Thanks for the report, Flashy Mover.
I think the though thing with this mare will be getting the rails of the tree to be Sausagey wide enough for her, while having the head of the tree narrow up. I wish I could post a picture for you all. In any case, adjusting the head of the tree may or may not be entire cure for her.
I have seen quite a lot of Eloquence X models, they seem to be a popular choice for the sausages that need a hoop tree. :lol: Maybe youāll get lucky and the Eloquence will be equally enjoyable for both of you?
If Albion might be up your alley, or at least worth a sit and see, I can say that I know quite a lot of dressage riders of various levels that have used Paula Helm and have been very satisfied with their custom orders through her. I think it does help that sheās also an upper level dressage rider herself. She makes regular trips down to our area.
Another possibility might be to connect with Kelsey Addiken of Addiken Saddle Fitting. She deals in Hastilow, Fairfax, Kent & Masters, etc. many of which have options for the bigger shouldered, round types.
Maybe this spring there will be some dealers at the shows with lots of saddles for you to sit in and narrow down your preference some!
Ooh, those are all good ideas. Someone else spoke highly of Paula Helm.
In the meantime, Iām being taught to ride better by the Custom Saddlery demo that their fitter left with me. Maybe by the Spring, Iāll know better what Iām doing and the bigger problem will be to fit the mare rather than my finicky tastes.
I grew up riding in the PdN era, so I can ride in lot of jumping saddles and not be influenced by their shape too much. Some day, I hope to be that good in a dressage saddle, too. But Iām not there yet.
You 'n me both, sista. 99% of my child and teen years were spent in my trainerās Pessoa - the original, pancake flat sort that didnāt even have knee rolls. Pad-to-fit the horse and you were good to go.
Iāve sat in many, many dressage saddles in the last dozen or so years and I still donāt have a firm grasp on what I do or donāt like. :lol: My āperfect saddleā is still a mystery, and I can count on one hand the dressage saddles that werenāt crotch-busters for me.
If you can work out what your preferences are, but canāt stomach the idea of paying the price of a compact car for a saddleā¦
Heritage Saddlery in the UK is, IMO, one of the best kept custom saddle secrets. His most expensive dressage saddle is less than $2k at the moment, with the current exchange rate. There were a number of threads on them a few years ago, lots of rave reviewsā¦ might be worth checking to see who still has theirs and how theyāve worn over the years. It looks like there is quite a variety of choices to configure for the rider as well as the horse. Plus I sort of adore the idea of a suede seat (at least in theory, Iāve never actually ridden in one except in western saddles).
Itās not a personality issue. I have a huge personality and Iām not the least bit intimidated by him.
Itās an honesty, truthfulness, and quality issue.
I specifically asked for specific things I was told I didnāt need, and years later I had to sell my saddle because exactly what I said I needed, I needed.
In 1 million years I wouldnāt touch anything he made or adjusted.
He lied after he was fired by custom by telling to tell us that he had been fired, and if he had put a single adjustment on my saddle after he was fired, he wouldāve ended up having to pay cash for my saddle as the warranty would have been voided. Thatās probably why he charged me around $85 to throw my saddle on my horse, say yup, looks good, and walk out the door.
AVOID. Itās not about personality. He has a huge personality, but thatās not the issue here. The issue is that he uses his size and personality to what he thinks is an advantage.
Total turn off.
Wow, lots of Oregon folks! Iām also in Oregon (outside of PDX) and my current trainer is sponsored by N2. I have a Custom and it makes sense that there is a relationship (ahem) between the companies because they seem to be very similar saddles. (To be clear, I havenāt actually sat in one yet.) Based on the website descriptions the Vincitore looks comparable to the Icon Flight/Coda (some curve to tree, overall outline of saddle looks pretty much the same), which is what I have.
We used to have a lot of Customs in the barn (with previous trainer and boarders) partly because I bought (a used) one and it is so freaking comfortable everyone who sat in it wanted one. It turned out that I apparently have the only copy of this model that feels that way, because many of the custom-ordered Customs were nothing like mine or the demos that their owners tried and then everyone fell out of love with them and ended up riding in something different, old Passiers and the like. Iām still riding in mine but thatās because itās comfy and my gelding is apparently impossible to fit so I havenāt moved on to anything else (yet).
I have gotten super tired of the fitting merry-go-round (despite the fact that I really love my current fitter - this totally is not her fault, my gelding is a VERY challenging shape - and her name is not Sarah) so I currently have a Bua on demo (see other thread). Yes, it is very different from my Custom but thus far I think it fits and is balanced better for me because unlike the Custom, it doesnāt sit pommel-high on my horse, and Iām not super picky about seat depth, size of blocks, etc. I just want something that doesnāt put me in a chair seat. This isnāt an option for someone looking for a traditional saddle, but Iām a scientist and I like technology. No, I am not sponsored by Bua or anyone else, I am just tired of getting my saddle reflocked constantly and still having it not really fit me or my horse.
This has nothing to do with it.
He is dishonest, lied to many people, and I would bet my last dollar that if you donāt like something, youāll never see your money back or have it made right unless you are harassed into it.
I took delivery of an N2 Primus in April 2017 (Iām not sure if it is still available as I canāt see it on the website anymore but it is similar to the Cardhu.) and I LOVE it. My fitter at the time came out and let us try a few saddles and my horse loved it. I steered clear of the Custom because I heard of so many issues with their saddles and customer service.
However, we have had some time getting the saddle fitted properly (we are in the SE) but have finally settled on a fitter we love.
My horse is an old style KWPN with a seriously sprung ribcage and very forward girth groove. I was previously riding in a Kieffer Wien and was concerned that the large blocks would make me feel claustrophobic, but they did not. I have a long thigh so went with a longer thigh block.
I would get another N2 in a heartbeat.
I used to have a Custom but had some bad problems with the fitter in my area. I now have an N2 fitted by Graham and I love it! Iāll definitely buy another one if itās the right fit for my next horse.
I had two Custom saddles and ordered a new one. After a 5 month wait for an off the rack saddle with a short flap, I gave up and switched. Custom went through a bit of chaos for a while and I think my saddle fell into that crack. I had a Dresch which Sue repped briefly and continued to fit until I recently switched to an N2. I have worked with both Graham and Sue for years and have found them to be honest and fair. I have had many saddles from different reps over the years and have found most of them are pretty easy to deal with if you are clear about what you want and if you arenāt happy again be clear about what you want. There are fitters I wouldnāt work with but N2 doesnāt fall into that category.
I have had nothing but great things to say about my N2 Saddles (I have 2). been riding in them for 3 years. The fitter is kind, patient, and understands our rider woes. They are NOTHING like the custom saddlery saddles and if you ask them, they can show you the difference. Whoever said they are the same has never ever compared them side by side. The trees are completely different and the leather quality is by far superior. I will never go back. I also think they are very generous and have been nothing but very honest with me in their dealings. They have taken my saddles and sold them for me and I would deal with them again and again. They have some very major riders in them such as Adrienne Lyle and Kelly Layne. The difference the saddles made in my horses way of going would have been unbelieveable had I not experienced it and my trainer was also amazed. I do think that sometimes people only bother to write the bad things and I can only say that after trying many many brands, the saddles and service were superior!
How funny to have such a strong N2 presence suddenly! and one with a first post! 
I had the worst experience with N2 saddle customer service. I pointed out in the first 10 days that the saddle was extremely croquet. The rep was great, came out right away and tried flocking it. It was custom made for my horse. The issue never got resolved. N2 did not want to take the saddle back, I had no trust in them being able to fix the saddle. It was so extremely unbalanced. My horse was blamed. I felt extremely patronized and treated very poorly as a customer. It is one of those cases that if you are lucky and your purchase goes well (a friend of mine got her Vantaggio a month before I got mine and that saddle fits great), then they are nice to you. If you are unhappy there is no service. I had to dispute the charges on my credit card and my lawyer is on stand by in case N2 want the money from me. They actually took teh saddle to get rebuild after fighting with them and going through 3 tries of shimming the saddle. The saddle looks very unbalanced, the panels are extremely different. N2 was convinced the saddle is in perfect condition. Nobody could answer what the quality control procedure is. They ghosted me with those questions. My friendās N2 fits my horse just fine, but that did not help me of course. Something was wrong with my saddle and N2 only tried to convince me that my horse was the issue. But how does my friendās saddle fit and mine doesnāt? It was so far off the left, the sweat marks showed clearly that the horse must suffer. It was two months of absolute nightmare. The N2 owner refused to take the saddle back, told me i can do a consignment deal, send another master fitter (the owner himself) who was patronizing through and through. Without my friend helping me through this and my lawyer i probably would have cut my losses and tried selling a croquet saddle. I really liked the saddle for me. It did a lot of ggood for my seat but I would not recommend the company every!
Having dealt with Mr Newell while he was still with Custom, I say ādittoāĀ to everything RHRT said. N2 is just NO SQUARED for me.
A barnmate of mine just got an N2, I believe it is a Cardhu. She loves it, and spent many months riding bareback while figuring out the saddle situation, so it wasnāt a decision she took lightly. I rode her horse for her a few times while she was out of town, and while there wasnāt enough room for my freakishly long femur, it was a pretty good saddle, but too restrictive for my taste, even if it was given a shorter block and more forward flap. She bought the saddle off his truck, so no comment on the workings of a custom order.
OP, since you mentioned Black Country saddles, you might look into Mike Corcoranās saddles. He was involved with the design of many of BCās most successful models, and now works out of Texas making both dressage and western saddles. I believe he travels, so you might be able to get an appointment with him. I trialed a MC dressage saddle a couple years ago and absolutely loved it (I own and have owned several BC saddles) and wanted to keep it just in case I found a future horse to fit it.
This personality clash is where I found myself with Graham. Heās very, very blunt. And not always in a positive or even necessary way. The fitting job was fine, no complaints. I will say I very much appreciated that he was honest when my saddle didnāt need adjusting, and didnāt charge me for that visit.
He is MUCH better to work with if youāre buying a saddle from him than simply adjusting fit, though.
Former N2 owner here, switched to Custom.
Didnāt have any issues with the owners, but the rep we dealt with was notoriously difficult to discuss. Within a year and some change of receiving the custom N2 saddle, it doesnāt fit AND it canāt be adjusted to fit my horse. Horse is also experiencing pain from the saddle because how it was fit AND trainer no longer wanted to deal with rep anymore. Ended up riding in trainerās custom Advantage until we found a WONDERFUL Custom rep who truly assessed my horseās needs as well as mine. All for the better as was told if trainer rode in my saddle, that my horse could have had some serious, nearly permanent injuries from it.
Settled on a custom Matrix saddle by Custom. I noticed the difference immediately and my horse was responsive and happy. I am convinced without a doubt that she wouldnāt have been able to do her job and move up the levels (now at 3rd/4th level) without the rep and the Custom saddle.
N2 has a trade in option, but if we went through them, we would have had to deal with the same rep and that was a no-go option for me. However, Sue was great and responsive when I contacted the company to learn about my options.
Additional thoughts: The N2 saddle was HEAVY. Crazy heavy and my horse has a long back that can get sore. The Matrix is light-as-a-feather. N2 was thick the Matrix feels like a soft, pliable and thin. Half halts started going through and my aids became practically telepathic.
Sold the N2 for half of what I paid for it, so take that for what you will.
Feel free to PM me if you have any other questions about N2 saddles.
I love my N2 Cardhu. With my big warmblood, it gave me just the right amount of support to sit his big trot with huge suspension. The leather quality is excellent and the seat is so soft itās like sitting in an armchair.
Having said that, Iām not using the saddle anymore because I now ride a short-backed Lusitano. Despite having the saddle refitted to him, it was too constraining to me and wedged me into position too much. It sounds counterintuitive, but my Lusitano actually has a bigger, more powerful canter stride than my Oldenburg, and I find I need a little more room to maneuver in the saddle. So Iāve gone back to a Custom saddle.
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