That pellet thing is weird too, since theses are so obviously dangerous and uncomfortable if not first treated with water as the bag instructs.
Are people really too dim to read the instructions, or is this some crazy way to try and save money?
1 Like
@luvmyhackney if by CONTRACT you are being charged for 8 bags of shavings a month so you MUST get 8 bags of shavings a month. There is no arguing or feeling bad, itâs simply what the barn owner put in the contract.
2 Likes
Oh, they read the instructions and wet the pellets. I guess Iâm just old school. I like a nice fluffy concave bed of shavings over sand. But then I only have 3 horses.
1 Like
I hope youâre right in the grand scheme of things, but Iâve now been to two (yes, TWO) barns where the pellets were just dumped onto mats, and left to fluff out âwith use.â
So maybe I just know unusually stupid people . . . ?
I dunno.
2 Likes
Well, yeahâŠbut it is also kind of dangerous to put horses on to mats that can become wet. They are slicker than (insert pithy phrase here) and your horse can get hurt- really.
The pellets NEED to get fluffed out a bit, so that they actually are absorbent.
Count me amongst those who just cannot believe that it has come to this.
3 Likes
While it could be more paperwork for the barn owner/manager, why not charge per bag over a set amount being used? That seems like it would take care of the concerns about cost, labor cost, etcâŠ
I know, right?
And the un-wetted pellets are just as bad, since they roll around like ball bearings on a bare floor. (Donât know how pithy that is, but thatâs just what theyâre like - absolutely horrible.)
Count me amongst those who just cannot believe that it has come to this.
:no: Say it, sister.
2 Likes
So just to update thread. Had a lovely (on my end) phone call with BO. Basically I told her if the stall was receiving 8 bags of shavings there would be no pee spot because that is 2X the amount of shavings I actually put in there. So since this is a new month, lets try sitting aside his (8) bags with his name on them and use only those 8 bags in his stall and see how much actually gets used and what is left at the end of the month as per our contract. Told her my expectation is that there are no puddles of pee and that there is actually a covering to the pee to keep his blankets clean. I shouldnât smell pee when I walk in at all. I will not add any shavings but if I walk in his stall and there is a puddle or strong smells, she will be receiving my 30 day notice and I will be moving.
BO said that she would make sure all the barn workers know to bed his stall a little heavier and to use his 8 bags of shavings. BO started to say that was not reasonable until I reminded her what was in the contract. I told her I enjoy boarding here, I love the quietness and everything else was ok, but smelling and standing pee in a stall is a total deal breaker for me.
So we shall see. We only have to make it till March and they get kicked out back on 24/7 turnout until December. So they are only cleaning stalls Dec. - Feb and sometimes in July/August.
4 Likes
That sounds like a good clear discussion. I especially like that you made it clear that you basically love the place and thatâs one deal breaker. Sometimes folks end up getting disgruntled about everything after one thing goes wrong and the BM might feel that there is no way to make them happy so not try.
1 Like
Glad that it seems you have worked it out.
To give some perspective, in the âolden daysâ shavings were easy to obtain very cheaply from the local lumberyard with minimal cost for delivery. Straw (and delivery of straw) was also pretty cheap. And, to top it all off, there was a good supply of laborâlots of young people with initiative wanting to make some extra money from stall cleaning and lots of working students willing to work hard in exchange for riding opportunities. Many peopleâyoung people, retired people, moms without f/t jobs etcâconsidered doing some manual labor on a horse farm as a reasonable way to make some extra money. After the stalls were cleaned, no fussy neighbors complained about the manure pile, so disposal wasnât a huge deal.
Nowadays, the cost of bedding and delivery has skyrocketed. In my area, a truckload of shavings offers no cost advantage over bagged shavings and pellets. I believe that a lot of the cost increase has to do with the increase in fuel prices for transportation as bedding is very bulky. The bagged bedding that I buy is around $6 per bag by the time I pay tax and have it delivered. Finding decent straw is extremely difficult, last time I checked it was more expensive than hay. To top it off, IME, there is currently a labor shortage for the type of labor that horse farms require. Stall cleaner wages are typically more than minimum wage, so youâd think that young people and other people looking for p/t jobs would much rather do this vs. work in a clothing store or fast food restaurant, but no. There is a stigma against doing manual labor or farm workâmany people wonât even consider it. Also, even people who are âwillingâ to do it often lack basic work ethic to get the work done in a reasonable way. Oh, and people are a lot fussier about muck heaps nowadays, making disposal a bigger issue for some farms. So, at present, bedding and the labor involved to keep a stall cleaned are a much more significant cost for barns.
In my analysis of your situation, I think that overall 8 bags of shavings per month is not an unreasonable allotment to expectâdepending on your boarding rate. Puddles of urine are not acceptable, and laying in urine will ruin the waterproof layer in your turnout blankets (aside from the offensive odor).
However, to keep a stall deeply bedded and banked, for most horses would take significantly more than 8 bags per month. Keep in mind also, that bedding more deeply can double or even triple the amount of time it takes to clean a stall (yes, I time things like this). Many horses move around in their stalls and grind their urine and manure into all the bedding, requiring that much more bedding be removedâand disposed ofâif the stall is deeply bedded and banked. Thereâs also inherently a lot more waste. A lot of stall cleaners are not going to take the time to pick through and separate clean from dirty, they are just going to shovel more bedding out. Also, IME, stall cleaners typically do a much worse job of getting a deeply bedded stall clean. They miss the wet spots underneath, and leave manure piles that have had clean bedding kicked over them.
Personally I think that banking stalls is wasteful, except for mares and foals. You end up with a lot of half dirty bedding in the stall, which I dislike. Iâve seen other peopleâs banked stalls provide a lovely environment for bugs and rodents. Many workers wonât appropriately pull bedding in from the banks to use, they will just leave it there until it is old and musty. Unless there is a mare in the stall, in which case sheâs using the banks as a great place to pee. I havenât banked stalls (except mares and foals) in decades and Iâve never had a cast horse since I stoppedânot one, not even horses with a history of getting cast. So obviously I think it would be foolish to demand a banked stallâthatâs a style issue.
2 Likes
Just for a note of support, we spent seven weeks at a time showing in Portugal the last two years. My horses would be out of the boxes a maximum of three hours a day I would say. I would start the tour on concrete and put in four bales of shavings. I would add on average one bale of shavings a week. Two for the gross mare. I on average had very deeply bedded stalls as I spent a lot of time sifting and picking.
I think eight bales of shavings is do-able, but I also know that the more a barn worker has on their plate, the less time they can afford the spend picking stalls.
But I think itâs fair to say your horse should hopefully have more bedding than he has been getting.
2 Likes
For those saying theyâd never bed less than 6": How do you know that âdeepâ to you is 6-8"? If bagged shavings fluff up to 5.5 cubic feet, a 10âx12â stall would need 1.8 bags per inch. So to get 6" deep in an empty stall takes about 11 bags (ignoring banking). Is that what you guys put in empty stalls? If you only put in 5-7 bags, thatâs closer to 3-4".
The only places Iâve been that legitimately had 6" or more never cleaned the stalls adequately and had a build-up of old urine-caked bedding underneath. Ok, or they used straw, but I think this thread is about bedding with shavings, so thatâs moot.
I would much rather bed lightly so I can clean it to my liking efficiently. Then again, my horse is a total slob, so putting more in just means a substantial increase in time and dirty bedding to take out.
1 Like
Well, I suppose I would have to start by saying you buy shavings by the TON and have a dump truck deliver them from a sawmill, as opposed to buying bedding in bags as though you were at a showâŠis this the current âtrendâ is barn care?
Iâm honestly confused at the idea of buying bags of shavings as opposed to having it delivered by a dump truck.
And stalls are typically 12x12âŠat least at the barns Iâve kept my horses at - even the Arabian.
When adding shavings, well, you just continue to bring in wheelbarrow after wheelbarrow of shavings until you have a nice deep stall. I did it for many years in NC, VA and GA. Several barns in NC and VA.
Have things really changed THAT much? Maybe I should be thinking of pasture board as the way to go when I do buy another horseâŠ
1 Like
Not everyone has a large dry space available to buy shavings by the ton. Thereâs nothing worse than to find out your bulk shavings have gotten wet and frozen solid or gotten moldy.
3 Likes
I purchased loads of sawdust when available, but in some locations itâs not even an option. Trust me, when you are used to getting truck loads and then have to buy bags you deeply resent it :lol::lol::lol:
1 Like
@Gainer Every barn I have EVER been at has a dedicated space and these things called TARPS that can be placed over the shavings to keep them dry. If we could do it during HURRICANE season, I swear to you, it can be done.
Iâm getting reallllllllly nervous, now!
I have been at boarding barns that use little bedding over hard mats. I donât like that, but when you board, you have to decide what is more important. Since I often clean my own stalls, I think I should be able to use shavings I buy. But if the rule is otherwise, I follow the rule.
1 Like
So you are being charged for 8 bags of shavings a month and they are only in stalls 5 months a year? You are paying for 96 bags of shavings a year and they are crying about using 40?
3 Likes
I love having my own place. I may lack some of the amenities of a boarding facility (like indoor arena), but I can customize the bedding for all three of my horses.
1 Like
