Jeremy Steinberg - Between the Rounds Year in Review

[Bogey2]

as for the two hours…it does not take that long the second time around just the initial training is long. The recertifications are a lot shorter.

[BigMama1]

@alicen

Ditto. Perhaps he also sells equestrian clothing and accessories?

I think it’s code for small. He takes on only a handful of clients and spends a large percentage of time travelling and giving clinics.

[Lucassb]

@Bogey2

Kids can still do what we did as kids…I have them here all the time and don’t worry about being charged with anything. Barns all over my area do as well…and don’t worry about “risk”. Why? because WE aren’t doing anything questionable. I don’t get the whole over exaggeration thing about what the future holds. The system is designed to take out the bad people who were known to be diddlers etc. It holds them more accountable than a lot of the people who KNEW what was going on and ignored.

I am glad to hear that you do - as I said, it makes me sad that those opportunities are, let’s say, discouraged by the new regulations (albeit with the best intentions.) However, I know many, many trainers who have made a different decision and I can sadly respect that. They don’t want to take the risk. They have seen other innocent people accused - and have their businesses and reputations damaged - despite eventually being cleared of any wrongdoing.

[Peggy]

Boutique barn = small, and probably pricey.

[sascha]

@Lucassb

I am glad to hear that you do - as I said, it makes me sad that those opportunities are, let’s say, discouraged by the new regulations (albeit with the best intentions.) However, I know many, many trainers who have made a different decision and I can sadly respect that. They don’t want to take the risk. They have seen other innocent people accused - and have their businesses and reputations damaged - despite eventually being cleared of any wrongdoing.

Let me fix this one sentence for you … They BELIEVE they have seen (other?) innocent people acused.

Or maybe … They’ve seen their friends who they thought were better at covering excrement up than themselves get caught so they thought they’d better get out before their own excrement hit the fan.

Or perhaps … Since they are incapable of believing victims, they chose to believe their friends are innocent which led them to the unfortunate and foolish decision to pack up their own shops and walk away.

Please remember that even parents of victims are blind and stupid and can be willfully ignorant. It is not a stretch for a friend to continue to believe a friend rather than victims, the courts, etc.

Also, remember that this applies to all of us as well, so when we are told a trainer is packing it in due to the possibility of being wrongfully found to have been conducting their business in an unprofessional manner, we are likely to take them at their word rather than to wonder what the real reason is that they are packing their bags and running for the hills.

[eggbutt]

@Silverbridge

I understand misspelling a well-known person’s name in a thread title. That’s easy to do and half the time, it’s the fault of autocorrect.

But it’s weird leaving it misspelled for six pages of replies, over nearly that many days. It seems pointedly insulting to do that, so maybe that’s part of the agenda here.

Steinberg / Steinburg / Shmeinberg? Or something like that?

Thank you…I corrected the title and yes, I am assuming autocorrect. It is always wrong to misspell a person’s name.

[Jenerationx]

@sascha

Let me fix this one sentence for you … They BELIEVE they have seen (other?) innocent people acused.

Or maybe … They’ve seen their friends who they thought were better at covering excrement up than themselves get caught so they thought they’d better get out before their own excrement hit the fan.

Or perhaps … Since they are incapable of believing victims, they chose to believe their friends are innocent which led them to the unfortunate and foolish decision to pack up their own shops and walk away.

Please remember that even parents of victims are blind and stupid and can be willfully ignorant. It is not a stretch for a friend to continue to believe a friend rather than victims, the courts, etc.

Also, remember that this applies to all of us as well, so when we are told a trainer is packing it in due to the possibility of being wrongfully found to have been conducting their business in an unprofessional manner, we are likely to take them at their word rather than to wonder what the real reason is that they are packing their bags and running for the hills.

^ Thank you for pointing out that even the families of victims are in disbelief sometimes. If anyone is questioning the reasons we NEED SafeSport, please listen to the Believed podcast here: https://www.npr.org/about-npr/656853471/believed-tells-the-story-of-survivors-who-won-justice-against-larry-nassar

It was difficult to listen to at times and very triggering as a survivor of abuse, but it sheds a little light on just how blind everyone was to the seemingly nice, concerned doctor who had parents IN THE ROOM while he abused girls. One of the girls own father didn’t believe his daughter at the time, and later committed suicide probably in part due to the guilt in his role in allowing the situation that led to the abuse.

People just stick their heads in the sand when they think someone is a good doctor, trainer, coach, teacher, priest, etc… and don’t see what’s really happening.

@Cowgirl you were very lucky to not be among the molested while your parents were absent. Now you don’t think as an adult that we should all be held to the “see something, say something” principal and need to blame parents rather than the pedophiles and their cohorts that protect them? The environment you grew up in that nobody did anything about in the industry is why we have SafeSport now.

[Cowgirl]

@Jenerationx

^ Thank you for pointing out that even the families of victims are in disbelief sometimes. If anyone is questioning the reasons we NEED SafeSport, please listen to the Believed podcast here: https://www.npr.org/about-npr/656853471/believed-tells-the-story-of-survivors-who-won-justice-against-larry-nassar

It was difficult to listen to at times and very triggering as a survivor of abuse, but it sheds a little light on just how blind everyone was to the seemingly nice, concerned doctor who had parents IN THE ROOM while he abused girls. One of the girls own father didn’t believe his daughter at the time, and later committed suicide probably in part due to the guilt in his role in allowing the situation that led to the abuse.

People just stick their heads in the sand when they think someone is a good doctor, trainer, coach, teacher, priest, etc… and don’t see what’s really happening.

@Cowgirl you were very lucky to not be among the molested while your parents were absent. Now you don’t think as an adult that we should all be held to the “see something, say something” principal and need to blame parents rather than the pedophiles and their cohorts that protect them? The environment you grew up in that nobody did anything about in the industry is why we have SafeSport now.

NOT what I said. I think the parents need to be the first to be educated and it is not mandatory for them to take the course. This makes the SS system flawed and puts more responsibility on others. During my childhood, people just did not talk about such things…just about everything was closeted and the protections of SS would have made a huge difference. Also, there never were any adults around except the trainer. This is a different world now. About the parent in the room with the doctor abusing his child…was the parent educated in SS? Just having the parents have to be present while the kid is being trained is huge because…it means there are more adults around!

[mvp]

@Cowgirl

NOT what I said. I think the parents need to be the first to be educated and it is not mandatory for them to take the course. This makes the SS system flawed and puts more responsibility on others. During my childhood, people just did not talk about such things…just about everything was closeted and the protections of SS would have made a huge difference. Also, there never were any adults around except the trainer. This is a different world now. About the parent in the room with the doctor abusing his child…was the parent educated in SS? Just having the parents have to be present while the kid is being trained is huge because…it means there are more adults around!

SafeSport did not exist when Nassar was harming kids with their parents in the room.

The fact that “people did not talk about such things” is both the cause of so many people looking the other way or not believing what they are told by victims or what they saw, and it’s the reason that every adult should be willing to take the SafeSport training.

[Denali6298]

@Cowgirl

NOT what I said. I think the parents need to be the first to be educated and it is not mandatory for them to take the course. This makes the SS system flawed and puts more responsibility on others. During my childhood, people just did not talk about such things…just about everything was closeted and the protections of SS would have made a huge difference. Also, there never were any adults around except the trainer. This is a different world now. About the parent in the room with the doctor abusing his child…was the parent educated in SS? Just having the parents have to be present while the kid is being trained is huge because…it means there are more adults around!

Prior to safe sport parents and kids alike did make complaints. They were ignored. Jonathan Soresi complained in the early 2000’s about his experience and recanted. Well known trainers were threatened as well as their families over safe sport and GM. And you wanna cry Safe Sport requirements are an inconvenience? Professionals with all the integrity in the world were threatened as well as their families!! But yeah, it’s too hard for you.

[Bogey2]

@Lucassb

I am glad to hear that you do - as I said, it makes me sad that those opportunities are, let’s say, discouraged by the new regulations (albeit with the best intentions.) However, I know many, many trainers who have made a different decision and I can sadly respect that. They don’t want to take the risk. They have seen other innocent people accused - and have their businesses and reputations damaged - despite eventually being cleared of any wrongdoing.

this is such bullshit, who exactly is they and the wrongly accused and cleared? Be specific. Again, no one I associate with has ever expressed that they would run their business any differently based on safe sport…because they are already behaving accordingly with kids. I text them, I clean tack in the tackroom with them…they get dropped off…why? Because I am not a predator and I know I would never be accused.

[Denali6298]

@Bogey2

this is such bullshit, who exactly is they and the wrongly accused and cleared? Be specific. Again, no one I ass\ociate with has ever expressed that they would run their business any differently based on safe sport…because they are already behaving accordingly with kids. I text them, I clean tack in the tackroom with them…they get dropped off…why? Because I am not a predator and I know I would never be accused.

You won’t get a straight answer beyond Tommy Serio. All the other paranoid trainers are just paranoid because words are too hard.

[ladyj79]

@Denali6298

You won’t get a straight answer beyond Tommy Serio. All the other paranoid trainers are just paranoid because words are too hard.

And god knows his business was not impacted negatively at all.

And they’ve milked this endlessly. And received so so so much support from the small group of pedophile apologists.

[BigMama1]

This has all been hashed our extensively in the h/j forum - nothing new to see here. Most people are willing to put up with some inconvenience to protect themselves and their minor students. Most people think that confirmed sexual predators should be banned from coaching or teaching under the auspices of the USEF. The ones that don’t, or who think that SafeSport is unfair or unconstitutional, will not let facts change their minds.

[mountainbells]

A question for those more in the know. RE: Cowgirls claim that parents don’t have to do SS education. Do the parents of officially competing minors (i.e. in USEF sanctioned events) have to belong to USEF in order to have their child compete and sign any forms for a minor. And I suspect there’s a fair number who are owners of the competing horse. In which case they would have to do the Safe Sport Education.

[Lucassb]

@Bogey2

this is such bullshit, who exactly is they and the wrongly accused and cleared? Be specific. Again, no one I associate with has ever expressed that they would run their business any differently based on safe sport…because they are already behaving accordingly with kids. I text them, I clean tack in the tackroom with them…they get dropped off…why? Because I am not a predator and I know I would never be accused.

Well, as I said, that is your choice and I am glad that you still offer kids that opportunity. You can do your own research on people who were accused/cleared - or not, as you prefer. There have been quite a few posts on COTH by people who were personally affected (and probably more on other social media.) I don’t think you can claim that there are no trainers who have become worried about false accusations; just review the threads on this forum (incl the HJ board) and you will see some pertinent examples if you are inclined to see who they are. It makes me sad, even though I understand and appreciate their POV. I support the aims of SS and since the industry didn’t step up on its own, I understand and appreciate why it took a third party’s action to create change. I recognize that even if you have not adopted the recommendations for interactions with minors and continue to text them, etc - many have heeded the recommendations and no longer do. Have a nice day.

[Lucassb]

@mountainbells

A question for those more in the know. RE: Cowgirls claim that parents don’t have to do SS education. Do the parents of officially competing minors (i.e. in USEF sanctioned events) have to belong to USEF in order to have their child compete and sign any forms for a minor. And I suspect there’s a fair number who are owners of the competing horse. In which case they would have to do the Safe Sport Education.

No, parents do not have to be members of the USEF in order for their children to compete.

[HoolieB]

@BigMama1

This has all been hashed our extensively in the h/j forum - nothing new to see here. Most people are willing to put up with some inconvenience to protect themselves and their minor students. Most people think that confirmed sexual predators should be banned from coaching or teaching under the auspices of the USEF. The ones that don’t, or who think that SafeSport is unfair or unconstitutional, will not let facts change their minds.

Agreed.

BTW, am I the only one fascinated by the whole Steffen-married-Jeremy’s-girl thing? If yes, I humbly apologize for my shallowness.

[ladyj79]

@Lucassb

Well, as I said, that is your choice and I am glad that you still offer kids that opportunity. You can do your own research on people who were accused/cleared - or not, as you prefer. There have been quite a few posts on COTH by people who were personally affected (and probably more on other social media.) I don’t think you can claim that there are no trainers who have become worried about false accusations; just review the threads on this forum (incl the HJ board) and you will see some pertinent examples if you are inclined to see who they are. It makes me sad, even though I understand and appreciate their POV. I support the aims of SS and since the industry didn’t step up on its own, I understand and appreciate why it took a third party’s action to create change. I recognize that even if you have not adopted the recommendations for interactions with minors and continue to text them, etc - many have heeded the recommendations and no longer do. Have a nice day.

there really haven’t been quite a few people on coth who were “personally affected.” there were a handful of people repeatedly reposting Kathy Serio’s screed.

[Cowgirl]

@Denali6298

Prior to safe sport parents and kids alike did make complaints. They were ignored. Jonathan Soresi complained in the early 2000’s about his experience and recanted. Well known trainers were threatened as well as their families over safe sport and GM. And you wanna cry Safe Sport requirements are an inconvenience? Professionals with all the integrity in the world were threatened as well as their families!! But yeah, it’s too hard for you.

I’ll be happy to take it when all parents of participating athletes are required to take it. Otherwise, IMO, children are not really protected.