So are there any genetic problems to look for in warmbloods?
[QUOTE=skydy;6848664]
I will speak up if you give me the link to the actual “conversation”. If I were to be banned would it keep me from watching COTHer’s mares late at night? ( links from this forum,from specific COTH members, are the only way I have ever visited “mare stare”).
Those are the only ones I’m interested in watching ( I have no desire to see much of what is out there I’m sure) ,and I can be of use because I keep late hours.[/QUOTE]
Here is the thread, but I really recommend that you not say anything disparaging as it will be deleted, most likely long before the mare owner gets a chance to view it. They can ban people from being able to view other people’s cams as I had to have them ban someone once but not sure how often they go to that extreme.
http://latigo.marestare.com/forum/index.php?topic=29105.0
[QUOTE=Laurierace;6848828]
Here is the thread, but I really recommend that you not say anything disparaging as it will be deleted, most likely long before the mare owner gets a chance to view it. They can ban people from being able to view other people’s cams as I had to have them ban someone once but not sure how often they go to that extreme.
http://latigo.marestare.com/forum/index.php?topic=29105.0[/QUOTE]
Ok… I went to the site. It seems only sunshine and butterflies and heaven is allowed.
Of course no one wants to kick someone when they’re down, but it is obvious that those folks are in need of an education in responsible breeding.
That said, I did not join to make a comment. I don’t think that even a kindly worded clinical explanation of why that NEVER SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED would be welcome.
Far be it from me, to bang my head against a wall…
I do look forward to seeing any COTHer’s mare stare feeds when the time comes.
I’m not going back there.Too much tragedy potential and I don’t need to see it. :mad:
[QUOTE=crosscreeksh;6848475]
I think there are two kinds of breeders who fit this catagory…ignorant ones who just don’t “know” and the very large businesses (mostly found out here in “livestock country”) who consider horses in the same class as cattle and just write off the lost ones!! [/QUOTE]
Even if you were breeding cattle, the 25% risk is still waaaaay above what would be considered 1) ethical & 2) financially viable.
For the love of God, DO NOT watch any of the mini mare’s cams! And no, commentary of any sort is frowned upon. They yell at people for having too much interaction on threads. Report what you see if the mare is doing something reportable, pray, shut up. That’s it. That is where I first discovered I hate emoticons as well!
Laurierace, I’m not going there AT ALL.
As I said, I’ll confine myself to watching mare stare only when the link is posted on this forum.
I can only imagine what you have seen…And I don’t want to see it.
That is one thing about MS that drives me insane. God forbid anyone say anything negative and actually allow others to learn something! How many of us were banned because of the Sassy fiasco? Heck, I said something about hating watching minis foal because it often seems WAY more difficult with a much higher mortality rate than ponies and horses. Oh. My. Gawd! I was edited, slammed on the board, AND given a reprimand with threat of being banned. All by the company owner, who just happens to be a mini-breeder, and who happene to lose a healthy foal during a (what seems typical for her farm) difficult foaling the night before.
All I have to say about that thread is PUKE!!! She should not have bred that mare to that stallion, especially since it appears she either knew the stallion was positive on the test (hence her talking about testing the mare) OR he is untested (again, hence testing the mare). Irresponsible all around.
[QUOTE=JB;6846580]
Yes 
However, even then, it IS in other breeds, though it didn’t jump there from the Paint. It’s in the TBs, though just a very few lines.[/QUOTE]
Really?? You just wrote that the HYPP gene did not jump from the QH to other breeds. , and I acknowledged that it jumped to other breed REGISTRIES… (semantics)
Now, it didn’t jump to the TB from the QH either. It began with a genetic mutation in one horse. The QH stallion “Impressive”.
Please tell, what TB lines are afflicted with HYPP?
I am very interested to know which TB lines, that you are certain, have the HYPP gene and pass it on.
[QUOTE=maybedog;6848723]
I have first hand heartbreak with HYPP. About 30 years ago I bred 2 mares to an Impressive grandson. He looked more TB [/QUOTE]
More proof that HYPP does not at all guarantee that steroid look 
EPSM/PSSM is “common” in WBs, and yes, there are tests for it now 
[QUOTE=skydy;6849106]Really?? You just wrote that the HYPP gene did not jump from the QH to other breeds. , and I acknowledged that it jumped to other breed REGISTRIES… (semantics)
Now, it didn’t jump to the TB from the QH either. It began with a genetic mutation in one horse. The QH stallion “Impressive”.
Please tell, what TB lines are afflicted with HYPP?
I am very interested to know which TB lines, that you are certain, have the HYPP gene and pass it on.[/QUOTE]
ummmmm, if you would finish reading, you will see that in our whole conversation, we/I were jumping around between OLWS and HYPP 
Sorry, if this is a gruesome question, but what about the LWO gene causes the actual fatality? The foal is born alive and then dies? From what? :no:
I am involved in Federal genomics policy, and this stuff (as sad as it is) fascinates me.
Incomplete digestive tract - they physically cannot pass manure. Ever. It’s not even close enough that surgery could fix it
So yes, he’s born alive and quite happy, but if he’s not put down, he WILL die of, eventually, ruptures
[QUOTE=wcporter;6849400]
Sorry, if this is a gruesome question, but what about the LWO gene causes the actual fatality? The foal is born alive and then dies? From what? :no:
I am involved in Federal genomics policy, and this stuff (as sad as it is) fascinates me.[/QUOTE]
The layman’s answer to that is they have an incomplete intestinal system ie. can not poop.
Oh God. That’s horrible! :no:
So is it obvious when the poor foal is born that it is LWO?
They start displaying colic symptoms shortly after birth so if it isn’t apparent due to them being white it will be apparent soon enough.
Wow. I can’t imagine risking that. So sick. And sad.
[QUOTE=wcporter;6849505]
Oh God. That’s horrible! :no:
So is it obvious when the poor foal is born that it is LWO?[/QUOTE]
These foals are born all/nearly all white, so that’s the first clue, particularly when you know Frame is involved. I THINK, but won’t swear, there is a quick test that can be done to verify that the foal is indeed a homozygous Frame. Maximally expressed Sabino, and maximally expressed Dominant White foals are also born all/nearly all white, so it’s important to know the difference.
[QUOTE=JB;6849293]
More proof that HYPP does not at all guarantee that steroid look
EPSM/PSSM is “common” in WBs, and yes, there are tests for it now
ummmmm, if you would finish reading, you will see that in our whole conversation, we/I were jumping around between OLWS and HYPP ;)[/QUOTE]
I did read ,and you were :yes: jumping around and unclear…:winkgrin: Thanks for clearing that up.
Many years ago a “friend” of mine brought her mare to us to foal. She was a black and white frame. I asked her owner what she was bred to and she said “a pretty stud that looks just like her”. Sure enough, she foaled a white foal. He did have some black in his tail, but I called the owner to prepare her for what I knew was inevitable. Within a few hours the foal was very colicky so was put down. I was so upset, especially when the owner said she would get a free rebreed! I preached till I was blue in the face, but it did no good. After all, she explained to me that it was only a 25% chance.
Thanks for the explanations. And what a sad way one has to “confirm” it–few things are more painful than colic.
[QUOTE=Hippolyta;6848925]
Even if you were breeding cattle, the 25% risk is still waaaaay above what would be considered 1) ethical & 2) financially viable.[/QUOTE]
I agree…but as you see…people are still willing to take the risk!! Ethics may not be involved and the financial situation is minmal. Horses are left to eat “available” grass (minimal hay when needed) and available water, no vaccinations, worming, pampering. The “overhead” is not the same as reputable breeders incur. A foal ( to some, not all) is a free bonus. OLW…oh well. Not our style, but such practices abound in our area. Years ago I was selling one of our stallions, a homozygous B/W paint. A “buyer” came to the farm and wanted to buy the stud to turn out with 80 broodmares. I asked what discipline he was targeting. He said, “nothing particular, I just want painted babies”!! It DOES happen in the real world!!
