New competition for Suffolk Downs?

Barnfairy · August 19, 2020, 7:33am

farmgirl88, my history with this forum will show that I am not typically one to derail a thread, and that is not my aim here. However, when I come across derogatory and deceptive accusations, I am going to speak my mind. I have said my piece and have no intention of discussing the issue further here.

…as long as Brockton and Suffolk work closely (as it seems they are hoping to do)
That is a crucial point, regarding horse welfare concerns of fair racing, and if that is the case --Suffolk and Brockton cooperating-- then I feel a little better about the proposed comeback.

system · August 19, 2020, 7:33am

The Carney’s are good people, from what I’ve known of them.

My boyfriend and several friends worked for them for years at the dog track and the brockton grounds. The care the dogs recieved was amazing, they were treated better than most treat their own dogs. it’s sad its getting shut down.

the stables in brockton are really nice. it was sad driving by them the last few years and knowing they werent being put to good use. from what i remember, the horses were mostly older or inexperienced. but its a lower end track, so i guess that is to be expected.

and the fair is really a non issue. the fair takes place around 4th of july, and the article says they are planning for late fall. if they really are though they would definitely have to re-do the stadiums. i would NOT freeze my tush off there in november!

farmgirl88 · August 19, 2020, 7:34am

barnfairy-

understood and i understand where you were comming from----

i just didnt want to see a educational and interesting discussion go down the drain over other issues stemming from a private farm and a racetrack. I too kept my concerns to PM, and although i didnt get an answer, it was worth a shot.

Carry on-

Glimmerglass · August 19, 2020, 12:47pm

I thought it best to stick this interesting (albeit old news) off shoot under this thread since we discussed the Western Mass (Berkshires) fairs and respective small track circuit from long ago.

Who knew that Frank Sinatra not only bet the ponies, but owned a little piece of the track too

Blog - The Race Is Not To The Swift: June 4, 2009 “Old Blue Eyes Was Never Spotted at Berkshire Downs”

excerpt

In 1963, through a friend named Raymond Patriarca, the crime boss of Providence, R.I., Sinatra came to own an interest in Berkshire Downs, a small track on the fair circuit in western Massachusetts.

So in 1963 Sinatra invested $55,000 in Berkshire Downs and was named a director of the track. There is scant evidence that Sinatra actually visited the track and it was widely thought that Sinatra was a front for the real owners of the racetrack, Raymond Patriarca and Gaetano Lucchese.

In 1972 Patriarca would be grilled by the Feds as to the true ownership/control of the track vis-a-vis an unseen $215,000 investment; the track went under in 1965. He took the 5th Amendment on questions regarding the track and any association let alone having met Frank Sinatra.

Per this source (dubious perhaps): He and Dean Martin were named directors of the track. Well now ain’t that a kick in the head?

Lady_Counselor · August 19, 2020, 12:51pm

Hmm…this doesn’t sound very good for the Brockton Fair or Carney:
Local Businesswoman Maura Carney set up sham marriage to keep German citizen in the United States

Any news about Carney’s latest attempt at reincarnation of TB racing? I searched but couldn’t find anything.
This article refers to Maura Carney as the general manager of the Brockton Fair. Not good publicity for Carney if he’s still trying to get Thoroughbreds back in.

spooky01 · August 19, 2020, 12:54pm

As far as bringing racing back this year, I spoke with Carney’s trainer and asked if it was “dead in the water” and he said no. We didn’t have time to discuss it but hopefully I can get an update soon

Glimmerglass · August 19, 2020, 11:05pm

Unless one of the buyers with the impending auction is interested in racing I don’t foresee the “Western New England Fairgrounds” ever returning.

J.J. Manning auction 12/23/09: Great Barrington (MA) 56+ acre Fairgrounds Property

You can see the track there from google aerial

Per the bidders packet:

The property was reportedly marketed for $2,800,000 in 2006. At one point the asking price was $4 million. In 2001, the property was marketed for $3,000,000. The prior owner had plans to offer simulcast at the property.

Lady_Counselor · August 19, 2020, 11:13pm

IIRC, I believe the track sits in a flood plain. It would probably be developable in the front portion, the back, not so much.
I lay money it will get razed and developed.

Glimmerglass · August 19, 2020, 11:24pm

Actually another potential New England track could rise from the ashes in Rhode Island - bring on the tea partay in Newport, err more like Lincoln, RI:

Providence Journal 12-10-09 “Group proposes reviving horse racing at Twin River”

… a group made up of race horse owners and enthusiasts — and former Harrah’s casino boosters — is trying to kindle interest in the revival of thoroughbred horse racing at the Twin River slot parlor still known to old-time racing enthusiasts as Lincoln Downs.

The Lincoln track saw its last horse race on Aug. 9, 1976. If you were seated in the grandstand today, looking beyond the tote board, you’d still see remnants of the old horse track. But the stables that once housed 800-900 race horses were demolished, and Twin River’s owners say they would have to quadruple the size of the current track to accommodate horse-racing, rebuild the stables and feeding barns, and expand the grandstands.

Barnfairy · August 19, 2020, 11:25pm

Lincoln Downs.

Now there’s a blast from the past.

During my college days in Providence, I worked for the daughter of Lincoln Downs’ owner B.A. Dario.

Whoot. That was an eye-opening time.

haligator · August 19, 2020, 11:25pm

Suffolk Downs vs…

Barnfairy: <I know I’m not the only one who feels that helping Suffolk enforce the zero tolerance slaughter policy in the long run helps protect more horses. Covering things up is exactly what has been going on in this industry for too long, and that serves only to allow the practice to continue.>

Hi All,
I’ve been holding writing anything but now I must wade in. Suffolk Downs is the major track in New England (for TBs) and it provides many services to horsemen and horses that ‘fairgrounds’ tracks do not.

Suffolk has made a MAJOR effort to control horse slaughter and provide a safety net (bearing in mind that no matter how hard you try some bottom-dwelling pondscum will somehow get around those rules. Larceny lurks in too many people’s souls and no track is 100% safe in terms of horse slaughter.) Give Suffolk credit where credit is due in their efforts.

The fairgrounds tracks in MA (not all, but for the most part) have crummy footing, poor stabling, and no discernable plans in place to regulate where the horses go after the meet (much less if a jockey or other horsemen get hurt, etc.) They just don’t have time or money for this. I hope, if the fair meets do come back, there is a significant improvement overall, especially with the footing. Because many tracks are used for TBs and Standardbreds alike, and they only run for a short time each year, the track conditions can vary from extremely hard to ‘death cookies’ coming up every time the track is groomed.

I used to jog in the mornings on tracks to get my weight down, and let me tell you that I trotted out lame on many lower tier tracks. Heck, by the time I got to the funnel cakes and donuts my excerise was done! And, you really, truly haven’t lived until you take a rusty, hard, and luke warm (at best) water shower under the grandstand or in the public rest rooms without curtains while people come and go to use the facilities. These memories just warm the cockles of my heart.

Please forgive me if you have a super local fair track! I’m not putting all of them down…just a lot of them.

If Lincoln Downs comes back it will only help New England racing and Suffolk Downs in terms of making the region have a longer racing season (as long as their is no big overlap). Horsemen would benefit by not having to go to NY, PA, or NJ to get some extra racing in.

I don’t lament the demise of the fair meets here in New England. And, I’m just extremely grateful to Suffolk Downs for trying to do the right thing.

Hallie
Hallie I. McEvoy
Racing Dreams, LLC
Bolton Valley, Vermont

“Don’t take your organs to heaven - heaven knows we need them here”

MintHillFarm · August 19, 2020, 11:32pm

[QUOTE=Acertainsmile;3863176]
Great, as if those poor lower level horses need another venue where they will be pushed beyond capability… The NE Fairs are a scary place.[/QUOTE]

Agree - more horses that are pushed for a few more weeks and then need homes or are put on a van heading south…

Barnfairy · August 19, 2020, 11:45pm

Providence Journal 12-10-09 “Group proposes reviving horse racing at Twin River”

Planned for tonight (7 pm, Ardente’s Bar & Grill in Cranston RI) is the informational meeting regarding the proposed comeback of TB racing in RI.

Between financial insolvency issues and public sentiment, this thing has just about as good a chance as flying as a pig.

Bring up the topic of horse racing amongst an audience of general horsepersons in New England, and this is your typical response:

Thoroughbred racing in RI? General consensus: No way Jose’

Glimmerglass · August 19, 2020, 11:46pm

[QUOTE=Barnfairy;4561471]
Planned for tonight (7 pm, Ardente’s Bar & Grill in Cranston RI) is the informational meeting regarding the proposed comeback of TB racing in RI.

Between financial insolvency issues and public sentiment, this thing has just about as good a chance as flying as a pig.[/QUOTE]

Never say never as RI is from a state revenue perspective hooked on gambling.

The Day 12-17-09 “Twin River slots reorganization writes off $290M”

Twin River has continued to operate some 4,700 slot machines and to offer simulcast wagering on horse and greyhound racing. It posted year-over-year gains in slot revenue in September, October and November, “outperforming other regional gaming entities,” Doyle said.

In 2008, the facility generated $417 million in gaming revenue and forwarded about $250 million to the state, which taxes gaming revenue at a rate of about 61 percent. Gaming is Rhode Island’s third largest source of revenue behind the income and sales taxes.

Edging out property tax as a revenue source, when the rates are higher then the Nat’l ave and higher the neighboring Mass is saying something!

DickHertz · August 19, 2020, 11:46pm

[QUOTE=haligator;4549963]
Barnfairy: <I know I’m not the only one who feels that helping Suffolk enforce the zero tolerance slaughter policy in the long run helps protect more horses. Covering things up is exactly what has been going on in this industry for too long, and that serves only to allow the practice to continue.>