How cool is THAT!!!:winkgrin: So this “gruesome” thread has already proven benefical…SO glad to hear it.
As for the O2, I’m pretty sure a company like ARC (which is our neighborhood welding supply company) can do it. Welders need a steady supply of O2 to keep their flame hot (don’t we all;)).
Call and ask. This is where I get my liquid nitrogen tank recharged and (as I recall) I saw a huge O2 tank out on the dock as well.
[QUOTE=Tasker;5555055]
Ahhh, I was lucky the vet lived so close. She has moved 45 minutes away and we are still debating sending her our mare(s) for this year to foal out. The risk/reward/cost debate is still in full swing. :sigh:
ETA: regarding Oxygen - I have tried for the last 5 years to get a small tank here on the farm and run into all sorts of problems with the local companies dealing with a ‘personal use’ scenario. I do have an animal (calf) bag/rebreather (sp?). That’s as close to an actual tank as I can get unfortunately.[/QUOTE]
Talk to welding supply companies. O2 on hand could help with reducing damage in the case of dummy foals…changing a moderate case to a mild one that might recover completely. Dummy foals are your basic hypoxia at birth situation and have the resultant brain swelling…reduce that with time and give supplemental O2 to support undamaged tissue and recovery is possible.
My first ever foal is due any day now. I really need to stop reading this thread. I’m going to have (more) nightmares.
[QUOTE=coloredcowhorse;5555569]
Talk to welding supply companies. O2 on hand could help with reducing damage in the case of dummy foals…changing a moderate case to a mild one that might recover completely. Dummy foals are your basic hypoxia at birth situation and have the resultant brain swelling…reduce that with time and give supplemental O2 to support undamaged tissue and recovery is possible.[/QUOTE]
Oh I know! The problem is even the home health companies have refused… :sigh:
In the 2006 dystocia, the vet’s senior partner had given her his tank (by chance that very day) as she was the only associate with foals still to come. And that is probably a large part of what saved that filly from being a dummy foal.
Or it may save your future foal’s life.
That’s another way to look at it.
Thanks COTHers, reading this thread last night led to a happy, easy, delivery of a healthy colt. Love being refreshed in dystocias and then NOT have to use it, lets hope it’s just as good for the other two this year.
[QUOTE=Kyzteke;5555911]
Or it may save your future foal’s life.
That’s another way to look at it.[/QUOTE]
For me just knowing that others have gone through the exact same terrible ordeals is a huge comfort. I think it’s what keeps me going during the bad spots, knowing that others that are more experienced than I am still lose mares and babies and sometimes there is absolutely NOTHING that you could do to save them no matter what.
Just spent the better part of the afternoon reading this thread and I haven’t stopped thanking God that I have yet to have a seriously difficult foaling. A few years ago we had a redbag delivery, but it definitely wasn’t the worst thing that could have happened.
My heartfelt prayers to those who are still foaling out mares
[QUOTE=maybedog;5555210]
Question about oxygen. I am a nurse and was able to “borrow” a tank & valve but now am unsure how to get it refilled. Vet was at a loss also. Can welders really fill them? We did have to use it this year for the first time.[/QUOTE]
Yes, welders can fill the tanks. But, it is not considered “medical grade” oxygen, so you can’t fill it and return it to the hospital. well…I suppose you “could”…but you get my point. Some states will require that you have a prescription to fill the tank. You can check with a medical supply company that distributes oxygen to patients. Good luck!
I have no intention of returning the tank. The medical supply companies in my area won’t fill it. Is the O2 from welders safe enough to use on a foal? We actually dodged the bullet on one this year. Maiden mare went down against wall and tore the sack. Filly presented upside down, very hard to get mare up & stay up. Got foal turned but pretty much planned on delivering a dead foal. She wasn’t breathing. mouth open tongue purple, eyes fixed with no blink reflex, completely flacid but her little heart was beating! Hyperoxygenated with foal ambubag until she started breathing on her own. Surely thought we had a dummy but were waiting for owners to arrive and make the call. Had no suck reflex at first but I kept putting my finger in her mouth pressing down on tongue until she started rolling her tongue around my finger. She drank 2 bottles of colostrum. Got her up and nursing and she been fine! I truly believe without that O2 we would have had a different outcome.
Where can I get an oxygen bottle and oxygen? http://www.firstaidstore.com/product_results.aspx?category_guid=9c5bc2cf-7fec-4e2c-b91d-713d8798412c
How about the straps?
I’m not going to tempt Murphy. The only things I’ll need are the things I won’t have. lol
Is there a video on how to use the oxygen tank? My foaling kit list is getting bigger by the day…maybe we need to resurrect the thread that listed items in everyones kit… I never thought of a gallon of lube.
[QUOTE=wehrlegirl;5556368]
Is there a video on how to use the oxygen tank? My foaling kit list is getting bigger by the day…maybe we need to resurrect the thread that listed items in everyones kit… I never thought of a gallon of lube.[/QUOTE]
Where do you get a gallon of lube? No way am I walking out of Walgreens with a cart full of little bottles.
[QUOTE=back in the saddle;5556377]
Where do you get a gallon of lube? No way am I walking out of Walgreens with a cart full of little bottles.[/QUOTE]
That was a FUNNY image… can you imagine?! Im taking it everyone is referring to something found on a vet supply site. No flavors or heat involved.
Hyperoxygenated with foal ambubag
Can I ask what a foal ambubag is? Is it some sort of O2 breathing apparatus?
This thread has been SO informative. We have (thank God) never had to deal with a difficult delivery but I know it is probably only a matter of time. I have read so many books trying to prepare myself for every sort of bad situation but have always wondered “can I really DO that?”. Great to hear from people who have dealt with this kind of thing before.
[QUOTE=back in the saddle;5556279]
How about the straps?
I’m not going to tempt Murphy. The only things I’ll need are the things I won’t have. lol[/QUOTE]
Straps you can purchase from Exodus Breeders.
Where do you get a gallon of lube? No way am I walking out of Walgreens with a cart full of little bottles.
No…no…To do it RIGHT you have to get a bunch of the tubes of KY and then load up on enemas to :D!!! Oh…and Kaopectate too <evil grin>. But the BEST thing to do is have some non-horsey man do it and then walk behind him groaning the whole way!!! Way too much fun!!
Banamine won’t stop contractions sufficiently to do much good in a dystocia. It’s a prostaglandin inhibitor, so it may slow things down a bit, but definitely not enough to be of much help.
The oxygen at a welding supply store is sufficient. Was a jeweler in a former life and I stole the tank from the shop when I needed it. I can assure you that it was good enough. Did the job 
An Ambu Bag is a hand held mask that goes over the nostrils and mouth and helps to “force” air into the lungs through the use of a bag that one squeezes. Google Foal Resuscitator…there are a few available on the market.
[QUOTE=Equine Reproduction;5556433]
An Ambu Bag is a hand held mask that goes over the nostrils and mouth and helps to “force” air into the lungs through the use of a bag that one squeezes. Google Foal Resuscitator…there are a few available on the market.[/QUOTE]
Is this instead of an oxygen tank? I keep imagining pulling a big tank into the stall… but is this the same thing, different or instead of? What am I looking for (this may be a really stupid question, but the thread has got me a little freaked) as far as a DOA foal and a foal that I should be trying to resuscitate? From reading others posts… a foal delivered not breathing should still have cpr/oxygen preformed? What is a cut off line… if we are talking dystocia? The foal is still supplied in the canal so are we talking up to 5 minutes when we think we have lost the foal ?( There has been new studies re people where the time frame has been expanded).
Re: Oxygen: eBay to the rescue!!
http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_trksid=p5197.m570.l1311&_nkw=medical+oxygen+tank&_sacat=See-All-Categories
Just search under “medical oxygen tanks” and there are plenty of them. Also the regulators, which is what you need to control the flow of the 02. You could get both for under $75, it looks like.
You will also need tubing (with people the most common is called a “nasal cannula” but I’m thinking that might be alittle too small for a foal.)
The “Foal Resusitator” (which has an optional 02 hook-up + an ambu-bag) is one option – it’s about $190 as I recall.
Other option is plain old clear plastic tubing-- maybe 1/4-1/2" in diameter? and some sort of adapter to hook it up to the tank. At work we call those “Christmas Trees” 'cause that’s what they look like. Little green doo-dahs that connect the regulator to the tubing.
Being a (currently not working) Long Term Care RN, I tend to “acquire” this stuff from work (not the tank or regulator – those are big items), but if you aren’t a nurse or know one, I’m betting the local medical supply place will sell you all the stuff BUT the tank & regulator.
Just tell 'em Granny whacked her’s with her cane and you need a new one or something ;).
They MIGHT even carry Ambu-bags, which are basically a hand-worked “pump” with a face mask that you use to do CPR on someone. They can be hooked up to 02 or you can just pump them by hand…saves the rescuer from breathing.
With people, you can only use them once, but again, if you know someone who works in a hospital they might be able to snag you a used one…
BTW – ER, another question: I notice the regulators on eBay are from 1-15 LPM (Liters Per Minute). People generally are on only 2-6 LPM unless in a hospital setting because of the danger of C02 effect – but those are people with COPD & such. I assume there would be no such danger with a foal?
How many Liters would you run on a foal? I assume you just stick the tube up one nostril and close the other one, then let 'er rip?
The home tanks aren’t that big – maybe 2 ft tall and 14-16" in diameter. BUT that brings up another good point – they are somewhat fragile, so you want LOTS of tubing, so you can put the tank in a safe corner or have someone stand-by and hold it.
And you can get even smaller ones that attach to the back of a wheelchair. They don’t last as long, but I assume they would do the trick in this case.
As for CPR/AmbuBag vs 02: in the first 2 you are just using room air to go into the foal’s lungs. Room Air is NOT pure oxygen, so basically with those two methods you are just inflating the lungs and delivering a small amt. of 02.
If you use a tank, that is pure 02. I would think optimum delivery would be an AmbuBag/Foal Resusitator hooked up to an 02 tank.
ETA: I just did a search on Amazon and they offer this: http://www.amazon.com/Manual-Resuscitator-Adult-Latex-Free/dp/B000WLG43Y/ref=pd_sbs_hpc_1
which comes with 6’ of 02 tubing…so if you have this + an 02 tank + regulator you’ve basically got a “Foal Resusitator” for about $100…which beats the official one that is priced at $200 WITHOUT the 02 tanks…hmmm…
Can’t answer your other questions for sure…but I’m thinking if the foal is born with no heartbeat, I wouldn’t even bother with CPR. If it’s not breathing, but has a heartbeat, I would try CPR or rescue breathing… you don’t get a response in 5 minutes or so it time to call the Code…
Which brings us to another handy item if the vet is not there – a stethscope!
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