Agree with most of what’s been mentioned here…
Horses are so spoiled these days. Our turn back horses would have to stand tied to the arena wall for HOURS and we tied them to the wall with the REINS!!! :eek:
Years back we would go to cuttings in the hinterlands with NO stabling. The horses would have to stand tied to the trailer overnight (too hot to leave them inside). Horrors!
Some suggestions here. You need a SHARP knife to cut rope if horse should tangle or go down on the pole. Hang it nearby the Pole to have handy at ALL time. Some time someone will tie wrongly, horse is REALLY stupid, and that rope will need cutting RIGHT NOW! We have nice folding knives with bright shoelaces thru the hanging hole. Folding is safer around the horses. Kept folded unless you are cutting, then closed again RIGHT NOW. Color makes them easy to spot if dropped anywhere or hung up. A knife that won’t cut is useless, sharpen it well.
We have a solid wall for tying, no place for a pole here. Does an equally nice job.
Next suggestion would be to use a BIKE innertube. If horse can’t stretch it, then there is no give to rope when pulled hard. I have not had any equines, even very big ones of 1400-1500 pounds break a new bike innertube. Car tubes just have no give unless you pull with the tractor! If left out in all weather and sunshine, that bike tube may need replacing on a regular basis anyway. Rubber material is not made for sunshine rays, they make the rubber deterorate. I also would put the rubber tube on the pole, not the horse.
I have had no binding up when using the Highwayman’s Hitch for the quick release tie. This is with some BIG horses reefing on it, tightening up the rope hard. It is a sailor’s knot, very dependable, because things change fast when sailing and rope has to be changed fast. No time to be picking a knot apart!! This site shows how to do it.
http://www.thepirateking.com/knots/knot_hitch_highwaymans.htm
You still can get the knot undone pretty easily no matter how hard the equine is pulling. Practice tying your knots until you have them down well!!Cotton rope has bound up in other quick release knots (done correctly!) for me, had to cut the rope or use big Channelock pliers to work the knot out.
I also want a longer rope to tie with. You can run the loops down farther, weight of rope helps keep the end down and tied better. Yeah the middle wears out, so you cut it in half, make two lead-only ropes out of it. I want a cotton rope so I will have less chance of burning horse or me, if pulling on that rope. Nylon covered, braided nylon, both will burn you in a heartbeat. Nylon heats up faster with friction than cotton, so doesn’t take much nylon sliding along to burn you or horse. Cotton softness can vary with how tight the rope is twisted. My new ropes are kind of hard, but still don’t burn when pulled thru your hand. Other cotton ropes are much softer rolled, nice feel to them. I buy the cotton rope at the tack store by the foot, make my own ropes because they are sized and have the quick-release snaps I like best. Don’t get thin cotton rope, it won’t take the strain of pull. Inch thick at least.
Take some time to WORK with the equine BEFORE tying him up anyplace. Teach him how to GIVE TO PRESSURE, move FORWARD for the release. REWARD him with praise and petting. NOT food. He has to learn the pressure release is the reward for moving forward. THEN he can do it himself when tied alone!!
Our young horses have a number of sessions of Give To Pressure, before they ever tie hard. They KNOW how to get rid of the pull. Have to say we put a LOT of schooling into teaching the young ones to tie well. They will be living in tie/straight stalls for much of their life if we keep them, traveling in straight stalls of trailers. My horses, young and old, MUST tie well at all times, anywhere I put them.
I would NOT take any horse out and just tie him up without a review of Give To Pressure sessions, so he KNOWS how to fix things himself. He still may get angry alone there, but they often don’t even tighten the rope while cavorting about on the tie location.
Start with short session, 15 minutes for yearling, unhandled horses. Build up time slowly. Check them often, offer drinks every hour or so when they are out for long sessions. Trail horses often picket tied on the line for overnight camping, so they need to practice that long too.
Ground tie can be helpful, but not something we train for much. I want a FIRM grasp on my horse when we leave the farm. Tied or held if not stalled at a show or competition, campout. I am not going to leave them parked in the trailer on a hot day. Better to tie them to the side, have hay bags and water right in front of them, let them move a bit as they look around. I am glad for the person who says her animals stand, then qualified it with many exceptions. However in my experience, those horses “trained to ground tie” invariably cause a problem on the day they don’t WANT to stand alone. I am not offering my horses that option. Horses HELD, TIED or STALLED, don’t get injured running loose. Seen a number of injuries on those ground tie horses who didn’t, and the ones tied with break-away loops and halters. Hard to catch an excited, naked horse before he gets hurt!
A GOOD, TRAINED horse never pulls his rope hard when tied, doesn’t try to jerk loose or rear, no matter what the provocation around the trailer. He has learned his tie lessons at home. I have worked on teaching him acceptance of strollers, noisy red wagons, MINI horses, PINTOS, new things going on around him. Someone is always near to keep an eye out to protect him and buddies on trailer from loose dogs, ignorant people. I have to do my part as well.
Training the horse takes time and much reptition to get this part of his education down for him. I want him safe, and staying tied where I leave him is a huge part of that. Makes him fun to take places, dependable.
I would suggest you NOT use cement to anchor the Pole. Cement holds moisture against the wood, causing rot and shortening the life of the Pole. None of the Utility companies cement in their poles. Set deep, pole should stay vertical and solid.
I personally would not choose to subject my horse to extended time being tied up, but that is just my personal choice.
While I personally wouldn’t use a snubbing post, I really wouldn’t care if one was installed at my barn. It’s not like anyone is FORCING me to use it, so who cares? Live and let live! :lol:
FWIW, I prefer the blocker tie ring when teaching a horse to tie. 
Is a patience pole a parelli thing?
Does this barn then drink the koolaid of ye ole handlebar one?
I have a hitching post in the front of my barn. I never cross tie, I see more problems in the long run with that. It doesn’t teach them to be tied. Which is something all horses need to learn. So my horses learn to be tied. But I start with a bungee first, then move on when I know how the horse is.
Yes, my horses know how to tie. And, they know how to stand there for a long time. Many of my endurance horses spent MANY days tied to my trailer. Oh sure call PETA. But hey. Not everybody is rich to afford fancy corrals, LQ’s etc.
Craziest term I have ever heard, patience pole.
If you put a pole and it is a single pole, you WILL have trouble. They will go round and round, and then get too tight. I have seen horses have their noses with the rope flipped over, and the horse started to pass out due to lack of oxygen, the rope was cut. Also saw the aftermath of one who fought and fought and got it’s neck roped in, and nobody was there to save it. Best put a hitching POST and RAIL in. OR there could be trouble. Also, keep a very sharp knife on hand at all time.
I do not, and never have drank the koolaid from ye ole handlebar one. I have been offered, but never would or did.
The words “Spirit Stick” keep flashing through my mind when I read the title of this thread…
Oh Goodhors, I have SEEN well trained, perfectly trained, overly trained, very seasoned horses, etc, PULL on a moment notice. No reason. “Never” means zero chance. ha ha. There is never a chance for my hair to turn purple when I sleep at night. True, there is a zero chance of that. No probablity. To say NEVER for a well trained horse to pull back, priceless. I am sure we all have seen some bad things happen to really WELL trained horses. Or we are just lying.
Saw one very, very well seasoned horse, and it got tangled in the rope broke its front leg due to the rearing setting back, getting leg over lead rope(tied correctly at the proper length), about ripped off it knee/hoof in the process. QH, roping horse, 12 years old. And we know how long pro roping horses have learned HOW TO TIE. Some tie so well they don’t need to be tied.
Horses have impulses we can not over come on ALL occasions. Stuff happens. Even to the most WELL TRAINED horses.
And apparently Goodhors you have never fenced a property. Cement PREVENTS water from getting into the wood. Gee I have never seen a telephone pole fall down, or rot out at the bottom wink wink. Dirt has moisture. It gets into wood. It rots it, or can water log it. Ever see a horse or car or truck pull a pole out of the ground?? I have. No not one of my poles. Trust me, and also my husband on that one! We are into our concrete.
On our hitching post, we dug a BIG O hole for about 2 bags of concrete per true 6x6 post, and the cross piece my husband dove tailed it, and put 4 bolts with nuts in it. And we did allow the cement to cure properly. Ain’t no way anybody is gonna break that hitching post, GUARANTEE’d. If they do, they will be need a hole dug for them, or a chiropractor.
I have seen on the trail, same type horse get caught in a vine, rope, wire, and the horse freaks. Guess it is their flight response kicking in. And some times you just can’t stop that process no matter how much koolaid the owner or horse has drank.
My horse is 14 years old and has now twice pulled back so hard he passed out. Once as a 3 year old and once about 3 years ago when he got spooked by a loose horse. Literally, flat out on the ground with his tounge hanging out the side of his mouth. It scared the crap out of me.
He’s stood tied for hours and been fine, but I know that he can have his moments which is why I only use breakaway halters. He’s broken two in the last 3 years which is fine with me. 99% of the time he is just fine.
So those who use this method the OP described - what would you say I do. Because I know if I tied him to this “patience pole” he’d eventually get all crazy and make himself pass out… Which I feel like as a responsible horse owner I should prevent - at all costs.
We have two at our barn that one of the western trainers use. I had never paid much attention until I started venturing over to the ‘western side’ but now I realize how valuable it is. The horses stand still no matter what is going on. At shows they are taken to their stalls in between classes and the saddle is left on, cinch loosened, headstall removed and they are tied, and they stand still! Granted, ours are not left all day tied, but it is a nice relief for them in between classes to be able to go back to their stall, pee, and have a drink and nibble from their hay net, and for us not to have to worry about them damaging the show saddles.
I agree with the majority - a place to tie a horse for however long you need to is invaluable to my program.
mypaintwattie-
Pay attention to the height of the stall ties.
It’s not used to give them a break they are tied “up” to put strain on the neck muscles it’s a cheaters way to get a better headset on WP horses.
Sorry for the off subject
[QUOTE=Ltc4h;4601982]
mypaintwattie-
Pay attention to the height of the stall ties.
It’s not used to give them a break they are tied “up” to put strain on the neck muscles it’s a cheaters way to get a better headset on WP horses.
Sorry for the off subject[/QUOTE]
If I tie a horse to a rafter with a short rope, sure I might be wearing him out…
But I can tie the same horse to the same rafter with a long rope, and life is good.
Do you really think she wouldn’t have noticed the horse was literally hanging? Or by God near to it?
. training is totally relevant to the horse, there is not one method that works for all and that’s not what this thread is about.
We are not dead set on a telephone pole, we are in southern california where the weather is extremely mild in the winter (usually high sixties, low seventies and not much rain :D). The telephone pole is one thought, but we are totally open to suggestions. I have also considered a metal pole. The whole purpose, it’s a pole that the horse is tied to from up above and it’s in a designated cleared out space so it will be the safest place for the horse to be tied for those who choose to use it.
Patience poles can even be designed like this: What do you guys think of this design?
[IMG]http://i515.photobucket.com/albums/t354/china730/th_patience.jpg)
THANK YOU so much to everybody who has posted about their experiences and advice. I really appreciate it. I am trying to ascertain information about this training device and how to best construct something like this.
If we have multiple horses going in classes one right after another or we’re short on help, we often remove the bridle and tie them in a stall. Western/saddleseat/hunter/whatever.
I’m familiar with the kind of tying you’re talking about, and it doesn’t any way, shape or form resemble a horse that is simply tied in his stall. And I bet paintwattie might know the difference, too. 
I’m curious as to the purpose of the patience poll. I am not a crack horsewoman or trainer, but I put ground manners on several youngsters – lead, load, pick up their feet, etc. I never did really teach them to tie, per se. I just taught them to give to pressure.
Then I just asked them to stand still while being groomed and saddled, with the lead looped over the hitching post. Once they were cool with that, I’d tie them and leave them alone (I was just around the corner at first, in case of trouble). Then increase the time, etc etc. None has ever had a problem with tying. If something startles them, they’ll jump, of course. But once they hit the end of the rope, that’s it. One did sit back on a rope once that I can remember, but he gave it up real fast.
Am I just lucky? These were mostly horses we bred and raised ourselves, so they didn’t have any bad experiences to get over. Is the pole more for retraining or breaking bad habits? As a rule, I don’t tie my horses for hours on end. I don’t really have any need to. But if need be, I can hop off and take a pee in the bushes without one running off. In fact, they’d be more likely to follow me to see what I’m doing. :lol:
[QUOTE=PinkPonies;4601944]
So those who use this method the OP described - what would you say I do. Because I know if I tied him to this “patience pole” he’d eventually get all crazy and make himself pass out… Which I feel like as a responsible horse owner I should prevent - at all costs.[/QUOTE]
I would say not to use it DUH. I would never use a device for my horse if I thought it was going to be harmful to her, even if this advice worked wonderfully for other horses. I am confused 
, isn’t this commonsense?
The purpose of the pole is just another technique or form either to introduce a horse to standing quietly when tied or to teach a horse to stand still after they have already collected bad habits such as pawing, popping off the ground, bucking in place, etc.
I am sure there are other ways of going about this. However, I would rather my horse learn to stand quietly when tied to a “patience pole” that she cannot pull out of the ground, then tied to my horse trailer at a show.
[QUOTE=rmh_rider;4601887]
So my horses learn to be tied. But I start with a bungee first, then move on when I know how the horse is.[/QUOTE]
Could you clarify this, because tying a horse with a bungee is hella dangerous. If you want to wake up in the hospital with an imprint in your head of a bolt or snap then I’d say a bungee is your ticket to success.
All of you who say horses can’t reason have never met the horse who only escapes from his stall when no one is looking.
[QUOTE=MoonPie730;4602061]
I would rather my horse learn to stand quietly when tied to a “patience pole” that she cannot pull out of the ground[/QUOTE]
Sounds like it’s just a sturdy place to tie a horse where he can’t get into trouble. If that’s the case, why not just build yourselves a really nice hitching post? It would have more use and if you do it right, I can guarantee you no horse will ever pull it out of the ground.
chaltagor … :lol: Horses may not be if/then reasoners, but they sure as hell understand consequences.
[QUOTE=mp;4602104]
Sounds like it’s just a sturdy place to tie a horse where he can’t get into trouble. If that’s the case, why not just build yourselves a really nice hitching post? It would have more use and if you do it right, I can guarantee you no horse will ever pull it out of the ground.
chaltagor … :lol: Horses may not be if/then reasoners, but they sure as hell understand consequences.[/QUOTE]
A hitching rail definitely is a great alternative, but the tie post is just what came up and so that’s what we are looking to do for now.
Yes, I also believe bungees are dangerous! My gardener lost an eye and a lady had her horse tied to one, it broke and it hit her in the face knocking out all her teeth! yikes!
rmh, I guess what you have seen in “trained” is not the same standards of what I call “trained”. No, you can’t absolutely promise all horses trained will never do something wrong. But I work DARN HARD to have mine pretty fool proof in all situations.
Any “trained horse” who suddenly jerked back FOR NO REASON (you said), reared and tangled in his rope, is not well trained, to me. I don’t care if he jumps when tied if startled, but he BETTER be coming forward fast when he feels the rope, not laying into a backwards pull. Such an experienced horse pulling back, fighting his rope, means he has still got BIG holes in his training.
Hobble training is a big plus for teaching a horse to wait if leg gets snagged. Ours go thru hobble training. Over the many years, two have gotten tangled, stood and waited for HOURS, till we found them after work. Wounds were easy to clean up, horses were not torn to pieces fighting the problem, they just stood quiet. They healed cleanly, horses went back to work. Flight response can be modified with training on horses with good minds. Well worth the time to train for hobbles, these were not old, dead type horses or even Western bred. TB cross Sporthorses, plenty of fire. They were/are WELL TRAINED to THINK, not just run crazy if the unexpected happens.
We are quite choosy about the horses we buy, own and keep “forever”. They have passed our rigid demands for brains and trainability, are fun to get out and use. We don’t own silly, brainless using animals. Foals, very young animals can be goofy as they grow and learn. But their brains need to be screwed in well as they age, to pass the training we need put on them. We look at lots of horses, work with them, sell on those who don’t work for our wants. The standards of expectations are VERY HIGH here. Everything we own meets our expectations. They willingly go where asked, wait quietly when it is needed, because we put in the TIME needed to develop these skills in them. They are NICE TO LIVE WITH all the time, do all kinds of horse activities happily.
Set the bar high for expectations, it is possible for the horses to learn.
We will have to just disagree on how to set posts. Could be a locale difference in dirt and seasons up North and down South. We have our property totally fenced, had it done by a service. New method at the time, driven, treated posts put in with a post pounder, VERY FAST install. No cement anyplace. All of that fence is 30 yrs old, still solid, no rot in the posts. Almost no professional fence companies around here, use cement anymore for farm fence posts. Just cement for setting in the chain link metal posts.
I have read several reports in our Farm Bureau News, Grange letters, saying that time has proven the cement to shorten life of treated wooden posts, compared to treated wooden posts set in plain dirt. Cement keeps the wood wetter, longer, than plain dirt, allowing rot earlier and faster. Our driven posts are so tight nothing can pull them out, you have to cut them off if they are out of line, put in another one. The installers had to do just that in a couple places.
[QUOTE=rmh_rider;4601914]
Oh Goodhors, I have SEEN well trained, perfectly trained, overly trained, very seasoned horses, etc, PULL on a moment notice. No reason. “Never” means zero chance. ha ha. There is never a chance for my hair to turn purple when I sleep at night. True, there is a zero chance of that. No probablity. To say NEVER for a well trained horse to pull back, priceless. I am sure we all have seen some bad things happen to really WELL trained horses. Or we are just lying.
Saw one very, very well seasoned horse, and it got tangled in the rope broke its front leg due to the rearing setting back, getting leg over lead rope(tied correctly at the proper length), about ripped off it knee/hoof in the process. QH, roping horse, 12 years old. And we know how long pro roping horses have learned HOW TO TIE. Some tie so well they don’t need to be tied.
Horses have impulses we can not over come on ALL occasions. Stuff happens. Even to the most WELL TRAINED horses.
And apparently Goodhors you have never fenced a property. Cement PREVENTS water from getting into the wood. Gee I have never seen a telephone pole fall down, or rot out at the bottom wink wink. Dirt has moisture. It gets into wood. It rots it, or can water log it. Ever see a horse or car or truck pull a pole out of the ground?? I have. No not one of my poles. Trust me, and also my husband on that one! We are into our concrete.
On our hitching post, we dug a BIG O hole for about 2 bags of concrete per true 6x6 post, and the cross piece my husband dove tailed it, and put 4 bolts with nuts in it. And we did allow the cement to cure properly. Ain’t no way anybody is gonna break that hitching post, GUARANTEE’d. If they do, they will be need a hole dug for them, or a chiropractor.
I have seen on the trail, same type horse get caught in a vine, rope, wire, and the horse freaks. Guess it is their flight response kicking in. And some times you just can’t stop that process no matter how much koolaid the owner or horse has drank.[/QUOTE]
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