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I THINK I HAVE A SOLUTION ! Bit suggestions for fussy mouthed De Niro 4yo

Good post!
I don’t understand why dressage riders insist on using a flash when the whole point of dressage is to learn to ride well enough that the horse will go willingly for the rider. If a rider needs artificial aids like a flash then s/he needs to learn how to ride and quit changing bits and browbands and saddles to correct “faults” in the horse caused by the rider.
Maybe these DeNiro horses would be happier in a different discipline. Maybe they would be happier doing ranch work in a hackamore. Maybe they would be happier living as pasture puffs. Maybe DeNiro should be gelded so he can’t sire any more “unhappy mouth” horses.
Good grief. :frowning:

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Maybe just let them stand in a stall with a bit in their mouth for hours until they just got over it. It works wonders.

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I had a mare that the flash was not for closing her mouth but for stabilizing the bit against the corners of her lips. The flash was borderline too loose, as I just needed it to scoop under the bit and apply the teensiest bit of pressure.

She was a very anxious and tense mare. The flash for sure helped with convincing her to go into and stay in the contact.

New mare doesn’t need it, so doesn’t wear one.

Every horse is different.

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Now if we could just get back to the classical dressage shown in the not-so-old photos where the horses are being ridden with no cavesson at all …

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Same here. Another poster suggested the Sprenger Duo for my sensitive gelding and it works better than anything I have tried. Some horses do require a lighter hand and mild bit. It has nothing to do with breeding.

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Modern changes and improvements in tack are not necessarily bad as we learn more about biomechanics. I don’t hate a flash. As endlessclimb said, every horse is different. As to “the classical dressage shown in the not-so-old photos where the horses are being ridden with no cavesson at all …” that’s a great goal, but in competitive dressage, not always practical. Also, when you look at those old pictures, you see horses that are often (not always) upside down - not coming across the back. While the ultimate goal is self carriage, what you don’t want is a horse that “carries” the bit(s). Think a finished Western horse that is not ridden on contact. I have seen this a zillion times in horses trained (supposedly) in the French school. Lightness is brilliant, but not if the horse is completely upside down.
Back to your regular thread.

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I’ve tried a fullcheek single break snaffle, a titanium fager baby fulmer, a happy mouth with roller and and just got a new mullen to switch my baby over to. He flips his head all over the place with the happy mouth…It was the worst one. Hopefully this mullen in a new size will work better. Usually after about five minutes he settles down enough for us to learn something. Keeping our rides short and sweet. Hardest baby horse to bit i’ve ever had to sort out…

I thought my horse might be a head-shaker, but it turns out, gnats love him. Even gnats I cannot see. I put repellent on his nose every time we ride. Sometimes it is just his forelock hair shedding, but he is so attuned to bugs that he will get fussy over that, too. If I happen to see the one bugging him, it is amazing how they follow him – we have to outrun it.

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I have noticed that he does better with an ear net, even in winter. I think it’s his forelock touching his ears or tickling him.

… and there’s the rub. A great goal in classical dressage should be a great goal in competitive dressage as well. They should not be two different disciplines. If winning a competition requires short cuts in training horse and rider, then competitive “dressage” should re-think itself and perhaps change its name.

Like today’s “hunters.” They don’t hunt, unlike the hunters of my youth and earlier years.

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I had a mare who was like this. She could not stand having her mane or forelock hair tickle her ears. I always rode her with an ear bonnet. A blingy bonnet.

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I don’t disagree that the training should be the same. But I do think there is a distinction between art and sport. YMMV. I also don’t think that improving tack constitutes a “short cut.” The goal of dressage is and has always been to make the job of being ridden easier for the horse. I do not believe standing pat on traditional tack is necessarily the best way to go about that. JMO.

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I agree. But I do not think that flash straps are “improving” anything. They are a crutch for a poor rider.

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I have always thought that “flash straps” look like a bastardized addition to a conventional cavesson. If you need stabilization of the bit, the drop noseband or the figure-8 noseband are designed for this purpose

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i’m in the ‘less is more’ camp myself. I have way more respect for a rider who doesn’t have to harness a horse into submission.

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I do not use a noseband.

I think that the HORSES have way more respect for a rider that doesn’t harness a horse into submission.

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De Niro has died but the irony of your comment cracked me up. He is one of the most prolific sires of international Grand Prix horses of all time. He was literally ranked #1 on the WBFSH (World Breeding Federation for Sport Horses) ranking of dressage sires several years and usually in the top ten. He himself was an accomplished Grand Prix horse by age 7.

Dressage training comes with endless puzzles to solve. A problem doesn’t mean you need to quit and switch disciplines; it just means you need to get curious and look for better ways.

Love De Niro :heart_eyes:

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