Actually, according to the Pain Free Back and Saddle Fit Book, foam is the preferred material for some of these issues, including asymmetrical shoulders. The foam can be cut out to accommodate the differences, whereas wool will just keep floating around in the panel instead of leaving an opening where it is needed. I’m not sure if I’m describing that well but it makes sense if you read the book.
All this is true, but that’s not different than the “custom” wool flocked saddles. There are very few actual custom saddle makers out there… You should have heard the line the County rep sold me…as she pocketed my $150 consultation fee for 3 minutes of time and absolutely zero insight. I will probably never work with County again…
Wool provides more options, but also more upkeep, than foam panels. But even a wool panel on a tree that is the wrong shape is still going to be wrong.
I ended up with a Bruno Delgrange and I adore it. It’s obviously French and foam…but it works for my TB. The panel is designed for him…which became very apparent when I tried to use it on my WB mare. She very clearly said no…and her saddle is exactly the same but with a standard panel with no customizations. That customized panel does make a big difference. I do have to use a thin leather pad the TB’s saddle is slightly too wide, which freaked me out when I got it, but it’s perfect with the pad and hasn’t been an issue for 8 years. We even put it on other TBs wtih the same type of back and they seem to love it as well…
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I wasn’t suggesting most wool saddles were custom. Just trying to understand what adjustments the OP was envisioning when she was hoping to just adjustments on a used French saddle. There isn’t much to truly adjust there. With little room to tweak, getting someone to measure and get the order right is pretty critical
That, in a nutshell, is the difference between foam and wool. With a wool flocked saddle, adjustments are made on site and the fitter can watch you ride and tweak again as needed. With foam panels, the fitter takes measurements, new panels are made and attached to the saddle, then you cross your fingers when you put it back on your horse.
Well crap, you all are scaring me! :lol: Good news is, there are some riders at my barn selling their saddles to upgrade, so I’m going to start there. BM thinks there is one particular one that will fit both my horse and myself. If not, the search shall continue!
Yes… I wasn’t trying to call you out specifically, but I can’t figure out how to multi-quote in any easy fashion anymore. I was trying to address more of the comments from both you and findeight. If a tree is the wrong shape, it doesn’t matter if the panels are wool or foam…and that even wool saddles are not custom (which you really didn’t state, but is sometimes an implication with the conversations about the more static nature of foam).
Adjustments are made on site to wool, but should be reviewed at minimum twice a year to perpetuity. So many people forget to do that…or just don’t. For someone on a stricter budget…or in a hard to reach location, foam can be a better option as there is no upkeep.
There are so many posts advocating for wool because of the adjustability but I always wish people would include the rest of the story, which is exactly as you say – it needs to be adjusted regularly because it settles, there is a cost every time you do it, AND you are dependent on having someone available in your area who can come out and make the adjustment!! When I had a wool-flocked saddle, the saddle fitter moved out of the area and we were left with no one to do the adjustments. It was a problem, right up until the bigger problem became that the horse who wore the saddle had to be retired!!!
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A good foam saddle is a great saddle but it better fit… and so the person taking the measurements and ordering it better know what they are doing. Or you need to buy used so you can see what you have. Although I generally go with wool flocked I have nothing against foam-- but given the horror stories with ordering them new and the real DEVIATION in quality among reps (not just foam/French brands either, the County guy in GA while I was there didn’t know which part was the pommel and which was the cantle?!)-- I would try to find used if I was going the French/foam route. Unless you have 100% confidence in the rep and 100% confidence in the company to stand behind the saddle.
Equally true!! I had to place an order, but it definitely wasn’t because I wanted new/custom, it was because I had about a zero percent chance of finding what I needed used in a reasonable time frame! And I was lucky to have a fabulous rep (who of course no longer works as a rep), so mine turned out great.
I have 3 Butet- a 1985, 2004 and a 2012. They all fit every type of horse that I ride; WB, TB, QH…None were custom, I never saw the need. They are balanced, fit well without all that padding, wear well and so comfortable!
Now to sell the 17" 2004! So lightly ridden in as I can only ride 1/2 the year due to NY Winters and no indoor 
My biggest issue with used foam is that it’s a lot harder to know if there have been any customizations to the panels. For that reason, I prefer new…from a rep I trust. 
I mean, if I sold my Delgrange, no one would know there was a .5 mm addition to the panel to fill the wither hollow (this is the part that drives my WB batty) unless I chose to disclose…or they got the serial number and talked to Delgrange.
I did buy a used PJ Delgrange…knowing the mare didn’t have any real fitting challenges…and that the panels would be standard/non-customizable.
Even if I “knew” what was put on the saddle I would always, always go by whether it actually fit the horse I needed it for and not what the specs were purported to be. Which is the beauty of used-- you can pop it on the horse RIGHT THERE and see how it works. No need to hope that the rep took the right measurements, ordered the right thing, that the factory made it correctly, and that there wasn’t some natural variation that made it not work. Every pair of pants cut on the same machine in a size 8 are slightly different, the same can be true of saddle panels. With wool you can adjust the panels SOME (not the tree shape overall obviously). With foam-- it is what it is and you either shim it with a pad or accept it. So I would never rely entirely on thinking I needed an XYZ because the saddle was marked XYZ and I had tried a different XYZ and liked it. I would always try the exact one I wanted to buy-- which is the benefit of buying used that you don’t get with buying new and made-to-order. Most companies make you pay a substantial amount before it’s made-- so you can’t really try before you buy. I actually like a lot of French/foam saddles-- I just don’t hugely like the reps and the companies if I can buy it used, I don’t need to rely on their customer service. I either like it and buy it or I don’t and don’t.
Yes…but I will say from a purely static fit, my TBs saddle looks like it is perfect for my WB. She will even go in it, she just gets behind the leg and harder to get forward. I didn’t know her super well when we tried that saddle on her, and she already has a few sulky tendencies when in the ring, so I may have just attributed it to that because the saddle does actually look great on her.
When it it comes down to it, saddle buying sucks…even when you go custom. It takes a lot of effort to get what works for both you and your horse.
The only thing worse is horse shopping!
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Absolutely true. I am lucky enough to live in an area where finding a good fitter is not difficult. I have my saddles checked 2x/year. I will say that once your horse is mature and provided you keep them fit, I have found that my saddles do not need adjustment every time, and when they do, it’s generally in the $75 range, so nowhere near the cost of new foam panels.
For me, if the saddle fits me and the horse, I don’t care if it is wool or foam.
Most of my saddles have been wool though. Partially because I usually use a SMS qualified fitter and/or master saddler. I literally found a SMS fitter from 2+ hours away in another country and paid her to come out here to fit my one horse. It was worth it. I did buy a saddle from her and will gladly pay for her to come out 2x a year for further assessment. It’s worth it. Especially in comparison to all of the time and money I’ve spent on more local “fitters” and honestly, I’ve used 3 different SMS fitters over the years (various locations/countries/continents) and I was fully satisfied with all of them. So I’m rather partial now. There could be some that suck, but fortunately, I’ve had good experiences.
Some of the brand reps are just sales people with limited knowledge. Recipe for higher rate of failure, IMO.
Then there is the whole “the saddle looks to be a great fit but horse says otherwise” debacle :winkgrin:
I’ve bought 4 different custom saddles over the past 10 years (two truly custom, two partly so), and unless I have a horse that is totally wonky and absolutely needs a custom saddle, I won’t do it again. It was very easy to talk myself into: it will fit me and the horse perfectly, I need to spend the money to ensure that the issues aren’t saddle fit, etc.
Each saddle was tough to sell compared to a “stock” saddle because it was custom; not many reps are going to tell a client that they need exactly the configuration I happened to have on my saddle that I was trying to sell. I also had the unfortunate experience of having a horse change shape drastically in the 12 weeks it took to get the custom saddle in, and it never fit right. So I had a brand new saddle that didn’t fit, that was custom to a very wide shouldered, flat-backed horse… not a particularly easy sell. Also, breaking in a new saddle is a pain in the arse. Not as bad as tall boots by any stretch, but still a pain.
I would totally recommend getting full calf leather, though… hands down! Grain leather is fine, nothing wrong with it, but calf is divine, and will retain its resale value, imo. I’ve been extremely spoiled… I will never go back to grain leather. Calf leather is softer, breaks in much easier, and is stickier than grain leather (which is the biggest selling point to me!)
Couldn’t agree more. Calfskin is the way to go! Mine is so grippy that I really can’t wear those silicone breeches- I’m too stuck in place with the combo of grippy calfskin and the sticky silicone :lol:.
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Both my Delgranges (Bruno and PJ) broke in like a dream. I NEVER had the “OMG it’s a new saddle” break in period. I’m lucky, I guess.
Depends on what your goal is and how long you want it too last and how you use and take care of your tack. Mine are calf knee rolls and seat, grain skirt and flaps. Love them…One is verifiably 8 years old…the other is about that…both look amazing.
You don’t always have to make entirely new foam panels. It depends on how much change is needed, what type of change and where. I’ve had my CWD adjusted twice for my growing horse, and based on the changes we were making and that they were in 5mm increments, they have used the same panels. They also change the stamp to reflect the current setup. It did help that for the most part, we had to remove foam. If you need to add a lot, you need to have the panels remade because there’s less leather around them to work with.
Provided the company does update the stamp, you should know what you are getting. But even if not, a rep for the brand should be able to look at a used saddle and tell you where adjustments need to be made.
It’s generally more expensive to have foam redone either tweaks or entirely new panels. However, it doesn’t require the regular maintenance of wool.
