Individual vs. group turnout for show horses

I’ve founod zero correlation to home turnout schedule and how they behave at shows, at least for the horses I’ve dealt with.

What turnout type is used is highly dependent on the horse(s). Personally I have zero qualms about group turnout for show horses. Horses will find ways to bang themselves up regardless, so if they’re happier in a group, they get turned out in a group. Show horse or not, the group should always be horses that get along. There’s a big difference between a small nick or scratch now and again, and one who’s coming in daily with blood drawn, or a situation that escalates from the occasional scratch to large wounds that draw blood weekly.

I have a spooky mare and it’s been a long road getting her to chillax at shows, and it’ll be several more years yet before the tension truly goes away. When she was younger, I tried the route of moving her to a busy/bustling boarding facility in hopes it may help her get more used to the busier atmosphere. It did not work, all it did was make her anxious and tense 24/7, which is no fun for anyone. So, now in my backyard, she gets to have a quiet, happy home with 24/7 turnout with a buddy. She’s at home far more often than she is away at a show, and home should be where she’s allowed peace and quiet if that’s what she needs. What is helping her with shows is hauling out to school and going to as many shows as I can afford.

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I have also found very little correlation between home turnout and how they behave at a show.

I have one that lives out 24/7 in group turnout. He immediately cribs at home if he’s stalled. The busier the atmosphere, the more he gets stressed.
He’s pretty chill at shows though. He can be stalled for several days without cribbing. Never calls, etc.

The other one is stalled at night and turned with a group during the day at home.
He is more likely to call to other horses and walk his stall while at a show.

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My show horse goes out individually but with other horses in the next paddock. We’ve tried a buddy but one of two things happens. Either he beats the heck out of the other or he gets beat up. So, alone he goes. While I’d like him to have a buddy sometimes it just doesn’t work. Since you are setting up your own place you might want to have the option.

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When I bought my gelding, they told me he had to go out alone. We kept him on his own that first summer, but turnout at our barn was very limited anyway. When I moved upstate for college we transitioned him to going out with a quiet older large pony gelding, and the two of them got along fine. He now goes out with three other geldings ranging in age from 11 to 19.

We found out quickly that he is the dominant horse in the pasture, and I suspect his former owners weren’t in a position to play musical turnouts to find the right buddies for him so they just left him on his own to keep him from beating up on other horses. It took some trial and error, a few scrapes and bite marks, to find the right group for him. He’s a grouchy old man and likes his space. He goes out and has to pin his ears and chase everyone away from the hay hut, but as soon as he’s taken a bite of hay they can all come back and eat and he’s fine with them.

It definitely hasn’t always been perfect but I do think it’s been good for him to have buddies. He still has a love/hate relationship with them, but he is a chestnut gelding that really should have been born a mare for all his attitude. :lol:

I have not found any connection between home life & show behaviour either. I do not keep horses alone – they were with at least one other buddy, usually in a group when boarding, and now they are at home, I just have two. Social interaction is important & there has been a lot of research on the value of physical contact. Individuals vary of course, but in general & in my long experience, companionship is good.

The one I take with me (doesn’t matter which one) has never had any issues being somewhere else with other horses. It’s not like they are the only horse on the showgrounds.

Horses also learn about shows over time as they have more experience, so that is likely why you are seeing improvement.

I’ve never noticed a large change in the horse’s behavior even when going to a show alone (they have neighbors at a show), but it depends on your particular horse. My current horse is turned out 24/7 alone but with neighbors on both sides he can interact with. He dislike stalls even though he was raised in 12 hr stall, 12 hr turnout. Some days at shows are better than others at shows. I discovered this horse is 1000 time better when he has a stall or a stall guard and he can look out. Looking at the environment makes all the difference to THIS horse.

Perhaps consider individual smaller paddocks off the back of your new barn that open into a large paddock. This set up is preferred in case you have a lame horse that needs very limited turnout but your horse can still see/interact with the others. Feed them in their individual stalls even if you leave the gates open. They’ll figure it out quickly.

That said, I suspect your “buddy sour” guy will 100% forget his buddy at a show and bond to the horse next door!

ETA: My horse has been turned out with others before just fine, but he can be very dominant about food. He needs a more dominant mare without shoes to keep him in line. I’m hesitant to turn him out with another horse with shoes because he stands a great chance of getting injured or injuring another. Not worth it.

Mine are out in a herd setting - 5 different geldings right now.

Separating for alone time doesn’t fix the herd bound issue IME. It’s something that you just have to plug away at every day. I’d rather them be herd-bound and happy in a group, than solitary and unhappy - horses are not happy alone. They’re healthier and happier in a group and way less likely to develop ulcers IME.

I have had no issues during the show season with the above… but I give my horses the winter off (Dec-Febish) and usually they can be a bit herd-bound the first two weeks. I just ignore it, and after a few consistent rides we’re back to their business-like behavior with no issues.

As far as how the UL/BNT riders do it… I’ve been in barns where it was either/or. I really liked the last WS stint I had because that rider turned her UL (as in 3*+) horses out together… It was my first time working for a competition/sale barn where horses were not in solitary turnout – and her horses were so much happier and way easier to ride/care for than the horses of past pros I’d worked for.I truly believe it makes a difference.

A bit of a tangential story but, I briefly had my gelding alone when he hurt himself (pelvic fractures). I had him in a solitary medical paddock, and then when my vet said it was okay, put him in a bigger grass paddock where he could see his old friends. I’ve had him for four years at this point, he’d always been easy keeper, quiet, and no fuss. He wore his hooves down to nothing pacing constantly, dropped a lot of weight, and became uncharacteristically sharp and flighty. Pretty much within two weeks of putting him back with the herd he was back to being chill and tractable, and within a month had already packed on most of the weight he had lost. He was really unhappy being alone, did not adjust well, and he is not a horse I would have previously described as needy - he prefers hanging out by himself in a herd, but boy did I notice how miserable he was when he had to be alone to heal. It was so bad at one point we tried letting him have a goat friend - he was so desperate he would try to hang out with the chickens! Horses need and thrive on the company of others - they’re social animals and feel disadvantaged alone.

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I beg to disagree.

Horses come in all flavors, some like company, some thrive with company, some are utterly unhappy without company.
Plenty of others, not so much.

Just as your story of your one horse not doing well alone, we had horses that turned out with others were driven around so much they became foot sore.
We had to take the perpetrator away to let the others have peace.
He loved it alone, once he didn’t have to be taking care of his herd any more by bossing, driving them mercilessly as he felt he had to when with them.

That was one of plenty of horses that for some reason or other, he and those with him were not in a good situation turned out with others.
The second horse like that in a decade.

I feel as strongly about NOT being so sure every horse is better off in a herd as others do that all horses are better off in a herd.

I think we need to know our horses and manage for who they are, in all the many different ways horses are, some that like or even need to have others to be contented and some that do fine without.

We have managed many, many horses and know plenty of them were the more solitary kind and those were not the rare exception, but just one more way horses are, individuals, not all the same.

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My show horse is out 24/7 on 30 acres with a herd of 10 mares. She’s much happier, healthier, and saner (she’s HOTTT by nature) that way. She’s not remotely buddy sour and has no issues being stalled at shows/clinics. There have been a few major injuries in that pasture (one broken leg and one major laceration) but my mare is older and stays out of trouble

I’m well aware that any day could be her last or a pasture injury could end her career. It’s a sacrifice I’m willing to make for her happiness in the herd/large pasture environment. To me the benefits far outweigh the risks

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I think the alone vs group choice also has to do with the size of the turnout. Near me, it is unusual for boarding barns to have large pastures. Group turnout ends up being in a larger paddock. I have found this creates a number of issues with horses not being able to separate adequately and resulting in more bites and kicks.

Horse may be more “natural” in a group (although geldings arent exactly natural!) but modern horsekeeping may make the risks unacceptable in some circumstances. I have found that many do fine with over-the-fence buddies and I suspect some prefer to have their space.

ETA: I also had a horse who seemed socially inept. He pestered other horses. If they were dominant, he got beat up. If they were submissive, he wouldnt leave them alone and beat them up! A number of combinations were tried but he just couldnt seem to make friends. Eventually he did find an over-the-fence buddy to play endless games of Got-Your-Face!

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I’m ok with my show horses having group turnout if the turnout areas are large enough (ie, not 5 jammed into a paddock made for 1 which is something I see often in my area).

Honestly, about half of my group of horses would rather be in individual turnout anyway. Only the younger ones seem to enjoy having buddies.

My now 25 y.o. Paint gelding has been managing activities for the geldings since he arrived 19 years ago. He hasn’t been challenged. Most of them are the BO’s lesson horses, a few are stalled at night and a couple, like us, are pasture boarded. The herd size runs between 6 and 12 or so, which is where it is currently. His cues are quite subtle because they all know what to do. When he is on the way back out they move off the round bale, let him find his spot, and fill back in. He does more ear pinning with new guys and might show his teeth, but rarely kicks out. The herd reorganizes pretty quickly.

There have been some shifts in dynamics this past year and quite a few people have noticed. He seems to have delegated some things to his #2, who keeps any eye on him now. #2 is a lot brattier with his cueing. There were more new horses than usual in a short period of time this summer and my horse was a bit standoffish. He has a real buddy for the first time, a red roan mustang who is a very recent arrival. A couple of veterans keep an eye on the new guys and will push them around.

It has pretty much settled down. The BO has a good eye for newcomers’ behaviors so we don’t see many problems. A lot of the interaction is related to hay. They are on round bales, usually two. There should be three because of the way they have sub-groups. After watching this for so many years I think there is a degree of stability because there is a group that lives together 24/7. If one is stalled overnight the herd still functions well because they work out the dynamics. There is very little coat damage. They aren’t chewed up… I noticed a scuff mark on his blanket which is unusual.

The mares are next to the geldings in much the same situation. They organize and interact differently and don’t play the way the geldings do. I think mares are kind of boring. :yes:

I disagree with Bluey a bit because I look at them as herd members first, and being alone isn’t good for many horses. You see a lot of solos around here because there are so many backyard farms. I don’t know how you tell if your horse needs some kind of company. Some of them probably should be in a herd, and some herd members should be out on their own. At our barn stalled horses are paired up in paddocks, out all day.

I think stability is important. If you have horses that go outside for a few hours, it should be the same group on a reasonably consistent schedule. I think that they would constantly start working out a new pecking order with a different cast of characters each time they go out. If they need to be turned out alone that will be apparent. We have 4 side-by-side paddocks for stalled horses in pairs. The perimeter is vinyl and they are divided up with wood posts and electric fence tape that is not charged. They share a couple of Nelson heated waters between 2 paddocks which leads to some interaction. There are quite a few pairs that are interacting with mutual grooming and some playfulness across the .tape. They are having a blast. The only time I see a lot of stress and discontent is when an individual is in the barn alone. Another horse within view usually takes care of it.

Years ago there was an instructor who moved her cryptorchid in, calling him gelding. She knew what he was because she refused to have surgery done. The BO didn’t know and tried a few options. The owner insisted he had to out with the herd. It took them less than an hour to run him out of there. He wound up in a round pen. Fortunately she moved on, which is good because she’s a lousy instructor.

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In an ideal world, I think horses would be kept on large enough pastures that everyone has their own space and source of food, and the more docile ones have a place to stay away from the more dominant ones. Unfortunately, I would venture to guess that the majority of horse owners (or at least boarders) don’t have access to such a situation. I agree with another poster who says the problem isn’t generally group turnout, but rather group turnout in a small space that causes the injuries we associate with group turnout. Some boarding barns also simply don’t have the time, land, and number of horses it requires to figure out what the compatible groups are.

I think that solitary turnout is probably better than being in a group where the horse is bullied all the time and can’t get away from his aggressors. But ideally, you’d be able to find a low-key, compatible buddy and have them out with at least one other horse.