I was looking at the Kentucky results and all the top-placed NZ and AU riders, plus obviously Oliver Townend and Harry Meade, are based in the UK. The top 10 placings are 70% UK-based riders, and one could absolutely argue they had a major disadvantage this year - they basically haven’t shown all winter due to their lockdown, plus their horses had much more travel to contend with than the majority of the US riders.
Of the riders eliminated on XC, it’s all Americans plus US-based Clayton Fredericks, Daniela Mogul, and Nilson Moreira da Silva. The only non-USA based XC elimination was William Fox Pitt, which I’m just going to chalk up to a fluke/bad luck/rust.
If I was a young event rider from basically anywhere in the world, I’d be getting myself over to England or Europe and starting my business up there. I think a better ‘investment’ than sending younger US riders to the Olympics is sending them to the UK for a few years. (Or forever? I’m joking… but I’m not joking.)
To be fair, the competition is predominantly North American-based riders, so it is expected you would see more eliminated.
The Euros (and Euro-based) aren’t sending their average Joes. They are coming here to win, or get as close to it as possible.
When you watch Burghley or Badminton, it’s mostly Europeans being eliminated… because they make up the bulk of the competition. In those competitions we are seeing a more complete sampling of their riders’ abilities, unlike the elite few who take a crack at “easy” KY prize money.
I completely agree that spending time training and competing abroad would do more for our young riders that prematurely thrusting them onto a team. Once upon a time I didn’t understand why our young riders were rushing off to Europe when they hadn’t accomplished much here at home. But the more I watch these top European riders, I completely get it. I am in the same camp as you now believing the next step is to not just send them over there for a competition or two but to immerse them for longer periods of time.
I agree with everything you’ve said, but even when you look at the results from Badminton or Burghley, it’s true that most of those that didn’t complete are from from the UK/Europe … but when we send our top horses and riders over to compete in either one, without having the statistics in front of me it seems like a 50/50 shot whether any given pair will even complete.
Whereas when the top UK and Europe based riders come over here to our home event, they completely dominate us and the vast majority get around without jumping penalties. Meanwhile our top pairs tend to be hit or miss even on our home turf.
I’m not sure what the biggest factor is … smaller geographic area, different course design at national events, better coaching, better horses, all of the above … but I wish we could do something to recreate it on this side of the pond!
Maybe Boyd should go, but it is time to move on from Dutton. Nothing against him personally, or against his riding, but he’s taking a spot that needs to go to the future, not the past.
Liz, Doug and Tamie are the team. If ML is the alternate, I can live with that.
As for Kentucky results … although they are the most recent, one cannot make a team decision based on one jumping round or one penalty jump. It has to be over a body of work, consistency in the big moments, rising to the occasion again & again. No one event can be the decider.
I am 100% for a goal other than a medal. Clear & clean XC jumping rounds sounds good to me.
Rio:
Highest-ranked rider corps: Carnage. Missed the approaches on the complex direct routes, under-estimated the course, brought the wrong horse, etc. & so on.
Mid-ranked riders: Clear jumping rounds on the long routes, with baskets of time penalties. Complete respectability & honor to the country they represented.
The medalists at Rio are absolutely the elite of the elite.
Not for nothing, Sweden and France always send a super-team, in addition to the usual super-teams of UK, Germany, Australia, NZ. That’s a crowded super-team room.
If we can get one or two in the top 10, I’m thrilled for my country’s representation. If we don’t top-10, but complete everyone with good rides, same takeaway - I’m thrilled.
I love the idea that a U.S. rider overcomes all odds and medals. But there is nothing in our recent history that indicates this will happen. Z is not the horse Phillip needs to pull out another one.
All very true! But when we send our top riders to the UK and EU, we aren’t sending them with expectations that they’ll win, which is how the UK, NZ, AU, and Michael Jung come to Kentucky. We basically cross our fingers that the US will hold their own. I thought if there was ever a year for a US winner of Kentucky, this was it.
Just doing some research:
Last US winner of Kentucky was Phillip Dutton in 2008, previously Kim Severson in 2005. Since 2000, we have had five US winners: David O’Connor, Kim 3x, and Phillip. AUS/NZL have had 5 wins, GBR has had 8 (including 3x Oliver Townend and 2x WFP), and Germany has had 3 (all Michael Jung).
Last US winner of Badminton was David O’Connor in 1997, previously Bruce Davidson in 1995
Last US winner of Burghley was Stephen Bradley in 1993, previously Bruce Davidson in 1974
Adelaide has never had a US winner, though Boyd Martin won in 2003 riding for AU
Pau has never had a US winner
Luhmühlen has never had a US winner
So if we exclude Kentucky and Boyd at Adelaide, USA riders have won 4 overseas 5-star events ever, the most recent was 24 years ago, and 2 of those wins were Bruce Davidson.
In terms of Olympic selections, Boyd and Phillip are the only two US riders in the running who have won 5* events, though both on respective home turf. Phillip won an individual Bronze at Rio, plus he won team gold riding for AU in 2000 and 1996. It just makes no sense to leave the riders with the best results and most experience at high-pressure international events at home unless they seriously don’t have the horse for it. Z had a top 10 team placing at WEG 2018 and was top 10 at Rolex in 2021, 2019 and 2018…? Maybe there’s something about the horse I don’t know but that’s a decent record on paper.
The great mistake the U.S. makes every freaking Olympics is picking individuals to medal – when we are no-hopers for a medal. Every time, we do it. And throw away our rider development.
The U.S. Eventing Olympic situation makes me absolutely crazy when considered away from the month of the Olympics. I’d rather we didn’t go than do the dumb stuff we do every time.
But once a team is selected and on the way, I revert to raving fan-girl. Every time.
I think that kind of thing is what keeps us going to the Olympics, even though I’m not sure it is in the best interests of American eventing.
I think we’ve had a culture shift that has not helped our competitiveness. We tend to be a lot more conservative than we were in the 90s and prior. I don’t think that is a bad thing overall, but it hurts us in competition.
I think we have less horse power, which is ironic. It’s ironic because in theory, I think we have just as many quality horse prospects here as they have in Europe, but I think they have better infrastructure to place horses where they will be successful. A lot of our riders seem to have to kiss a lot of frogs… or pay extra to import something.
I do wonder about our coaching. I feel like a total jerk saying that, because our coaches are brilliant athletes. But I wonder if we are missing a puzzle piece that countries who are currently more successful have figured out.
Just a reminder that Phillip did win an individual medal at the most recent Olympics (bronze at Rio 2016) and was the highest placed US rider at the most recent WEG (13th at Tryon 2018), so his recent championship performances do not support putting him out to pasture quite yet!
PD has been around for so long and is somehow so unassuming that I think people… forget about him? Or assume he’s washed up? But off the top of my head, I think the only US riders to win an Olympic medal AND a major 5* (just gonna call that Rolex since the late 90s when they made it a 4*, or Burghley or Badminton ever) are Phillip, Kim Severson, David O’Connor and Bruce Davidson?
I’m probably forgetting someone, but my point is he’s up there with the all-time greats, he’s the only one of them still riding at the top of the sport, and he’s laying down strong performances year after year. The man is a living legend! Justice for Phillip Dutton!
ML reminds me a bit of a “worse” Laura Graves, who has been transparent that she never would have gone to the Olympics with a different horse. They, as a partnership, are Olympic caliber, but I don’t think LG believes herself to be.
TBS, I pray ML does not go to the Olympics. I just can’t forgive her for the bad riding I’ve seen from her-- and it’s not just the bad riding and apologizing/growing, it’s the trying to cover it up.
Sometimes the best trainers/athletes are not the best coaches. Teaching horses and teaching people are two very different things. It’d be interesting to get someone who is a coach first and a trainer/rider second, but it’s a gamble that no one is willing to try, probably for good reason.
I would actually swap this, given recent records. I think Phillip has a better chance of getting all the way around. If we had to send one of the two, I would pick PD.
My personal picks would be Phillip and Z, Tamie and Mai Baum, and Doug and Vandiver, with Liz Halliday-Sharp and Deniro Z as direct reserve.
Isn’t the goal of any Olympics always to medal? that’s how you get & keep funding so to me sending a team with the biggest chance to get a medal would have to include Boyd & Phillip they have proven that time and time again they can perform under pressure. Maybe using Pan Ams or WEG to give more inexperienced riders the trip to see how they handle the pressure but to me the Olympics is always about aiming for a medal
with this in mind my personal picks would be Boyd On Testerleg with On Cue direct reserve, Phillip with Z and Tammie With Mai Baum, with Doug or Liz reserve
Rio was on a different horse, a seasoned Olympic horse, so that half of the pair is not available.
13th at WEG with Z. Not even top 10. This is the best we have on tap?
I don’t know what the answer is. But for decades we have needed a different mindset about the Olympics, one that is not so medal-focused.
I think adding 5*'s in the U.S. will help enormously to increase the readiness and fill the pipeline of our Olympic rider base. How many UK riders go around Badminton and Burghley each year? THAT is what we need to have going on before we will scrape together a deep talent pool that is truly ready for the Olympics.
How much difference does a U.S. medal actually make to U.S. eventing funding? Do we even know, at this stage?
No, not every team goes with a medal as a goal. In Hong Kong, Brazil had a triumphant outing when they achieved their goal of 100% team completion. They were the only team that got everyone across the finish line. Because that was their goal - a realistic goal that brought the team great satisfaction. They are having so much fun celebrating in the background of the videos of the stressed, anxious European and American teams.
The horse he rode at Rio was Mighty Nice. Experienced for sure, Phillip had been competing him since early 2011, taking him from 2 star to 4 star (now 3 star to 5 star) & before that he’d done a CIC* and a CCI* (now 2 star short & long, respectively) with Joseph Murphy. But he’d never been to an Olympic Games prior to Rio in 2016, so I wouldn’t consider him already to be a seasoned Olympic horse when Phillip rode him there. (All info came from the FEI website’s horse search).
I’m not following this logic. What is the alternative to being “medal-focused” at the Olympics? Showing up for a good time? Trying not to complete a team? Miss Congeniality?
People may be frustrated that Phillip hasn’t medaled with consistency at the Olympics— but it’s not like any of the young riders we have invested in have been able to step up to the podium, either. Look at the teams from the 2010s. We have given some of the riders multiple opportunities, yet after years they still can’t outperform Phillip in international competition.
You can send a bunch of up-and-comers with no shot of coming close to a medal with the hopes of them gaining experience. But in four years, how will they be mounted? They probably won’t be competing the same horse at that level. Will they even be competing at advanced at all? Eventing has a considerable amount of turnover.
Sending anything but your current best horse and rider combinations makes no sense to me.
