Adding to my previous post: the quality is superb. Saddle 1 of mine is 25 years old and perfectly functional. Saddle 2 is 4ish years old and I still consider it “new.”
I had the Toulouse Annice for my first jumping saddle. Really liked it. It was basically a copy of the Antares Signature. Well balanced and decent calfskin leather. The seat was a little harder than the Antares, otherwise a very decent entry-level saddle. I recently got a used Antares Spooner, which is their stock made, non-custom version of their Signature saddle. It’s still in good condition with many years of use left in it - esp. since I school in my dressage saddle most days of the week 
We are saddle shopping.
Hubby currently has an Amerigo dressage saddle and loves it so that is what we are trialing (used). With some flocking tweaks, their dressage model can be suitable for different builds (forget the model but the flaps are set back from the shoulders over the traditional model). Quality is nice. I sat in a new one and fell in love but no way in hell am I paying $7,000 for a new saddle.
I have a Black Country saddle that is 15 years old and a Schleese that is 18 years old and they fit a lot of wide horses nicely. Old but lots of life left in them considering their age.
I had a Lovatt & Rickett’s Eventer that fit me like a glove but sadly my horse outgrew it. The saddle was great quality for the price. Second hand L&R saddles can be found at really good prices because they are not popular or well known.
For jumping, I like Stubben’s with minimal knee rolls…though I have not jumped in a long, long time.
bruBoy, I feel you!! I don’t care how much I love any saddle, I’m not paying $7000 for it. Actually I would. I would pay that for a saddle that self adjusts perfectly to every horse I put it on. Those new smartsaddles, or whatever they are, I thoughts that what they did. They don’t. I was sad! That should really become a thing…
I also like blocks. All the blocks! The biggest blocks! Lol I’m not sure if I like riding in them as much as I like the way they look. Definitely big blocks on my dressage saddle. It’s what the one dressage saddle I owned had and I loved it. My jump saddle has smaller triangle ones. I like them too. But still want big big big ones!
I have never owned a custom saddle. I rode in a Collegiate Graduate for a few years that was an excellent saddle for the money. Sadly, it was too narrow for my arabian so I sold it and bought a new Thornhill Germania 2-phase with a wide tree. I rode in that from 2006 until 2016. It is still in good shape despite a decade of abuse so I don’t at all buy into “you get what you pay for”. I had to replace it this winter because despite my best attempts, it just doesn’t fit my much narrower TB. I bought an off the rack Stubben Roxane S during their last sale and it fits me and my horse well. It is still a little uncomfortable as it isn’t entirely broken in, but I have no doubt that it will be fantasting in a few more months. Both of my horses are very average for their respective breeds and I am an average size aside from longish femurs which the Roxane accommodates without issue. I have ridden in many custom and non-custom saddles over the last 30 years and haven’t found any of them to be life changing. They are all great as long as they fit me and the horse and are suitable for what we are doing.
I can’t quote, but will second the Passier Military and the Lovatt and Ricketts saddles. I have a Passier Military that I am very listlessly trying to sell because I want it to work for my horse so bad :lol:
I also have an ancient Lovatt and Ricketts that I will never in a trillion years let go. I don’t believe in saddles that magically fit every horse, but within the type of horses I tend to buy and ride, this one is a wonder. It’s super outdated looking, and despite being a “jump/AP” model is terrible for me with short stirrups (I am a giraffe), but with a longer leg it is sooo secure and lovely. What I love about L&R saddles is that they have what can be a hard to find combo of plenty of shoulder room and nice wide gullets. but still provide tons of space for big sharky withers.
I also really liked the older wintec and bates saddles for their adjustability. I tried every configuration of gullet and it just wasn’t comfortable for my horse. Chiropractor told me she thought the tree points were just too long no matter how wide I adjusted it, as he was sore in his shoulder.
I looked for a used, medium quality saddle (budget was around $1000) and found a very nice Barnsby Schockemohle. Both me and horse love it! I thought I had read somewhere that Barnsby wasn’t making saddles anymore but it looks like Smartpak is still carrying them:
https://www.smartpakequine.com/pt/barnsby-schockemohle-jumping-saddle--9922
Edited to add: Chiro saw my horse again after 2 years of using the Barnsby and she said hes very happy in his back and shoulder now.
I’m surprised. I don’t think anyone’s mentioned Albion yet. I have a dressage and jump saddle from Albion and I couldn’t be happier. They fit my horse really well and I love how comfortable they are. I didn’t spend a fortune either. My dressage saddle is a 2007 model that was custom made and because of that the woman had trouble selling it because no one wanted to take a chance on it and she kept lowering the price. I bought it for $1000 about a year ago. I had a M. Toulouse Premia and sold that to buy an Albion Kontact which is a 2011 model and looked like it had never been used. I mean there wasn’t a single mark or sign of wear on the saddle and I bought it for $1650 I think.
The Toulouse had a weird seat that put you in a chair seat and it was nearly impossible to actually use your leg effectively. A few people at my barn tried it out before I sold it online and they all said the same thing. I will say the Toulouse held its value. I sold it for basically the same as what I bought it for. The thing I hated about the Toulouse was that if you didn’t clean/condition on a weekly basis then it looked horrible. It needed a lot of maintenance but it did look nice when you took care of it.
I love my Stubben Portos Elite but if I could go back, I’d get a Olympic monoflap from the new Berney Bros Grand Prix line. I rode in one in Ireland a few months ago and it honestly blew my mind. It was unbelievably comfortable and well-balanced and the contact was so close it was almost like riding bareback.
I had a broken ankle (dumb, I know, but worth it!) and after a few hours of riding we went for a gallop up a hill. Halfway up my ankle started really hurting so I tried to pull up the big hunter I was on, but he was used to galloping up the whole hill and was probably sick of babysitting me so he just kept galloping. I was so tight in the tack that I remember thinking “I might never be able to stop him, but I’m also never going to fall off, so I’ll just wait this out,” as I circled a million times. The saddle didn’t remotely fit me, as I’m 5’1 and it was a man’s saddle, probably an 18", but I was GLUED on.
I stock them in my store and work with the Berneys via phone and email often, distance fittings are easy easy easy with them and they’ll whip up a custom size or option for you in a couple of days. Really just can’t say enough good things about them. I think I just talked myself into a new saddle?
I love love love my Stubben Edelweiss NT Deluxe. Favorite thing ever. I have the mega short tree points, and a spring tree and I have been able to pad/shim it to fit all but one horse I have ridden over the years. The seat is hard as a rock, but I literally love it with my entire heart. :yes: (purchased off the rack, but I was buying the exact same saddle and tree/seat size my trainer had that I had been riding in). It has been an extremely versatile saddle for me. I don’t know if they are discontinuing that model or not-- I haven’t seen it on the Stubben website lately. I know you mentioned something about having lots of knee/thigh block, and the Edelweiss does not. I have ridden in saddles with big knee/thigh blocks and I felt like they just hit me in the wrong places…like right on my knee cap, or just felt really odd. So make sure you ride your horse in a saddle that has lots of knee blocks/etc because while the blocks may feel OK if you are just in the store, they are likely to feel different on your horse, riding around.
I had a Thornhill Pro Zurich Trainer dressage saddle that I was also very pleased with. I got really lucky with this-- got it at Rolex, and brought it home and fit my weird shaped TB (built more QH-ish), perfectly! The local saddle fitter asked when I got a custom saddle 
I think that Stubben and Thornhill maybe fit similarly? Not sure-- but my TB that was hard to fit, and my trainers English TB who was also weird to fit, both loved the Stubben and my Thornhill.
I had an early 2000’s Bates Caprilli Close Contact – didn’t really fit any of the horses. But comfy on my butt! I recently rode in a friends early 2000’s Bates Caprilli close contact and coming from my Stubben, I was like oh my this is way too soft on my bum! I also had a Wintec Issabell early 2000s…it was nice having the fake sued when I Was learning to sit the trot. I don’t remember it well enough to really have more of an opinion on it than that. I sold it 10 years ago.
I have had great luck with Duett’s fitting wide bodied QH’s who need the U shaped tree. My mom had the Duett trail saddle, and while she wanted the Duett Foxhunter, the trail fit her horse better…so she got that one. But that was also a great saddle. And REALLY soft/cushy! My mom would get in my Stubben from her Duett and was shocked how different they were!
I second whoever recommended a demo saddle!
Thorowgoods are a good choice IMO. They offer several different options, and seem to be a good fit for riders who don’t fit Wintecs well. Just like every other brand, they won’t fit every horse and rider. The workmanship is good, as my ancient Supra style model is still going strong.
[QUOTE=Scribbler;9013571]
Get a high-quality lightly used second hand saddle, with wool flocking. Work with a saddle fitter who can make sure it fits your horse, and who can tweak the flocking.
The high end saddles aren’t really custom, in that they are built from scratch for your horse. Each brand has one tree, and then a certain amount of options that you can pick when you order the saddle. typically, more options for the rider than for the horse. If you aren’t hard to fit and can afford to wait a bit while you shop around, a good used saddle can be affordable, can fit the horse just as well as one ordered new, and is way better quality than the lower-priced saddles.[/QUOTE]
This is very very good advice.
I currently have a Thornhill Germania Spring and a Kieffer Lech Profi, both purchased used (the Kieffer was ~10 years old when I got it and the Thornhill was almost brand new). Well, I also have a ca. 2000 Wintec Isabell (and had Pros before that).
On the Thornhill: Very very very comfortable with a deep seat. I liked that when I got it, since I felt more secure on green horses in it. There’s plenty else to like about it too. Current horse is probably at the point where we need something else though, as am I. Biggest negative, and I assume it’s just the Spring because it has oil-pulled leather, is that in the nearly 3 years I’ve had it, it has not.stopped.leaking.dye. But generally, I have a positive impression of the brand and will definitely be looking at options with them when I get to saddle shopping again.
On the Kieffer: These seem like the Passiers and Stubbens, in that they are good hard-wearing saddles that sell really cheaply used. I love mine, but if I’m going to nitpick, the stirrup bars are a touch too far forward for me – maybe that’s to help the rider push their leg into the fat knee blocks? Unfortunately, horsie is outgrowing this one too…I’m interested to see if other models will fit me better. I would really like to try Kieffer jump saddles too, but they seem hard to find.
Albion and Sommer are other brands I like a lot.
I love my Kieffer jump saddles. Yes, they are hard to find but when you can find them in the US they are usually competitively priced. Look for the Dublin or the Kieffer Norbert Koof FL.
I have a question. Berney Bros. saddles from Ireland used to be very popular with eventers about twelve years ago when saddles cost about half of what they do now. They were well priced, but not considered cheap, and the company was supposed to be quite nice to deal with for tweaks if bought new. They didn’t have dealers in the US, so one dealt directly with the saddle maker for a new saddle, and even with shipping, they were well priced. Today a brand new Dublin Jumper is 950 euros without customs and shipping, which should still make it well under $2k.
Whatever happened to their popularity?
There are saddlers in the UK like Heritage that custom make all their new saddles. They also don’t have dealers in the US, and they are downright cheap compared to the British companies that sell through dealers in the US. Heritage is actually cheaper over all than Berney Bros.
With these options available, why do people buy Argentine saddles that cost as much or more or better saddles that cost two and three times as much?
Is the the hassle of dealing directly with a foreign company, even in these days of emails and smartphones, that has kept more US customers from buying these brands which can be every bit as cheap as the M. Toulouses and Pessoas and Circuits and Ovations?
With these options available, why do people buy Argentine saddles that cost as much or more or better saddles that cost two and three times as much?
-
no possibility to try one or see anything other than a photo of one and if you do manage to try one, the information isn’t really useful if you change even one thing about it when you order one.
-
Relying completely on photos and descriptions for fit for both horse and rider
-
resale value is zero. Cannot sell one even if you wanted to never mind get back anything close to what you paid.
I had saddles from Heritage. Matt was a+ to deal with and the saddles were gorgeous. They were also impossible to unload when I needed them gone so I could get a new saddle that fit my new horse.
It’s just not practical for most people to buy a custom saddle sight unseen that you can’t resell if it doesn’t work out.
I absolutely love my Bruno Delgrange, got it second hand, so not as pricey, but still way more than I have ever paid for a saddle! But it is by far the nicest, comfiest saddle I have ever sat in!
I looked into the heritage. They looked lovely and had great reviews from the few people on here who had them. I didn’t get farther than that because I rode in a county and loved it and then a friend of mine was selling hers for dirt cheap and it was basically custom to my horse and I. And then I forgot about them. Thanks for the reminder.
They are wool, right? Is their tree completely non adjustable? Can an independent fitter work on them here in the states?
I ride in a All-Purpose Bates (an older one) and I LOVE it, it’s so comfortable. But also MacRider saddles are FAAAAAANTASTIC I love them! I’ve ridden in several of their dressage and jump saddles because my trainer and his wife are sponsored by them.
My older Prestige/Hippos Red Fox close contact. I absolutely love this saddle. My horse does as well. The only reason I’m parting ways with it is because I’m switching from black tack to brown.
I also love Stubben’s. They’ve never let me down as off the rack saddles. I’ve always owned TB’s in a range of sizes from super narrow to XW.
