Male Equestrians: Where do they come from?

@foggybok

Here’s another fun, recent example.

https://news.vin.com/default.aspx?pid=210&Id=10820221&f5=1

3 Likes

I’m surprised the company didn’t give her a raise.

A funny thing (well sad in a way given the conditions that led to it) happened in the last company I was in. They originally did not have an HR department, HR was run by the CFO. As we grew they decided to hire HR consultants. The consultants came in and must have given them a lot of grief because all the women got HUGE raises that cycle.

7 Likes

Certainly would have saved them a lot of grief!

2 Likes

Yes, you’re right - I forgot about teaching assistants because my grad school did not have undergrad degrees. Either way, grad students are not footing the bill. When I was in college, applying to grad schools, one of my professors said that if you’re paying anything out of your own pocket for a PhD program, you’re doing it wrong.

1 Like

I suspect this is not even close to what actually happened, but I don’t doubt that you think it is.

11 Likes

We removed some personal commentary and related responses.

7 Likes

“Gender-based pay discrepancies aren’t uncommon. What’s unusual in Schulman’s case, Baran said, is that she found out. He declined to disclose how.”

10 Likes

A bunch of states are implementing transparency in compensation. Hopefully it will help. When I was approving comp packages for hires on my team, women and non-white male candidates stated much lower salaries at previous jobs. I always ensured they got offers commensurate with the rest of my team. Even if it meant squabbling with the board.

17 Likes

Legit came here to same the exact.same.thing. as someone who works closely with execs and builds talent programs at companies.

If an exec team does not care about diversity from the beginning, then that company has about a snow ball’s chance in hell of becoming truly diverse. Those first 50 hires are so much more crucial than leaders realize because it sets the tone for the type of company you aim to build.

Beyond that, if you truly prioritize diversity, then you do that in your c suite and senior leader hires. You can work as hard as you want to build internship programs that target under represented groups and make a lot of diverse IC hires, but you will forever have a major blocker if there aren’t diverse folks (take your pick–gender, ethnicity, neuro, etc) in those top positions.

It’s still a mediocre white man’s business world. Things are changing but at a glacial pace. I think we’re at an “all-time high” with 16% of CFO roles in the US being occupied by women which is STILL a dismal stat. And it’s because there’s only that 16% chance of making it to a seat at the table that women are by far the worst at tearing down other women to get that spot.

I can’t help but think back to the “boy points” post a couple years ago and that cringe-worthy article bluntly stating the favoritism towards boys. So even in a sport dominated by young women, young men are still given an advantage. That said, I was delighted at how helpful all the young women were to each other at this year’s eq finals. Gives me some hope that with future generations we’ll have fewer tear-downs, more build-ups in future, both in the equestrian community and in corporate America.

17 Likes

I’ve been reading lately about affirmative action for males in college admissions. If universities actually admitted based on merit, 60% of their students would be women. The reason they lower the bar to admit more men is to achieve gender balance, because it makes their school more desirable.

There are lawsuits in the works, I think. I hope. Even if just to expose to the wider public how affirmative action really is in practice.

9 Likes

This is true. The majority of male riders/trainers I see wear that newer style of breeches with the back pockets and the straighter cut through the waist and seat. I’m probably not describing them very well. But they fit loose enough that these guys can stash their big ole iPhone in a Lifeproof case in their back pocket and jump around a course. Much looser than the pants NFL players wear.

@LCDR, yup. Although, I believe the whole “That’s homo!” thing is really just an outward expression of a larger, unspoken classist attitude if that makes any sense. You see it play out here on social media a lot. Fox hunters = rich folks engaging in an elite activity. Whereas regular gun hunters, farmers, and cowboys = working men just out there trying to take care of their families.

2 Likes

Mark Cuban just recently smacked down Elon Musk on Twitter. Musk had made some truly obnoxious statement about diversity, equity and inclusion, and Cuban took him to school with statistics about the better performance of companies that practice DEI. One interesting thing that he said was that with so many companies ignoring DEI job candidates, companies that do practice DEI are able to reap the benefit of all of the best and the brightest people out there. So, contrary to what Musk was saying, the available job candidates in those demographics are often much more qualified.

16 Likes

One thing I haven’t seen mentioned is the competition for backers/horse owners. At the top levels you really need to have other (rich) people paying for your horses and expenses. If you are good enough, you will find them, male or female. However if you are just good but may be great, there is competition for backing. Unfortunately, there is a significant number of backers who much prefer to back a male.

I also know a number of riders who can accept training from a male that they would question from a female with the same credentials.(Bonus points if the guy has an accent!)

When I was a kid (looong ago) nearly all the veterinarians were male and the vet school classes were predominately male. This was pointed out to me as evidence that women just “played with animals” but didnt stick with it to make the higher levels. :astonished:

14 Likes

It’s sadly out of print, but the autobiography No Job For a Lady is a fantastic book about the author’s struggles to become an equine vet during the mid-20th century.

Backing is such an important issue–the better horses a talented rider rides and wins on, the more they are apt to get access to, well, better winning horses. A male rider who can be “one of the boys” with rich owners and (sorry) charm and flirt with rich female owners, add in the perception men are stronger riders can create a cycle. And oh yeah, the accent and looks good in breeches factor.

There has been a pretty noxious example of female misogyny even in this thread :pleading_face:

20 Likes

That was a point that I was trying to make above, but I wasn’t being really clear. I’ve heard this from trainers, even female trainers whose husbands are trainers, over and over again. It’s even worse when the male trainer doesn’t bother to show, because there is no external validation.

3 Likes

And the fact that even finding men’s breeches at a reasonable price point is insane…
Wrangler’s, Cinch, Ariat cowboy jean can be found at the local feed store and on line easily.
Finding ANYTHING for sale domestically for my professional cowboy/breech wearing husband is almost impossible. If I find anything then its a frantic internet hunt to find the same brand and product and buy more. Not to mention the $60 vs $200 price difference.
Also jeans have serious belt loops and pockets for knives, leatherman, cc, etc. there are practical reasons too.

1 Like

Whenever I see the title of this thread I think “well, when mommies and daddies love each other…”

25 Likes

lol ! Same!!! Just add in and then they buy a pony …

8 Likes

[Edit]

It did happen to me and no amount of snark replies from you will change it.

Another thing, when the company would so the huge yearly sale meetings, everyone including the higher ups would smashed every night. I don’t drink so it was an eye opener.

[Edit] I did molecular instrumentation sales. The vipers wanted me to talk about my family life, but I don’t do that. I talked about my horse, my farm and Grand Prixs I would watch at the show park. You don’t discuss family life with co workers. I learned that the hard way at one job.

But keep snarking. You sound bitter.