to the current setup. What if, for example- riders had to draw horses out of a hat like IHSA. Could be fun to watch.

#35

[QUOTE=Beverley;3483570]

But- I wouldn’t be averse to exploring some alternatives to the current setup. What if, for example- riders had to draw horses out of a hat like IHSA. Could be fun to watch.[/QUOTE]

:lol::lol::lol: Best idea yet for solving “the Olympic problem”! I’d for SURE watch that!

#36

There is a big row going on in England concerning the use of Greenwich Park http://www.royalparks.org.uk/parks/greenwich_park/ as the equestrian venue. The IOC is insisting on it’s use, which is NOT popular, especially as there are many much more suitable places. In fact the place is stuffed with more pleasing places. Greenwich has been in existence for several centuries as a public park and people are understandably upset at the damage which could be done and the unsuitability of the site.

Princess Hymen is doing some foot stamping!

There is an interesting article from the Standard here; http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard-olympics/article-23522363-details/2012+and+the+threat+to+an+iconic+London+landscape/article.do

#37

[QUOTE=War Admiral;3483572]
:lol::lol::lol: Best idea yet for solving “the Olympic problem”! I’d for SURE watch that![/QUOTE]

They already essentially do that for Pentathlon, arguably the most cruel of the equestrian disciplines. But I do like the concept in general - it certainly would put the riders to the test and perhaps level the playing field some.

#38

I REALLY don’t think you would. Go check out the video from the men’s modern pentathlon in Hong Kong.

#39

[QUOTE=Equibrit;3483577]
There is a big row going on in England concerning the use of Greenwich Park http://www.royalparks.org.uk/parks/greenwich_park/ as the equestrian venue. The IOC is insisting on it’s use, which is NOT popular, especially as there are many much more suitable places. In fact the place is stuffed with more pleasing places. Greenwich has been in existence for several centuries as a public park and people are understandably upset at the damage which could be done and the unsuitability of the site.

Princess Hymen is doing some foot stamping!

There is an interesting article from the Standard here; http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard-olympics/article-23522363-details/2012+and+the+threat+to+an+iconic+London+landscape/article.do[/QUOTE]

With all the amazing potential venues in England, you’d think they could figure it out.

#40

Okay, One of those “If I ruled the world” kind of suggestions - :winkgrin:
I think many of the “specialty” or “niche” sports should participate in a kind of satellite Olympics. A Second Tier sport would have events and be run by the governing body whose rules and procedures would be acceptable to the IOC. They may want to use just a few appropriate sites (and sports with similar needs could hold their events together) and be distributed around the world, but in areas that have an audience and available resources. The city hosting the Olympics would not have to provide for these sports.
So Kentucky Horse Park or other N Amercican site could be used for Chicago and another eventual North American Olympics. Aachen could be used for European Olympics, etc
It would still be an Olympic medal, but ease the burden on the host city and perhaps put more contol in the hands of those who know and love the sport.

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