Probably not enough proof- kind of he said, she said situation. However, my farrier is not an *sshole so I wouldn’t be in the situation.
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There’s no way to tell how much of the injury was caused by the wait versus colliding with the equipment. While I agree the wait likely made it worse, determining the % of the needed contribution would be very difficult, as would the degree the farrier was protecting himself from a horse that didn’t have an appropriate handler (i.e., how much the original injury was his fault). It doesn’t sound like the observers are exactly reliable witnesses.
That being said, we live in a world of cellphones. If the farrier didn’t text a photo (maybe he’s old skool and doesn’t have a smartphone), surely between the mom and property owner there must have been one to send an image immediately to the owner. I also think it was irresponsible of the farrier to give advice about the wound. In an ideal world, he would have called the owner immediately, but perhaps he was afraid of admitting responsibility. Even so, a knowledgeable person who would turn a horse out without advising calling the vet seems callous and reckless.
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Yeah, sorry, no. Horse was left with an untrained/incompetent handler and was misbehaving. It is not the farrier’s job to train the horse. If you have a job where you cannot be present, you pay competent people to handle the horse. You do not blame the farrier when things go south and “mom” is holding the “horse-on-a-kite-string.”
This is 100% on the HO, and good luck finding another farrier if she pursues this. There are fewer & fewer willing to do the work, put up with clients like this, bad horses, incompetent handling, and they will drop you in a hot second.
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The fact that the farrier gave medical advice and performed treatments (wrapped the leg and advised a timeframe for removal) pushes boundaries, and I think that if HO had resources and wanted to.pursue legal action this is where he is liable. Basically performing veterinary medicine without a license.
How he responds when he finds out the extent of the injury is what will make him the AH or not here. I’d be shocked if he offers to help with bills, maybe it didn’t look that bad but should at least be sorry about the outcome.
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The exposures are different for the farrier versus an owner, though. Farriers are a service provider. The risk is the client suing them for damages directly resulting from a mistake or negligence made in the course of providing their professional services. Farriers’ liability insurance is just a plain old E & O/professional liability policy like any other service provider’s. A horse owner’s liability policy is general liability.
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Horse was tied, not held. I agree it is not the farriers job to train the horse - he should have left the horse. it was his choice to untie the horse and hit the horse with the lead rope and take the roll of “trainer” (which I can’t see being helpful), and his choice to wrap and advise on the leg. horse wasn’t a “horse-on-kite-string”, that is your interpretation of what happened. This is an older horse (teen I think). Interesting you are inferring information that was not included.
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Shit happens and it’s happened to your friend/former client.
The facts appear to be: the boarded horse got injured during a farrier visit supervised by the BO and the HO’s mother, the farrier wrapped the injury, the HO elects to call the vet once she sees the injury.
Honestly the only liability I see is with the BO. The BO failed to communicate to HO that the horse had an injury that warranted vet care. The BO permitted the farrier to “get after” the boarded horse in the BO’s care resulting in the injury.
Realistically no one is gonna be paying bills but the HO. At minimum she should get a different farrier and express to her mom and BO that she needs to hear and see if something is wrong with her horses.
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Wrapping a bleeding wound is not performing veterinary medicine. Had he stitched it, then yes. I agree that the farrier should have advised the owner to call the vet, but again - that is the responsibility of the owner or person that boards the horse. I have had boarders - I had their credit cards on file in the event I had to call the vet for their horse. And I made it clear that if in doubt - I was calling.
I’m sure most reputable farriers have liability insurance. But that still does not make them responsible for your horse when it acts up. I am far more concerned that my horse will hurt my farrier than the other way around. That is how he makes a living.
I know some farriers will catch, tie and trim/shoe without another person present, but a lot of good farriers are not willing to risk their lives and livelihood by doing that. That’s probably why it is hard to find good farriers who will go to backyard barns. Mine definitely will not.
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She might also consider (depending on how small the horse community is in your area) that if she sues the farrier she might have trouble finding any future farrier services.
I agree that the farrier should not have hit the horse or minimized the injury, and I would never use that farrier again. But I also put a lot of fault on mom and PO for not informing the horse owner immediately. Really, every one of them should have reached out to horse owner and said, horse got hurt while being shod - what do you want to do about it? PO noticed “it was bleeding a lot” - I would personally want to know immediately any time my horse is bleeding a lot.
If horse owner is completely unreachable while out of town working, she should have either made a clear plan with mom/PO about what is worth calling the vet about or boarded her horse with more competent horse people so that she could trust them in situations like this.
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If the farrier has no one holding the horse, he has to take on the responsibility of correcting the horse if he can’t do the job. It’s unlikely the farrier “got after” the horse for no reason, so presumably there was an issue. And yes, while he could have walked away and given up, it’s not fair to suggest that he had any idea that the correction would lead to an injury.
The bottom line is that he didn’t injure the horse. If he had hit the horse with a rasp and it required stitches - he should pay the bill and his insurance would kick in. Or, for example, be responsible for things like nailing through the sole and subsequent vet care. But an accident in the barn would likely fall on the owner of the barn and owner of the horse.
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Or the farrier thought the people responsible for the horse (the mother and the neighbor barn owner) would contact the owner immediately.
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Based on the scenario, it sounds like he deliberately tried to minimize the horse’s injury and his own responsibility.
I mean, the smart, sensible, right thing would have been to call the owner, but he might have figured that by tossing the horse out, it’s harder to draw a chain of connection between the injury when he was servicing the horse and any injury the horse might have done to himself turned out.
If he thought the other people were going to contact the owner to get a vet, at minimum he would have left the horse on the crossties to wait.
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If there is information not given we have to either not give any advice or guess about the details we do not have.
Like, people are assuming the mother and barn owner stood there saying not a single word and the farrier made very decision and the farrier should have realized that the mother and barn owner totally depended on the farrier to call the owner and inform the owner that their horse did not behave and got injured and a decision about vet care needs to be made. Oh, and that some how the TWO representatives for the owner expected the farrier to do everything and anything.
Did the mother or barn owner ask the farrier their opinion on the wound?
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Sounds like the problem here was, the farrier took it on itself to diagnose and treat by bandaging and saying to “check in a day or two”.
That may open farrier to liability concerns, should have known better, let a vet do vet work.
What happened that caused the injury would probably be considered an accident, harder to prove liability there.
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I think both farrier and PO have fault here. Both should have contacted the owner saying something had happened and let the owner decide.
Even though the PO is “elderly” and a pleasure rider does not absolve her from basic horse keeping knowledge and the responsibility that comes with holding a horse for money.
If the owner did not screen the PO for basic horse-keeping knowledge and responsibility, then there is fault there , as well.
These things happen and the fault is not that the horse reacted and there were consequences, It is the series of errors of judgement in not contacting the owner and allow them to make decisions. The farrier acted in good faith, but the failure is in the communication.
My last barn owner / trainer contacted me every time there was a question or judgement made outside the routine. Even bringing my horse in due to weather was reported. Perhaps excessive to a fault, but the right thing to do.
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But again - calling the vet is not his job, or making sure the vet was called. There were apparently two people present at the time of the incident, including the Barn Owner. That is their job.
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I feel terrible for the HO- what a crappy situation. I hope the horse heals and can be sound again.
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Where does the Horse Owner’s representative, their mother, fit into this? No responsibility at all?
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with zero horse experience she likely deferred to the knowledge of the more experienced people. If owner did not charge the mother to contact her if anything "went wrong " she was likely clueless. If owner did not inform and advise mother about the potential for issues, then owner failed on that point. If the owner did not check in when knowing the farrier was coming, then that is a lapse of judgement as well.
I am currently house/ dog sitting for someone I have known for 25 years. we worked together and he knows my veterinary expertise. this did not stop him from having fully written notes, a file of vet records contact info . We also communicate daily with “hows it going” and pictures
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Hmm I was thinking the “mom” was the mother of the property owner. But if it’s the mother of the Horse Owner - yeah, I’d be expecting my mom to call me asap.
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