I don’t hold a horse for anyone without a non-refundable deposit. If I have a second party interested, I’d give the first person 24-48 hours to make up their mind and give me a deposit.
You can’t risk loosing a real sale for someone who might hum-hawing and daydreamin’ about your horse.
From my experience horse shopping I always did a vet check before I put down a deposite. I brought money with me to do the down payment so it was basically if I didn’t leave cash both I and the sell considered that they didn’t have any obligation to hold the horse for me. I really upset some sells by turning down horses after a vet check, moon blindness in one case, potential OCD coupled with trying to kick the vet in the second case. But I was happy have the ability to walk away after the vet check. One seller in particular really wanted the down payment first, but I made it very clear I would prefer to have the horse sold out from under me than to buy a horse without a vet check. My feeling is as a buyer you get the benefit of being able to walk away without worrying about a deposite, the seller can still entertain other offers. I agree that it’s probably polite to offer the first person 48 hours to make her choice if for no other reason then a second vet check takes up more of your time. However, if there is no deposite you are completely within your rights to sell the horse.
Faye, putting down a deposit does not preclude your ability to walk away. Normal practice is that if a horse does not pass the vet check, the deposit is returned in full to the buyer. Usually this is spelled out in a sales contract which is signed at the same time the deposit is given.
Of course, if you aren’t worried about the horse selling out from under you and you are present and ready to complete the deal the moment the vet check is finished, I think you probably are okay not giving deposits.
OTOH, deposits protect the buyer as well as the seller. For example, if you vet a horse without having signed a sales contract/given a deposit, the seller could potentially change their mind about selling the horse or increase the price the instant the vetting/xrays came back clean.
[QUOTE=BeeHoney;6827197]
Faye, putting down a deposit does not preclude your ability to walk away. Normal practice is that if a horse does not pass the vet check, the deposit is returned in full to the buyer. Usually this is spelled out in a sales contract which is signed at the same time the deposit is given.
OTOH, deposits protect the buyer as well as the seller. For example, if you vet a horse without having signed a sales contract/given a deposit, the seller could potentially change their mind about selling the horse or increase the price the instant the vetting/xrays came back clean.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I agree, this is how I’ve always handled a deposit - it was refundable if the vet check was not satisfactory. This does protect the buyer - otherwise you could spend $2,000 on a vet check and have someone else come and buy the horse out from under you. No matter what, a good sales contract protects everyone and spells out all the time-lines, contingencies, etc.
[QUOTE=FayeHanoverian;6827089]
From my experience horse shopping I always did a vet check before I put down a deposite. I brought money with me to do the down payment so it was basically if I didn’t leave cash both I and the sell considered that they didn’t have any obligation to hold the horse for me. I really upset some sells by turning down horses after a vet check, moon blindness in one case, potential OCD coupled with trying to kick the vet in the second case. But I was happy have the ability to walk away after the vet check. One seller in particular really wanted the down payment first, but I made it very clear I would prefer to have the horse sold out from under me than to buy a horse without a vet check. My feeling is as a buyer you get the benefit of being able to walk away without worrying about a deposite, the seller can still entertain other offers. I agree that it’s probably polite to offer the first person 48 hours to make her choice if for no other reason then a second vet check takes up more of your time. However, if there is no deposite you are completely within your rights to sell the horse.[/QUOTE]
I wouldn’t let you vet my horse unless I had a deposit. My time is valuable and there are too many risks involved with a pre-purchase to let it be done willy nilly. You give me a check, I give you a contract and “THE RIGHT” to examine my horse. I held up a numerous vet checks waiting on a deposit and I will again. It is good business and it protects everyone involved. So when someone else calls on a horse that is under contract, I let them know I have a contract, but if it isn’t completed by such and such time the horse will be available to purchase. I except up to 2 contracts at a time and inform everyone involved of the circumstances.
Tim
I’m surprised that a deposit before the vet check is common, not something I ran into when I was horse shopping, but I was mostly looking at OTTB and TB/WB crosses so it might be different with somewhat less expensive horses. After the vet check on the mare who kicked at the vet and the vet though had OCD, I got calls and E-mails for two weeks telling me the vet’s opinion wasn’t valid so I was thrilled I didn’t have to fight about getting my deposit back. The horse trying to kick the vet when she went to pick up her back feet was enough of a red flag I probably won’t have wanted to go forward even if the vet check was fine (don’t flame me here, I’m an ammie and a horse trying seriously to nail the vet isn’t something I need to deal with). I worked on the bring cash to the vet check for a deposit if it goes well. I don’t plan to be horse shopping in anytime soon, but, I’ll be less suspicious if someone asks for a deposite before the vet check.
The way we do it, if a person is serious enough to get a vet check, they must provide me a 25% down payment, and a signed sales agreement that states the sale is completed contingent upon a satisfactory vet check. If the horse should fail the vet check, then I will refund the deposit, but I need proof from the attending vet that the horse did indeed fail. I will not refund the deposit if they change their mind and want to back out at the last second because he’s not pretty enough or whatever. I held the horse for them, took it off the market or marked it sale pending, I could have sold the horse to someone else, so changing their mind is unsatisfactory and unacceptable.
We also follow the same theory as a retail store - you break it you buy it. If you want my horse to leave my property to travel to a vet clinic for a PPE, purchaser is required to place full travel insurance (mortality and surgical) on the horse for the value of the sales price with full payout to me and I must have proof of this insurance in my hands before that horse goes on to the trailer. My reasoning for this is if some bozo in his sportsmobile smashes into the trailer and kills my horse, I should be compensated for the loss. What if the injuries are so severe that the horse can no longer do what he/she originally could? I deserve compensation as this accident would not have happened had the horse stayed on my property in the first place. My other reasoning is that the claim for the loss should not go against me and cause me to then have increased premiums - the responsibility and burden is on the purchaser and the claim goes against them.
With a deposit on the horse, I will hold the horse for 30 days to give time for the purchaser to complete the terms and requirements we agreed to and stipulated in the signed purchase agreement. If they fail to complete the sale within 30 days, the deposit is not refunded and the horse goes back on the market. Again, the reasoning behind this is I could have sold the horse already to someone else and we were just waiting for the buyer.
[QUOTE=FayeHanoverian;6827569]
I’m surprised that a deposit before the vet check is common, not something I ran into when I was horse shopping, but I was mostly looking at OTTB and TB/WB crosses so it might be different with somewhat less expensive horses. After the vet check on the mare who kicked at the vet and the vet though had OCD, I got calls and E-mails for two weeks telling me the vet’s opinion wasn’t valid so I was thrilled I didn’t have to fight about getting my deposit back. The horse trying to kick the vet when she went to pick up her back feet was enough of a red flag I probably won’t have wanted to go forward even if the vet check was fine (don’t flame me here, I’m an ammie and a horse trying seriously to nail the vet isn’t something I need to deal with). I worked on the bring cash to the vet check for a deposit if it goes well. I don’t plan to be horse shopping in anytime soon, but, I’ll be less suspicious if someone asks for a deposite before the vet check.[/QUOTE]
This is part of your own personal examination that you should have completed before you even got to the vet check. The next time you buy a horse you should require the horse owner to pick up the horse’s feet right in front of you. All 4 of them. Then, you should wear a helmet, and pick up all 4 feet yourself. The helmet doesn’t protect your legs if you get kicked, but it could certainly save your head if naughty horse knocked you over! You should be allowed to see the horse fully handled, and you should handle the horse fully to your satisfaction. Same with riding - see the horse ridden and ride the horse to your satisfaction. You should be allowed to come back even a second time to catch, handle, saddle up, and ride the horse yet again. Then, after the horse has satisfactorily met your temperament and rideability requirements and you think the horse and you will gel together, then and only then should you arrange for a veterinary examination.
And the seller has no ground to stand on if you had signed a pre-purchase agreement stipulating the terms that constitutes a completed sale. A contract is binding so you will get your money back if the horse fails the vet exam, or binds you the buyer into completing the sale if the horse successfully completes the exam.
I will not even allow the prospective sale to proceed to a vet examination unless I’m convinced the buyer has handled/ridden my horse to their own satisfaction and I think they’ll fit together well. I want to make sure I have a happy customer who knows EXACTLY what they’re getting in this horse, whether it is a weanling, young prospect or an experienced saddle horse. I have learned in my 30 some odd years of this horse thing that some buyers can be timid about asking for more handling time. So, if I suspect the buyer is being timid, I will take that concern off their shoulders and suggest they go home, think about it, and they are very welcome to come back 2 or 3 times to handle the horse and see the horse on different days just so they’re absolutely sure this is The Horse For Them. Again, I want a happy customer who is thrilled beyond about their new pony!
Tracy Dopko (Daventry) posted on another thread on CoTH all about this subject. She is a professional equine appraiser and the comments she stated are invaluable and extremely informative.
I’m starting to derail the OP thread so I’m going to start a new one. Thanks for all the response so far, I look forward to hearing more.
I have always put down a deposit to hold a horse so that I could have it vet checked and then handed over the complete payment when the horse passed the vet. If I wasn’t able to be at the PPE, I would have the money in escrow.
I do not expect someone to hold a horse for me without a deposit, nor would I hold one for a buyer since people get cold feet.
[QUOTE=FayeHanoverian;6827089]
From my experience horse shopping I always did a vet check before I put down a deposite. I brought money with me to do the down payment so it was basically if I didn’t leave cash both I and the sell considered that they didn’t have any obligation to hold the horse for me. I really upset some sells by turning down horses after a vet check, moon blindness in one case, potential OCD coupled with trying to kick the vet in the second case. But I was happy have the ability to walk away after the vet check. One seller in particular really wanted the down payment first, but I made it very clear I would prefer to have the horse sold out from under me than to buy a horse without a vet check. My feeling is as a buyer you get the benefit of being able to walk away without worrying about a deposite, the seller can still entertain other offers. I agree that it’s probably polite to offer the first person 48 hours to make her choice if for no other reason then a second vet check takes up more of your time. However, if there is no deposite you are completely within your rights to sell the horse.[/QUOTE]
If no contract was signed prior to the vet check and no deposit made tell her she has until this Wednesday to make a decision and give you a signed copy of the sales contract. Call the other party and arrange for a showing sometime after Wednesaday . If they have to fly in let party#2 know on Thursday.
I have never had someone take this long to make up there mind after a vet check who actually ended up purchasing a horse.
Give the first interested party first right of refusal if you have someone else ready to put money done. In other words they have to top the second party’s offer now to get the horse. No one is actual a buyer until they’ve handed you the money.
How long would a seller hold a horse with a deposit?
Ask the seller. (And I am not sure why you bumped a thread that is four years old to ask this question.)
I am asking the seller…sorry I didn’t know bumping old threads up was a faux paus.
I know we’re bumping this up, but since it can become a real issue, no harm in answering.
Answer: not that long.
Once the buyer decides they want the horse, I expect a vetting scheduled asap. I had one woman, a DC mounted police officer, who wanted “her vet” aka the preferred mounted police vet to look at this horse for her personal use. The wait was three weeks. I said, you are welcome to have that vet, but I will not hold the horse three weeks. And I didn’t and the horse sold to someone else.
After the vetting, I expect to know almost immediately, like, the next day or two. At that point, I want full payment, arrangements for horse to leave in week or so, or start paying board, and have insurance, release and liability, etc.
Anything can go wrong, so quickly.
We had a horse vetted in Holland, one of Tops’ clients. Vetting was good, people were buying, but as horse was being exported she had to quarantined, but the next round of quarantine didn’t start for like three weeks, and we didn’t argue, but basically Tops didn’t want to be responsible (they would not be in Holland), and I was on my own at the time and I SURELY didn’t want to be responsible for 250k horse. And I had to ride her because she couldn’t be turned out or lunged. It was ulcer inducing.
If you want the horse, and it’s been vetted in a timely fashion, buy the horse. If you need to think about it for any length of time, it’s ok to tell the seller that and be clear you understand they can’t hold the horse for you while you are thinking.
I would say rather, if you aren’t ready to pull the trigger, it’s probably not the right time or right horse for you.
Ok thanks…im asking because my funds for the horse are not available for a week or two. My money manager will give me an exact timeline on Wednesday. I do want the horse but I understand if the seller doesn’t want to wait. I told the seller I would be open to any parameters they may have.
Since you are buying the horse, I would pay board from this time forward. Draw the contract up immediately.
I’m so glad you found a wonderful horse and he passed the vet check. Did the owner respond to your suggestions? Can you put down a deposit, sign a contract, pay board and all care, and insure the horse with payout going to owner? I don’t think just paying board is going to be enough.
From a sellers stand point, she is probably not too happy and might not think you are a serious buyer. She probably figured if you vetted a horse, you were ready to buy it. If funds are elsewhere and not readily available, should get them when serious about making a purchase and in advance of a vetting. Even if you put down a deposit, sign a contract, pay board and all care and insure the horse, until the horse is fully paid for, the seller still owns it. Things could go wrong with you getting your money in a few weeks. I personally wouldn’t expect the seller to take the horse off the market until you’ve completed the transaction, even if you do a contract to secure the horse as first right of refusal.
Paying a deposit and board should secure the horse for you. Unless there is another buyer waiting in the wings.
Talk to the seller and see what it takes.
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