Thank you! And I did read your above response about the ECVM, I just forgot to respond.
I have wondered if this could be the case with him - I did take neck rads but my (limited) understanding is that basic neck rads don’t always show this abnormality.
Was your guy ever sore in the hind end? It seems like my guy’s entire hind end is sore. I have though it must be coming from the back end somewhere since it’s so bad but I suppose it could be a result of compensating for the neck.
Is this the same horse that broke its shoulder? Or a different one. You really do have the worst luck.
Different one! The one I bought while that one was on stall rest!
Shoulder horse is happily doing 2nd level and jumping small courses and going hacking again.
Yes, and we injected SI twice and stifles once. He also developed PSD on LH after his RF was struggling too much. He was always more sore behind in presentation than the neck. Until he started showing neuro deficits on RF, and we flexed his neck and compressed C6, and he trotted off head bobbing lame. This was 2 years into the saga. I had done Lameness Locator and all the things since I had the vets out all the time anyway to monitor broken shoulder horse’s rehab.
The last time they xrayed his neck, we did the whole right front since he was lame on it. Vet thought he blocked to high block, but I disagreed. They said, well, since you keep saying neck, we will image it one more time. Told me it was normal, maybe some enlargement of the facets compared to before. Radiologist caught the ECVM. Second opinion vet (different sports med specialist) also saw it and was the first thing she wanted to talk about even though he was clearly off on at least 2 legs by this point. Neuro consult also agreed with that opinion on the images.
Anyway, the one rein stuff, anxiety, foot things, and trouble with the canter are all very common for symptomatic ECVM.
Adding that his neuro deficits and soreness being more in the hind end also led us to do extensive imaging of the pelvic region and lumbar. He’s got nothing there that we can find that would explain those symptoms. So the assumption is it’s all from the neck (and moving in a braced way because of the neck issues and abnormal biomechanics).
These are fantastic books. Our local referral vet hospital recommends them.
Last night I got a teeny, teeny, tiny bit of stretch in his back legs. Maybe by his next farrier appointment I can get him at least a little bit looser with all of these exercises.
Can’t get him to step up on the bank we have-it’s built into a hill on a circle so the lowest part is much too easy for him to just step around instead of up. I did get him to graze uphill a little bit though with hopes that would help. He’s still off on his rf though, so I just don’t know.
Contemplating the ECVM…I might bring it up to my vet but I’m not sure I even want to go through a bunch more diagnostics anymore.
There is an ECVM support group on Facebook that has resources for how to take the right X-rays. It would just be a few oblique views. The best imaging is CT and CT myelogram, but that is a lot of money and in most cases require general anesthesia (which is why I haven’t gone there yet). If your horse isn’t large, you may be able to see to C7 with a standing CT, but you won’t get T1-2 most likely. In any case, you will want a radiologist to view the images.
Out of curiosity, what happened with the EPM test?
I didn’t end up testing him. At the time we were taking rads, doing injections, testing for Lyme and his hair follicles all at once so I had to cut one out. When I asked my vet they said since he doesn’t have any neurological symptoms they wouldn’t bother testing for EPM.
That thought still crosses my mind from time to time…but I’m feeling too defeated with him lately to pursue that.
To be fair, EPM is one of those things you can kinda rule in but can’t rule OUT unless you do the spinal tap test. Or that’s what my vet said. If you’re not prepared to treat EPM based on a questionable titer, it’s not worth testing at this time. Though I would keep it in the back of your mind for sure - the test wasn’t expensive for me but the treatment can be.
Also, hugs. Been where you are and it sucks and I’m sorry.
Having just gone through it, running the titer was $300ish. Treatment can range from a few hundred dollars/month (compounded meds) upwards of $1400/month (Marquis). My vet said in most cases going though the spinal tap isn’t worth it. If they have a questionable titer, its cheaper and safer to just treat.
A 1:4000 titer is considered high. We were a 1:2000 which we are currently treating. The titer is indicative of the Protozoa; EPM meds halt the protozoa from reproducing and its then up to the immune system to flush everything out. Many people need to do multiple treatment rounds with different meds depending on the specific Protozoa. Many horses treated for EPM can and will have future relapses. The only maintenance I’m aware of once in a state of remission is Vitamin E supplementation which isn’t too costly.
@Ottbaxel, if you have the energy and cash, I’d pull a titer to see. A lot of horses with EPM often present as Not Quite Right before neuro symptoms become full blown.
You’ve been chasing a lot of possibilities down, and I’m so sorry the mystery continues. You mentioned potentially pulling shoes and sending south for a year or two and also mentioned you’re in New England. I remember seeing on a local MA facebook ‘horse people’ type group mention of a woman on the North Shore who does a track-system and does hoof rehab boarding. May be worth exploring as a nearer by option with hoof-focus help while you also give your horse some 'Dr Green" time?
To be clear – I konw NOTHING about this woman other than seeing a post on facebook so definitely do your own diligence. But As I thought about your problem of NPA / hoof challenges, tight body that stiffens but can’t be exercised under-saddle / lunge, and desire for Dr Green time…this seemed like a potentially good fit if it’s all it is marketed to be: https://thehumblehoof.com/hoof-rehab-boarding-info-sign-up/
I just went to the website and I am SHOCKED I have never heard of this farm…it is very close to me. I’ll look into this further-the board is expensive, but if that is including shoeing cost as well then the difference is pretty minimal between what I pay now anyways. This may be a route I’d be willing to try. Thank you so much!!
Alicia is fabulous!! I imagine she has a waiting list but I would 100% trust her with my horses.
The amenities she has are all things I’ve considered for this horse which is promising-Bemer, sure foot pads etc.
I just reached out-I hope there isn’t a wait list lol
She doesn’t have openings until Spring-unfortunately I do want to try my hardest to get this horse sorted out before winter though.
Looking into Ecvm a little further, looks like it really seems to pop up around 9 ish. Horse was 10 when I bought him and his symptoms began showing up. A lot of people have said their horses’ conditions have deteriorated somewhat quickly as well, which is what seems to be happening with this guy…interesting.
Alright I’m taking a poll. Exploring my options for the next shoe cycle with this horse since I haven’t seen any improvement. I can either:
A.) have him trimmed exactly the same way with same setup to just keep slowly fixing the angle (maybe I am way too impatient!)
B.) have him done with a frog pad wedge shoe and see if that helps instead (although my vet doesn’t want a wedge, at this point I’m willing to try it)
C.) pull the hinds for the time being and just keep trimming him for a better angle and see if less intervention helps him more (and then I have to worry less about him kicking the farrier lol).
I am still inquiring about the ECVM possibility with my vet to see what they think-but I do need some sort of game plan for the next shoeing in a couple weeks.
I think you are being too impatient. You’ve done a lot of things to change his biomechanics recently. It takes time to work through that.
I’m too lazy to scroll back. What shoe package is he in now and what degree negative was he?
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