Neighbour's horses hard on shared fence

[Adviceforanalter]

@Janet

Who OWNS the strip of property on which the easment exists?
Presumably not A, since, if they owned it they would not need an easement
Presumably not B, since they would not need to get permission from the previos owners of your property.

Usually an easement creates permission to use the property for a SPECIFIC purpose. If the easement is for “access”, then it does not give permission to use it for pasture.

Ok I stand corrected and I used the term easement incorrectly. Apologies for the confusion. It’s not an easement, it’s simply a narrow strip that is part of property A that could be developed into an access point or driveway from their property to the road. They don’t currently use it and access their property from another location. Neighbour B and the previous owners of my property referred to it as an easement, so that’s why I was calling it such, but I see now that is not accurate.

I do appreciate having a perimeter fence, I like that it keeps my dogs contained so I don’t want to to remove the fence altogether. However I can’t afford to put up and maintain a horse suitable perimeter fence just for the extra peace of mind for my dogs. My dogs are well trained anyway and we have plenty of sections of our property that isn’t perimeter fenced and that’s fine for the dogs. Electric is an idea I considered, but there is a lot of overgrown bush on the other side of the fence that will become my problem to maintain and keep clear of the fence. I also want to keep good relations with the neighbour. They are nice folks and easy going and one has to accept all that entails.

We went and fixed the section the horse popped off the post, and I noticed the post next to it is so loose I can pull it out with my hand. I really feel this is unsafe for horses, I don’t want to know what would happen if the fence did get pushed over and a horse walked through the 4x4 wire. My brain goes to a hoof getting stuck in there and a big wreck. But again, they are not my horses so I can’t really take that on.

At some point in the future I expect I will have to think about replacing this fence, and the question will be what type of perimeter fencing to put up knowing there is horse pressure coming from the other side.

[Sdel]

With the updated information, I would take guidance on if your area is fence in or fence out, as it doesn’t sound like you have any real say over what happens in this area.

Fence in means it is an owner’s responsibility to keep their animals contained to their property. Fence out means it is your responsibility to keep unwanted animals off of your property. Fence out would make me prioritize the fence, as that would limit the ability to seek recourse incase something happened to my property or animals from someone else’s loose animals. If your area is fence in, you might be able to use that information to negotiate with the other parties too.

[endlessclimb]

You have electric 6’ away from the fence, and Neighbor B has already told you the fence is your problem. With about $20 of material, you could run a hot line on the top of that fence and solve the leaning issue. Run a cable underground to the fence, then run the cheapest wire and some insulators on top.

I’m still confused about who is where and what is what. Are you on a corner lot, or are these lots bordering the back and the side?

If someone has access to their property and it is not landlocked, they do not need a secondary access easement.

[clanter]

@Bluey

Also always have a perimeter fence on the property line, not offset for any reason,

maybe in your case but if the property owner maintains the area of their property outside of the fence line there can not be any claim for adverse passion. I backset the fence ten feet in order to provide an area that is maintained by me. The property line is defined with steel marker posts.

My son has a farm in Pennsylvania where is access is by easement. The property owner of the easement thinks they can shake him down for several hundred thousand dollars when he asked about just purchasing the easement to incorporate into his land.

Once they requested a six figure cost he did check with his legal adviser to review the easement agreement finding the easement was much wider than actually being used, so son spent some money raising and widening his driveway. Also his advisor said even though he had improved the driveway there was no property tax implication to him since he does not own that land.

[endlessclimb]

Why buy the easement? If there is no other access, the property owner would have a lot of trouble negating the easement, so let him pay the taxes on it if he thinks it’s worth so much.

[trubandloki]

@endlessclimb

Why buy the easement?

The obvious answer is, so it is yours and you have control over it.

[endlessclimb]

You have control over it anyways. They can’t do anything to the easement that would obstruct access to the property.

[FjordBCRF]

@endlessclimb

I’m still confused about who is where and what is what. Are you on a corner lot, or are these lots bordering the back and the side?

@Adviceforanalter …any chance you could scratch out a crude visual? I know that would help me

@Adviceforanalter

neighbour B was clear that since the fence is between our property and A, and A doesn’t use the easement, the fence is our problem, and definitely not theirs since it doesn’t touch any of their property even though they are the one who paid to put it up.

Whose property is the fence actually on? It reads to me here, that it is “between” properties. Someone has to own it. If B paid to put it up, and A doesn’t use it, it sounds like A actually owns it. tIf thats the case, B can pay to make any repairs if they want to continue to use it. Especially if this is no formal easement and terms in place.

[trubandloki]

@FjordBCRF

Whose property is the fence actually on?

Now I wonder, I read it (with the updates that it is not an easement but a flag lot) that the fence was actually on the property line between the OP’s land and the land owned by neighbor A.

[FjordBCRF]

Ahhhhhhhhh ok I can see that too.

[Sdel]

@endlessclimb

You have control over it anyways. They can’t do anything to the easement that would obstruct access to the property.

My family had a decades long feud over an easement that started when my grandfather blocked access to his BIL’s property. It wound up in a lawsuit.

While ultimately an easement owner might win, it can be a very big issue until it gets settled in a court; and even then, like most civil matters, there is very little that can be done in recourse for ongoing issues.

[endlessclimb]

Fair enough. But if the alternative is a ridiculous purchase price, I would not consider buying and instead just let the idiot pay the taxes on my driveway.

[trubandloki]

@endlessclimb

But if the alternative is a ridiculous purchase price, I would not consider buying and instead just let the idiot pay the taxes on my driveway

Of course.
But…you don’t know that until you ask about buying it.

[axl]

@Bluey

If enough time has passed with that situation, there may be a claim of adverse possession.

This is what I was thinking of! Thanks @Bluey

OP, you really want to check into this, because if I’m reading for comprehension, A owns the land and B is using it.

[Sdel]

Adverse possession in my state is more than just using the land. There is a whole set of conditions that must be met.

I don’t think it really matters much to the OP as it doesn’t sound like B is using their property to begin with. Also, if B is refusing to pay for the fence because it is “not on his property”, it doesn’t sound like he is interested in claiming that section as his via adverse possession anyway.

[Incantation]

I would talk tell B that the horses are damaging the fence. If that doesn’t get you anywhere, talk to A about the horses damaging the fence and see if he/she is willing to do anything.

[Adviceforanalter]

@FjordBCRF

any chance you could scratch out a crude visual? I know that would help me

Here you go

Green - property lines
Blue - my horse paddock fence
Orange - fence that B put up

But yes as someone else said, a flag lot is a more accurate term (I am learning lots here!)

[trubandloki]

Great little sketch.
That makes things very clear.

Have you done any research yet on the shared fencing (fencing on property lines) laws in your part of the world?
There might not be any, but looking into that might give you some insight into what you can do, or what you need to do.

[FjordBCRF]

This is helpful. I think you need to find out and be 100% certain whose property that fence is on, A’s, or yours. Someone owns that land whether they use/access it or not. There should be survey records, but you could always have that redone to be sure.

If it is on yours due to a verbal agreement with the previous owner, without something like a formal easement, I don’t think they don’t have a right to telling you anything, but I am not knowledgable on shared fencing laws. At the end of the day, I would think since THEY paid for it, THEY would also be responsible for maintaining/repairing it. If the previous owners of your property put it up on THEIR/YOUR property, that seems like it should be a different story.

[4horses]

My neighbor has 6 cows and doesn’t maintain the fence between our properties. Technically it’s his fence, on his property. I finally ran electric on top. He talked about replacing it (and did a bunch of fencing elsewhere in one weekend) but never did get to the fence in question.

Now last summer his tree dropped a limb on the fence and let the cows out and last week the tree broke off another half and missed taking the fence down by about 4 inches. The remaining portion of the tree will take out the fence (again) during the next bad storm.

I doubt he will address the issue until that tree comes down.