Lack of Communication from Barn Owners

[mmeqcenter]

@OverandOnward

Although I rather agree that you seem to have some quirky BM’s and it may be time to move, I’m going to put in a word on their side about the hard-to-catch horses. IMO you haven’t done your part with your horses by teaching them a basic horse skill, and that is coming to the gate and allowing themselves to be easily caught at the usual time to come in. This is trainable with the right techniques.

BM’s I’ve ever encountered do expect that horses will come in easily. The expectation is that they are waiting at the gate at the routine time, and readily accept a halter. The BM will help encourage new horses to learn the routine. But if the horses are hard to catch, or don’t come to the gate, then it isn’t really the BM’s job to either train them or to spend hours trying to catch them. That’s not included in board.

So no matter where you go, you may have issues with hard-to-catch horses.

I could not agree with this more. When I boarded, it did happen a handful of times. First day out all day with new spring grass, etc., pones just don’t.want.to.come.in. I would never in a million years have expected a BO to spend three hours trying to catch everyone’s horses. That is an absurdly unreasonable expectation. However, I do agree that OP’s BO should have informed the owners of any horses that missed a meal due to refusing to be caught. You can’t force people to change their communication style, therefore I would leave this barn.

Now, as a BO, I will not ever chase a horse for three hours to bring it in. Nope. Never gonna happen. At least not without its owner receiving an extra charge for my time that month. Now, I don’t need them to be waiting at the gate, I’ll give it 5-10 mins, that’s it. But, again, if I were ever unable to catch someone to bring it in for a meal, I would inform the owner. It has only happened once or twice for me so far as a BO. Both times, I just went around and fed everyone else, and by the time I was done with that, surprise surprise Mr Difficult would then be waiting at the gate like “What about meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee” and come right in.
I also have the luxury of having several different field size options, and if I get a horse in that the owner tells me up front is hard to catch, then it goes in a small 60’x120’ lot by itself, or even the 50’ round pen for really naughty ones, until it learns that catching is an expectation and running is unacceptable. I’ve yet to have a hard-to-catch horse revert back to its naughty ways after employing this strategy.

I also agree with those that said expecting a text every time the horses stay in due to weather is an unreasonable expectation. When or before you moved in, you should have asked the BO for a summary of their turn-in/turn-out restrictions, and thus be able to look at the weather and say to yourself, “Oh, they probably kept Dobbin in today.”

[Mini_Mom]

@OnDeck

She’s not asking the barn workers to chase down her feral horses for two hours a day, she’s asking them to walk to the other end of the field to catch an older horse and send a text saying the others didn’t come in.

I would fire any worker who thought it was unreasonable to walk to the other end of a field to retrieve an older, blind gelding who didn’t realize it was feeding time.

AMEN. OP, I have been in your shoes and it sucks to try to communicate what you want to someone (BO or BM) who really just doesn’t care or is lazy. It’s also not that easy (at least in my area) to just go find another place. Even the super expensive places are not necessarily that great.

[paintedpony]

You do not get to manage the owners. Owners have clearly demonstrated the level of care that will be provided. The ball is now in your court.

[Sansena]

Time to move.
Or hire someone to bring your horses in every morning to ensure they’re being fed.

Is it possible the t/o field is too big? Mine’s a doll unless he’s out in countless acreage, then he can occasionally be a putz about being caught. Move him to a smaller area and poof, back to being a doll about being caught.

Can you purchase some round pen panels to make a t/o area smaller so the troublemakers easier to catch?

[Angela_Freda]

@OnDeck

She’s not asking the barn workers to chase down her feral horses for two hours a day, she’s asking them to walk to the other end of the field to catch an older horse and send a text saying the others didn’t come in.

I would fire any worker who thought it was unreasonable to walk to the other end of a field to retrieve an older, blind gelding who didn’t realize it was feeding time.

Exactly she writes in her OP that all she ask is that IF they can not bring her horses in, they let her know and she will come do it.
For those lamenting chronically hard to catch horses, seems calling her every time they are hard to catch so that she is the one schlepping all over creation would be a great way to show her just how hard to catch they are/aren’t.

But others are correct, you can not make a barn or workers at a barn do the job you hired them to do if they choose not to, and apparently you can’t expect them to train, or maintain the training your horses have, that coming in with them is a good thing.
When people show you who they are… time to move.

[OneTwoMany]

@Low And Slow

I am having issues getting my barn owner to communicate with me. Over the summer, they were doing night turnout- we found out half-way through summer that there were several days over the course of several weeks that our horses were not brought in because they couldn’t catch them. Our horses are in an approximately 5 acre field, and we do have two mares that sometimes will run and not want to be caught. The other 2 horses generally do not run unless they are being herded by the other two heathens.

Just to recap, you have 2 horses that are generally easy to catch unless they are being herded by your two heathen mares, which is known to happen.

@Low And Slow

Our older gelding has never run from anyone in the years we have had- he is a total people person. He is, however mostly blind and we think partially deaf and likes to hang out in the far corner of the pasture under the only 2 little trees in the field.

Fifth horse is blind and possibly deaf.

@Low And Slow

The only reason we found out about it was that one of the managers made an off-hand comment about how hard they were to catch in the mornings after we asked why they weren’t in when we came to clean stalls. Turns out that it had been an issue for a few weeks. When we asked why they hadn’t let us know, they tried to back-track stating that “most” of the time they would eventually come in (they have someone that comes a little later in the mornings to try again).

So heathen mares and herded geldings are hard to catch. But you already knew this. I’m not sure there is “back tracking”. You are being informed of a behavior you knew already existed.

@Low And Slow

One of the hard to catch mares has few teeth left, and has to have grain to get her nutrition- only being fed once a day suddenly explained why we hadn’t been able to maintain her weight. During the discussion, we talked about how the gelding can always be caught- they complained that he was always in the far corner of the pasture, and they “didn’t have that kind of time” in the morning to walk out and get him.

So after trying to bring in heathen mares and chased geldings, the help doesn’t have time to bring in a blind gelding at the far end of the field. Not an excuse, but you can see how this can snowball.

@Low And Slow

I explicitly asked that they call me if the horses did not come in, and I would come bring them in myself. Never got a call, assumed, perhaps foolishly, that they had gotten the message that not feeding our horses was not acceptable. A couple of weeks later, and one of us stops down during a lunch break to drop off grain, and the old gelding was out in the field by himself- they brought in everyone but him. When questioned why he was still out, they tried to claim that he wouldn’t come to them. Not even remotely likely.

But if you aren’t there to observe and prove/disprove the claim, it isn’t worth making an accusation.

@Low And Slow

More clearly stated that I was to be called anytime any of the horses did not come in. 3 days later find out from another boarder that the gelding was found outside the barn because they had left the gate and his stall open so he could wander in on his own, however apparently didn’t close the front barn door. Fortunately he camped out on some good grass near the barn, but it is possible for horses to reach the road if they are outside the barn and fenced pastures.

It isn’t 100% clear from the post, but if your gelding had access to the road, you need to move. If you horse gets in the road and there is a collision and human injuries or fatalities, you can be liable. Not to mention your horse could be injured or killed.

@Low And Slow

Most recently, I asked them to clearly communicate with all of their boarders if they are going to be leaving horses in due to weather (this has been a given at every barn I have ever been at-they have a FB barn page specifically for these kinds of communications, but won’t do it). I got a nasty reply that as the owners, they make the decision if horses are going out or not. I said No problem, but you still need to let boarders know what is going on with their horses.

Honestly, if a boarder feels the need to tell a BO how to run their business and when to communicate with their clients, the relationship is probably already spent.

@Low And Slow

I don’t think I am asking for too much to be notified if my horses are not being brought in or turned out as expected, or getting messages if there is any kind of incidence involving my horses. They act like I am expecting too much. Thoughts?

Obviously we are only getting one side of the story, but it sounds like your horses can be difficult to catch and bring in at times. And it sounds like this facility doesn’t have a ton of resources to spend on horses that don’t want to be caught.

If your blind gelding had access to the road, you need to move, for your safety, your horses’ safety and the safety of the traffic that travels near your barn.

The opening post says “I’m having trouble getting the BO to do XYZ.” Problem is, people don’t change easily. The best thing you can do is find a barn that fits the needs of you and your horses as they exist today. If you expect a barn to change to accommodate you and your needs, you are most certainly going to be disappointed.

[SonnysMom]

In a normal full board situation I would agree with those that say they don’t expect a phone call if the horses stay in due to weather. However in this case the OP is the one cleaning the stalls. Therefore she may want to clean the stall an additional time or she may need to pick up additional bedding if they were in longer than expected and hence the stalls are messier.

[OneTwoMany]

#26
Nov. 4, 2019, 11:54 AM

Originally posted by Low And Slow View Post
I am having issues getting my barn owner to communicate with me. Over the summer, they were doing night turnout- we found out half-way through summer that there were several days over the course of several weeks that our horses were not brought in because they couldn’t catch them. Our horses are in an approximately 5 acre field, and we do have two mares that sometimes will run and not want to be caught. The other 2 horses generally do not run unless they are being herded by the other two heathens.

Just to recap, you have 2 horses that are generally easy to catch unless they are being herded by your two heathen mares, which is known to happen.

Originally posted by Low And Slow View Post
Our older gelding has never run from anyone in the years we have had- he is a total people person. He is, however mostly blind and we think partially deaf and likes to hang out in the far corner of the pasture under the only 2 little trees in the field.

Fifth horse is blind and possibly deaf.

Originally posted by Low And Slow View Post
The only reason we found out about it was that one of the managers made an off-hand comment about how hard they were to catch in the mornings after we asked why they weren’t in when we came to clean stalls. Turns out that it had been an issue for a few weeks. When we asked why they hadn’t let us know, they tried to back-track stating that “most” of the time they would eventually come in (they have someone that comes a little later in the mornings to try again).

So heathen mares and herded geldings are hard to catch. But you already knew this. I’m not sure there is “back tracking”. You are being informed of a behavior you knew already existed.

Originally posted by Low And Slow View Post
One of the hard to catch mares has few teeth left, and has to have grain to get her nutrition- only being fed once a day suddenly explained why we hadn’t been able to maintain her weight. During the discussion, we talked about how the gelding can always be caught- they complained that he was always in the far corner of the pasture, and they “didn’t have that kind of time” in the morning to walk out and get him.

So after trying to bring in heathen mares and chased geldings, the help doesn’t have time to bring in a blind gelding at the far end of the field. Not an excuse, but you can see how this can snowball.

Originally posted by Low And Slow View Post
I explicitly asked that they call me if the horses did not come in, and I would come bring them in myself. Never got a call, assumed, perhaps foolishly, that they had gotten the message that not feeding our horses was not acceptable. A couple of weeks later, and one of us stops down during a lunch break to drop off grain, and the old gelding was out in the field by himself- they brought in everyone but him. When questioned why he was still out, they tried to claim that he wouldn’t come to them. Not even remotely likely.

But if you aren’t there to observe and prove/disprove the claim, it isn’t worth making an accusation.

Originally posted by Low And Slow View PostMore clearly stated that I was to be called anytime any of the horses did not come in. 3 days later find out from another boarder that the gelding was found outside the barn because they had left the gate and his stall open so he could wander in on his own, however apparently didn’t close the front barn door. Fortunately he camped out on some good grass near the barn, but it is possible for horses to reach the road if they are outside the barn and fenced pastures.

It isn’t 100% clear from the post, but if your gelding had access to the road, you need to move. If you horse gets in the road and there is a collision and human injuries or fatalities, you can be liable. Not to mention your horse could be injured or killed.

Originally posted by Low And Slow View Post
Most recently, I asked them to clearly communicate with all of their boarders if they are going to be leaving horses in due to weather (this has been a given at every barn I have ever been at-they have a FB barn page specifically for these kinds of communications, but won’t do it). I got a nasty reply that as the owners, they make the decision if horses are going out or not. I said No problem, but you still need to let boarders know what is going on with their horses.

Honestly, if a boarder feels the need to tell a BO how to run their business and when to communicate with their clients, the relationship is probably already spent.

Originally posted by Low And Slow View Post
I don’t think I am asking for too much to be notified if my horses are not being brought in or turned out as expected, or getting messages if there is any kind of incidence involving my horses. They act like I am expecting too much. Thoughts?

Obviously we are only getting one side of the story, but it sounds like your horses can be difficult to catch and bring in at times. And it sounds like this facility doesn’t have a ton of resources to spend on horses that don’t want to be caught.

If your blind gelding had access to the road, you need to move, for your safety, your horses’ safety and the safety of the traffic that travels near your barn.

The opening post says “I’m having trouble getting the BO to do XYZ.” Problem is, people don’t change easily. The best thing you can do is find a barn that fits the needs of you and your horses as they exist today. If you expect a barn to change to accommodate you and your needs, you are most certainly going to be disappointed.

[OneTwoMany]

Realistically, a horse (or horses) that don’t want to be caught are a huge PITA and they are even more so if they make the other horses run. OP might find it useful if she worked with her horses so they are easier to catch or arranged that the mares are turned out a smaller field.

If OP’s blind gelding has access to the road, OP needs to move immediately. She is subjecting herself to a great deal of liability. Should the blind gelding wander into the road and be struck, OP could be liable for the enusing human injuries and human death depending on her state laws. This is an extremely unsafe situation.

After a relationship has deteriorated to the point where the boarder feels they can/should/need to tell the BO how to run their business and how to communicate with all the other boarders, it is time to pack it up and move.

OP may find it challenging to find a place that can accommodate all her horses and all her needs, but if blind gelding can get in the road, there is NO time to waste.

[stb]

@firecracker

I don’t think it is always necessary to receive notifications on changes in turnout due to normal weather events, but I would want to know if my horses weren’t being fed. I would also want to know if the horses weren’t being brought in due to difficulties catching them.

For me, finding out that my horse was outside the barn with access to a road would be a deal-breaker. I understand that no place is perfect and there will always be some give and take when it comes to boarding, but I would be absolutely livid if something like this happened to me.

If I was in your shoes, I would start looking for a new barn. It sounds like the relationship between you and the barn owners has already started to deteriorate (you’re frustrated with them, they are ignoring your requests, they sent you a nasty reply, etc). Continuing to press the issue will likely only escalate tensions.

Agreed.

[findthedistance]

Not that it will help in the OP’s situation, but the fancy farm across the road from me has a Twitter account where they post the daily turnout and blanketing status. It strikes me as brilliant for their situation – large, busy farm with many… shall we say detail-oriented? … owners. I imagine it dramatically decreased the number of texts they get in a day.

[mmeqcenter]

@findthedistance

Not that it will help in the OP’s situation, but the fancy farm across the road from me has a Twitter account where they post the daily turnout and blanketing status. It strikes me as brilliant for their situation – large, busy farm with many… shall we say detail-oriented? … owners. I imagine it dramatically decreased the number of texts they get in a day.

Do people regularly text their BO to ask if their horse went out or not?

[findthedistance]

@mmeqcenter

Do people regularly text their BO to ask if their horse went out or not?

They did there. To be fair, the farm is adjacent to a hunt fixture, so they have frequent no turnout/partial turnout days that are not obvious weather events. But there were plenty of texts about rain, etc. as well.

[Palm_Beach]

@mmeqcenter

Do people regularly text their BO to ask if their horse went out or not?

IKR - hopefully the BO charges an arm and a leg to put up with the hand holding. I can’t imaging having boarders who can’t handle the slightest change in schedule. How do they hold down jobs? Or simply get through life?

[mmeqcenter]

@Palm Beach

IKR - hopefully the BO charges an arm and a leg to put up with the hand holding. I can’t imaging having boarders who can’t handle the slightest change in schedule. How do they hold down jobs? Or simply get through life?

Seriously. I can’t even imagine pestering a BO like that.

[Guilherme]

@mmeqcenter

Seriously. I can’t even imagine pestering a BO like that.

Been there. Done that. Got the T-shirt. Wore it out!

What seems to escape modern folks is the reality that the more time you spend talking about doing something the less time you have to actually do it. A state of stability is reached when you spend all your time talking about all that you’re not doing.

On the subject of “hard to handle” horses it was my experience that if you put one in with a bunch of easy to handle horses they would learn, over time, that handling usually leads to pleasant things (like food, grooming, etc.). If the only time a horse gets handled it gets hurt (injected, has it’s feet pounded on, gets it head jerked around, etc.) it will soon learn to avoid such things. This sometimes embarrasses owners (when their horse would come up to me but run from them) but I told them what I did to get the horse to cooperate and offered to help them achieve the same but that it would require that they invest some time in the project. Some did, some didn’t.

Owners of horses that required significant handling beyond normal were charged extra (either a higher board rate or a surcharge if the issue was temporary (like rehabbing from an injury or the like). Most folks didn’t object once they understood the issue. Proving that effective communication is better and more productive than just “communication.”

Daily text or Tweets or the like are a serious drain on time and I’d charge for it if a client were truly demanding. My time is valuable, too.

G.

[OverandOnward]

@mmeqcenter

Do people regularly text their BO to ask if their horse went out or not?

If I’m planning to ride there is a good chance I do. If I don’t already know for sure because the weather was not that definitely clear or inclement. It’s part of holding down that job and managing life - I have to time-plan everything around everything, every day. Not so unusual these days.

It’s also part of the BM having discretion to make that decision. The BM is the one who knows just how good or bad conditions are at the barn/pasture.

The BM has been happy to cooperate with owners who occasionally need to know if there horse is in or out. It isn’t an every day thing, usually owners know. And the BM has often been pro-active in notifying owners if the usual routine changes for weather.

I really like the idea of that twitter account update! Very convenient! Will pass that idea along.

[OverandOnward]

Agreed that communications are important if a horse is not cooperating with barn staff, about coming in from pasture, or anything else. Both sides have their obligations to the other - the owner to deal with the more disruptive behavioral difficulties, and the BO/BM to notify the owner of issues. And if either side is not living up to their obligations, that is likely a deal-breaker.

I had forgotten this - my last gelding could be a whimsical pill sometimes. The board barn at the time let me know of an issue, and how they solved it. At some point after months in the usual routine (perhaps due to change of season or who knows what), when it was time for the herd to come in, my gelding decided to dance around the perimeter of the group in an attention-seeking and un-catchable manner.

The two guys who brought the horses in didn’t spend any time gratifying his interest in scampering just out of their reach. They brought all of the other horses in and left him there. It’s putting a bit of human drama on a horse, but knowing this horse, I can imagine his horrified and devastated expression when he saw all of the people and horses now on the other side of the gate walking away toward dinner, leaving him alone in the pasture.

They left naughty gelding alone in the pasture for 20 minutes to think about his life choices while listening to dinner being served in the barn. He was only too eager to come in when he got a second chance. A couple of times of that, and he was cured. And they made sure I knew what was going on.

However, this was a horse that had complied with the routine in the past, and not a horse that was fleeing off into the countryside. So I know this would not work for every case.

[mmeqcenter]

@OverandOnward

If I’m planning to ride there is a good chance I do. If I don’t already know for sure because the weather was not that definitely clear or inclement. It’s part of holding down that job and managing life - I have to time-plan everything around everything, every day. Not so unusual these days.

Until three years ago I boarded my horses, had a full time job (and sometimes a part time in addition), and almost never lived closer than 30 mins to the barn nor work. I can’t recall ever texting a BO to ask if the horses were in or out. I really don’t understand what difference it makes.

Maybe if I had a 40+stall barn and a bunch of hired help, I’d be willing to set up a Facebook group or something (I don’t do Twitter) for daily notifications. But IMO having to post daily if the horses are out or not is just as much of a waste of time as answering texts asking the same thing. But, of course, BOs often create their management style based on what they expected as a boarder. I’d never have expected such a thing as a boarder, so I don’t do such a thing as a BO.

[Palm_Beach]

@mmeqcenter

Until three years ago I boarded my horses, had a full time job (and sometimes a part time in addition), and almost never lived closer than 30 mins to the barn nor work. I can’t recall ever texting a BO to ask if the horses were in or out. I really don’t understand what difference it makes.

Maybe if I had a 40+stall barn and a bunch of hired help, I’d be willing to set up a Facebook group or something (I don’t do Twitter) for daily notifications. But IMO having to post daily if the horses are out or not is just as much of a waste of time as answering texts asking the same thing. But, of course, BOs often create their management style based on what they expected as a boarder. I’d never have expected such a thing as a boarder, so I don’t do such a thing as a BO.

Agree. I operate as if things need to get done with no messing around, and if I find myself with a few extra minutes, there are plenty of little things to do, or maybe I’ll just sit down and relax for a few minutes.