I would never pull a gooseneck without a dually – ever.
As long as you aren’t in Massachusetts. I posted in Off Topic about my saga with getting our new dually on the road.
The whole purpose of the “dually” is to accommodate additional load bearing capacity. It’s a numbers game in that respect combined by personal preferences like Fergs states. There are undoubtedly many folks who use a dually who don’t need to “by the numbers” and they are comfortable with the extra margin it brings to their rig. And there are likely some who don’t use a dually who should be “by the numbers”… Nature of the beast.
The beauty of the 450 is it is the same size as a 350/3500 dually, just a whole lot tougher.
[QUOTE=Jim_in_PA;7735525]
The whole purpose of the “dually” is to accommodate additional load bearing capacity. It’s a numbers game in that respect combined by personal preferences like Fergs states. There are undoubtedly many folks who use a dually who don’t need to “by the numbers” and they are comfortable with the extra margin it brings to their rig. And there are likely some who don’t use a dually who should be “by the numbers”… Nature of the beast.[/QUOTE]
Exactly.
A dually is for a really heavy hitch load, or for something like a wrecker or a guy who hauls bricks, cinder blocks, etc, as brick masons do.
If you are pulling a trailer that weights loaded 16,000 lbs, the hitch load at 10% should be 1,600 lbs. You can weigh the hitch to determine the exact weight.
That is well within the capabilities of an F350 SRW.
Duals do not do well on snow and Ice. But that aside, why buy $1,800 in every tire change when $1,200 will do the job.
The idea that you must have a dually is due to lack of knowledge. Axle loading and tire loading is nothing more than knowing what your hitch load is.
I have pulled a 4 H head to head Sundowner 40,000 miles since the spring of 2013. I have 70,000 on the truck, a 2012 F350.
The computer tells me how many miles the trailer was hooked to the truck.
Now by that same formula, how many miles did my 1999 F350 pull a 4 horse slant when I traded it at 357,000 miles?
And my 2008 after 127,000 miles?
All SRW.
And I could park all of them in those skinny little parking slots in the shopping centers.
The latest numbers sold that I can find is at http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2013/02/who-sold-the-most-hd-pickups-in-2012.html
Note the last chart which is the combination of F250’s and F350’s.
Dodge is nowhere near close.
To the OP:
Don’t consider anything other than a diesel.
NEVER get a short bed to pull a gooseneck. One day you will turn it too short making a U-turn and crunch the back of your cab, probably blowing out the window.
Get everything. Air conditioned seats; wonderful on these hot days even when just going from the barn to the pasture. They cool your back side quick.
Heated everything for the winter: Side mirrors, rear window, seats, all of it.
Get the nav system. Nice to be able to look at the radar, especially in the winter.
Get the crew cab. Even if no one rides with you, space for extra clothes in bad weather, inside in the dry for groceries, etc., well worth it.
Get the Ford tow package and their in the bed ball hitch. Heavier that the B&W by far. My trailer dealer was amazed at the first one he saw.
Get a 4X4. Wet grass in the early morning, a slight grade and the rear tires will slip. Besides, when you go to trade it, it will be worth much more.
By all means get the back up camera and the infrared back up sensors.
They are of no use when hitching up a gooseneck, but when parking or backing up to the loading dock at the feed store, they are worth their weight in gold. Just think how many tailgates and tail lights have been crunched at the feed store loading docks.
All of this is going to go for about $65,000 plus, but there are dealers that will knock $11,000 off the price in addition to any trade in.
[QUOTE=cssutton;7743951]
The idea that you must have a dually is due to lack of knowledge. [/QUOTE]
The reason I won’t pull a gooseneck horse trailer without a dually is in case of a rear-tire blowout. Without dual wheels you are likely to flip the rig if a back tire goes. Not a risk I’m willing to take!
ETA I have a Ford gas dually. It’s a 1991 with under 100k miles on it and it still runs and pulls like a dream!
10% is a good number for a bumper pull, gooseneck is closer to 25%. That puts you at 4k for a 16K trailer.
I can barely lift our large 2+1 with our FEL that easily lifts a 2K pallet of goods. That trailer is about 8K empty, so easily over 25% on the pin.
[QUOTE=airhorse;7744247]
10% is a good number for a bumper pull, gooseneck is closer to 25%. That puts you at 4k for a 16K trailer.
I can barely lift our large 2+1 with our FEL that easily lifts a 2K pallet of goods. That trailer is about 8K empty, so easily over 25% on the pin.[/QUOTE]
The location of the rear axle will have a lot to do with the hitch load.
My 4H head to head sundowner is rated at 15,210 gross weight. The sticker on the door says that hitch weight should be 8% to 15%.
That would of course depend on how you load it. Horses in front, in rear, one each, etc.
But at 15% gross, my hitch weight would be 2,282.
The truck sticker says payload max is 3,077.
As for blowouts, we don’t have duals on the front. The front tires are the killers.
Duals do give you one more ton of useful, but you don’t need it unless you are pulling one of those $200,000 trailers with everything but an indoor pool.
And certainly a F450 or 550 would be right for that.
[QUOTE=Fergs;7735122]
I would never pull a gooseneck without a dually – ever.[/QUOTE]Nor would I.
. I’ve been driving my GM Duramax/Allison for 13-1/2 years, and I’ll get the latest version when this one quits.
I have no dog in this hunt.
But will say that having a backup camera has made hooking up my trailer a joy!
[QUOTE=Zwarte;7747006]
I have no dog in this hunt.
But will say that having a backup camera has made hooking up my trailer a joy![/QUOTE]
I made my commnt thinking only about goosenecks.
For a bumper pull, you are correct.
But in those really tight shopping center parking lots, backing up to the loading dock, etc., that is where I get the most out of it.
[QUOTE=Zwarte;7747006]
I have no dog in this hunt.
But will say that having a backup camera has made hooking up my trailer a joy![/QUOTE]
Oh, I agree with that 110%! I’m getting exact ball placement almost every time…my backup camera literally looks down on the top of my hitch ball and as soon as it slips out of sight under the trailer’s hitch, I’m good to go.
I currently have a 3/4 ton Ram and although it has had numerous issues I love the way it tows. I have a 2+1 that I tow that’s about 12k when fully loaded and my truck doesn’t even blink. In fact, just a week ago, I went across the mountains here and got 3 tons of hay in my trailer (about 14,000 lb load with the trailer weight included) and my truck sailed up the pass at 65 with that load and I barely had to touch the brakes coming down thanks to my exhaust brake.
Also, just an FYI, it is my understanding that with the ram trucks, the only difference between the 3/4 and 1 ton rams is 1 leaf spring and about $6,000 if you’re buying new. For much less than $6000 you can have an awfully nice air bag suspension put in the truck and have yourself a ton and a half truck when they’re inflated and your 3/4 ton ride when they’re not.
All that being said, I would still go with the dually. Get the diesel Ram, the Cummins is by far the most powerful engine on the market. Apparently, you also get about 850 ft-lb of torque with the 2014s which will make towing that much easier. Get all the bells and whistles, including a sunroof (I LOVE my sunroof). Also, get the mega cab and the long bed. It will be a beast of a truck but as long as it’s just for towing I imagine you won’t regret it. I don’t have a long bed and I would say that is my single biggest mistake with my truck. I can’t turn the trailer as tight as I’d like and there have been many situations where it would have been beneficial.
[QUOTE=besttwtbever;7748112]
I currently have a 3/4 ton Ram and although it has had numerous issues I love the way it tows. I have a 2+1 that I tow that’s about 12k when fully loaded and my truck doesn’t even blink. In fact, just a week ago, I went across the mountains here and got 3 tons of hay in my trailer (about 14,000 lb load with the trailer weight included) and my truck sailed up the pass at 65 with that load and I barely had to touch the brakes coming down thanks to my exhaust brake.
Also, just an FYI, it is my understanding that with the ram trucks, the only difference between the 3/4 and 1 ton rams is 1 leaf spring and about $6,000 if you’re buying new. For much less than $6000 you can have an awfully nice air bag suspension put in the truck and have yourself a ton and a half truck when they’re inflated and your 3/4 ton ride when they’re not.
All that being said, I would still go with the dually. Get the diesel Ram, the Cummins is by far the most powerful engine on the market. Apparently, you also get about 850 ft-lb of torque with the 2014s which will make towing that much easier. Get all the bells and whistles, including a sunroof (I LOVE my sunroof). Also, get the mega cab and the long bed. It will be a beast of a truck but as long as it’s just for towing I imagine you won’t regret it. I don’t have a long bed and I would say that is my single biggest mistake with my truck. I can’t turn the trailer as tight as I’d like and there have been many situations where it would have been beneficial.[/QUOTE]
2015 Ford torque 860.
http://www.ford.com/trucks/superduty/specifications/
My trailer dealer has several Dodges for sale on his lot.
He buys a new F350 for himself and his son every year.
He says a Dodge can’t pull its shadow up a hill.
But all jokes aside, more Ford F350’s and F450’s are found on construction sites and in commercial operations than any other truck.
There has to be a reason when their price is so high.
As for issues, my 2012 has 70,000 miles plus on it and the computer says it has pulled the 4H head to head 40,000 plus.
Not one single trip to the dealer other than to do the maintenance called for in the book.
I don’t care who buys what. I am just telling my story.
And for those who think the Cummins engine is absolutely the only engine in the business, go to their web site and you will find that they have issues as well.
A correction. I forgot that there was premature wear in the drag link and steering arms… Ford replaced at no charge at 60,000 miles.
And Ford did not run to the government crying. They hocked the company to the point that they even hocked the Ford emblem. Now they are profitable.
The president even made the statement at that time that in reality, Ford was broke.
I give them credit and my admiration for sheer guts.
Would that there were more like them.
Ford girl through and through here!
