please.explain this to me

[QUOTE=Pennywell Bay;7267853]
I’m sorry you feel this way. You got some good information regarding why it isn’t an “open” sporthorse registry/assessment.

“And why if the sport is recognized within their breed are there no breed specific classes offered to help grow the sport within that breed.”

I think this is a question better directed at the AQHA or breed shows. Maybe I am reading it incorrectly.

Bashing other breeds is not professional, directed at everyone. Threads like this will pop up when a farm name or horse is associated with it courtesy of Google. Not the persona I would want to present as a professional breeder, or human being- but that’s beside the point. I don’t see as anyone was QH bashing. My friend has a lovely QH, she shows hunter. Idle chit chat ring side, someone usually asks his breeding/what he is. We laugh, he’s a QH who does pretty well in the hunters. No offense meant/none taken.

The last paragraph is just inaccurate, to me. I know plenty of Hanovarians and the type (WB in general?) who compete into their 20s. People can come out of the woodwork listing their old schoolmasters who are competing.

The questions were genuine, and I believe you received some genuine feedback, meant to be helpful. If you put your hackles up and begin bashing other breeders/breeds, people are going to be defensive.[/QUOTE]

I appreciate the polite feedback. I did come to simply ask questions and understand why it isn’t more open. I do feel a frustration that sport horse simply leans towards warmbloods. I didn’t come to piss people off I came to.express a frustration as the title says please explain this to me. I left it alone before people simply came to pick and yes at that point I became frustrated. And defensive. Who wouldn’t ?

I have spoken with AQHA regarding but the issue with that is to truly get a versatile horse for other disciplines you can maintain a similar frame and ride fairly similar. With a dressage horse you are asking for roundness and contact something that you don’t see within traditional AQHA shows. I would love to see more opportunity for them to be recognized within AQHA.

You are right when you look at that line you wouldn’t expect jumping or dressage success. Why I bred to the unbridled line tb wise to infuse more of that in there. However I was not well versed in the kitaman line and was told that he produced some nice equitation horses. Not bad.

I have primarily marketed to the quarter horse and tb market. I don’t care to cross to warmbloods. I would prefer to show what my guy and offspring can do. I have done a few stallion shows/exhibitions, and working on redeveloping my website. I do have a job and real life and as a result of that some things were put on the back burner. Plus from being ill, I wasn’t in a position to breed so I didn’t actively market him. That was my decision.

I appreciate the kind advice (and the kitaman line info) from those considerate enough to give it. Have a good day.

[QUOTE=fire_911medic;7267357]
Wouldn’t breed to your mares if you paid me. I look for people wo value their babies for more than a dollar sign.[/QUOTE]

Oh, wow…NOW I’m really depressed (NOT!)

First of all, why in heaven’s name would you breed to MY mares? I don’t breed them to QH’s. And I guess you “value” your stud so much he stands for a big, fat $500. That’s low even for a QH (and I live in the heart of QH country and actually read “Western Horseman” so I probably know more about QHs than you do).

You know, you came barreling into COTH with both guns blazing, showing yourself to be both rude AND uninformed, trashing WBs and basically making yourself rather unappealing.

Not a great way to start out, you know.

THEN came all the BS you were slinging. Now you are ticked because you’ve been found out. Seriously?

While COTH might tolerate Rude or even Uninformed, it truly does NOT tolerate both in the same person very well. And it tolerates lying even less.

If your stallion is all you say he is, there is a record. If he has done a I-1 dressage test there is a record. Are you STILL not getting this?

If he’s what you say he is…show us the actual recorded PROOF…otherwise just go home and try this nonsense on a dumber group…

[QUOTE=fire_911medic;7267443]
I think bullies have met their match. I don’t back down just because you think you are soooo much better. Like I said, see you in the ring. It settles all. Ultimately it is performance not bloodline that validates a horse. That settles it.[/QUOTE]

And how will we recognize you or your mighty stallion"in the ring"? I mean, we don’t know his name now, do we?

OP, you’ve obviously either been completely scorned by some seriously snotty WB breeders, or you came in expecting to be. Your guns were (are) loaded and you really didn’t start on a good leg with your post. I’ve been the one trashed on by QH people when I would school my Anglo mare and large pony in their realm. Much like Stoicfish, I got comments about my saddle (can’t rope or work off a postage stamp), comments about my horses (little spook on Anglo made her worthless. A real kid rides a big horse, not a useless 14hh half FQH pony), how “Engrish” riders really don’t know how to ride, two hands are always unnecessary, etc. Does it hurt? Of course! But the course you take is to show them up. Retaliation with words only makes things worse.

That said, I may not always look at a stallion with a performance record. I do, however, NEED to see conformation pictures (unobscured feet and legs included), some video at liberty and at work, and his get MUST have a record. Preferably, I would also like to see him in person. If a SO doesn’t want someone visiting their farm to see the horse they’re marketing, I get suspicious of what they’re hiding. If he’s a new stallion without get yet, I wait. If his get are mediocre or don’t impress me for what I want in my foals? I walk. Simple as that.

Granted, my days of breeding and/or working for a breeder are a few years past due both to the breeder retiring and my moving to a new area (would really like another opportunity to continue. It was a heartbreaking, yet rewarding “career!”), but the lessons and eye for nice horseflesh remains.

Relax! If your boy is as nice as you say, then share him! Let the world see him! At the very least, put a GOOD picture or two on his ad! Give him a fighting chance. And give other breeders, mare owners a fighting chance.

Best of luck!

[QUOTE=bornfreenowexpensive;7267836]
Wow…really. How do you even know this stallion is inferior? Inferior to what? That is a really snide comment that would piss me off…

Honestly this board DOES slant to one very small market here in the US. There is a MUCH bigger world with the AQHA. MUCH. So what if they are not Olympic levels (who really likes dealing with the FEI anyway…I sure as hell don’t)…have you looked at the stud fees they can charge in that world. Is more like the racing world…and WB stud fees are CHEAP.

They go to competitions and win TRUCKS and money…not just ribbons. From a pure business perspective…that is a FAR better market to be in.[/QUOTE]

You know I don’t find this to be true at all about COTH. It can be a rough place for sure, but my second “breed of choice” is an Akhal Teke and I’ve never gotten any crap about that. DayDreamBeliever bred Nooka mustangs and SHE was well-respected.

So I don’t think it’s about your breed, but your attitude and knowledge base.

As for the OP…I have alot of sympathy for “the underdog” because I consider myself one, compared to some of the people (breeders) on this board; people who have FAR more resources than I have had to produce top horses.

Hell, I started my program less than 15 yrs ago w/ONE WB mare I bought for $2500 because no one else wanted her. But between learning what I can on COTH and other WB sites, doing a heck of alot of work, and a tiny bit of luck (and anyone who knows me, knows I’ve had my share of breeding disasters) I’ve managed to produce some top foals who actually DO outscore the get from some fancy imported mares.

It’s slow going, with only 1 or 2 foals per year, but it can be done.

Granted, none have proven themselves as mature performers yet, because it’s tough to get them in the right hands to “go one”, but I do my best to place them in those homes.

The difference is that, there is actual written proof of those achievements and I can back up my claims w/pics & registry/show records.

So, while I realize fully I am not the most beloved poster on COTH (probably because I tend to call a spade a spade and not a frigging shovel), I don’t get alot of disdain thrown my way.

When you (the OP) can do the same, you will find that COTH will be a kinder/gentler place.

Anyway…I’m going back to the Eventing Board where wine is free-choice and panty wadding close to non-existent ( btw, I believe Eventers have discovered a direct correlation between reduced panty-wadding and increased alcohol consumption…)

Good luck w/ your stallion…I’m sure I’ll be watching him in the Olympics any day now…:rolleyes:

Not all of COTH…but I’ve seen a bit more narrowmindness here in the breeding forum and sometimes in others. Of course there are always the odd train wreck everywhere.

I just get tired of some of the snide and catty remarks. And yes…sometimes the tone of posts can get lost…I prefer to give more people the benefit of the doubt and do understand that we all can have moments of frustration.

FWIW…I know very little about Akal Teke other then seen some really cool looking ones… and LOVE that stallion JER posted about (Super Star).

why don’t you admit you misread the post you were upset about?

The Op came here making unsupportable claims (where are the show records? ) that her stallion was superior to warmblood stallions- She has not documented her claims about her stallion’s superiority.

You don’t see the other breeders come on here and make such claims.

I’m wondering if this a troll because the whole thing is rather silly.

[QUOTE=bornfreenowexpensive;7268249]

FWIW…I know very little about Akal Teke other then seen some really cool looking ones… and LOVE that stallion JER posted about (Super Star).[/QUOTE]

Not to de-rail, but SuperStar is not a PB Teke (nor was Kinor) and really doesn’t look like a Teke should…his “type” is simply not there. NOT saying he isn’t a good horse (I think he showed in Germany up to PSG), but he just doesn’t look like the breed standard.

[QUOTE=Crockpot;7268272]
why don’t you admit you misread the post you were upset about?

The Op came here making unsupportable claims (where are the show records? ) that her stallion was superior to warmblood stallions- She has not documented her claims about her stallion’s superiority.

You don’t see the other breeders come on here and make such claims.

I’m wondering if this a troll because the whole thing is rather silly.[/QUOTE]

Exactly! The people who are questioning the OP are not questioning her at all because she has a QH. It has nothing to do with that. It has to do with her absurd claims (not just on this board but others) that her horse is so much better than warmbloods. Then she goes on and gives reasons why this is so, yet has produced no proof to support her claims.

As someone who has been in the QH breeding world, I’m not sure what category the OPs stallion would fit into.

He is speed horse bred, but not fast a runner - so there goes that market.

While he is an appendix, he doesn’t have the lines that most hunters would go after. Did I miss if he has been campaigned as a hunter?

He is a dressage horse - I don’t know of many QH stallions that are being marketed towards the dressage or western dressage world specifically. QH dressage and western dressage horses do tend to be “cast-offs” from other lines. NOTE - I am not saying that they aren’t good horses, just saying that a vast majority of QH dressage horses are not bred to be dressage horses.

He is an appendix, so that rules out him being able to be crossed on TB or appendix mares if the owners are wanted AQHA registration papers. Unless the OP gets him his ROM in Open AQHA competition.

This hostility coming from the OP certainly isn’t helping with the promotion of QHs. JMHO…

I’m not upset…I did note I misread one comment later and commented that I still thought it was a slap though.

Boy I am done here.

In my experiences as scribing for judges I have never gotten the impression from any of them that they care a whole lot about breeds > they judge the horse in front of them on the performance of that day. One good example of that was when I was scribing for an Olympic level judge about 10 years ago and we had some time to chat during a break. She asked me if I could have any horse at the show that day which one I would choose. I picked a morgan gelding who was showing in dressage for his first time that day in the training level classes. She approved of my selection and then proceeded to tell me that she would take the Draft cross gelding the 1st level classes. This was a show of predominately warmblood horses, so clearly she was not choosy about breed … and she knew her stuff because 5 years later the morgan gelding was competiting at Intermediare and the Draft cross in Grand Prix. If you have a truly nice non-warmblood horse it may actually work to your favour with some judges because it is human nature to root for the underdog. :wink:

On the other hand I do feel their is a prejudice for non-warmblood breeds in general in all of the sport horse disciplines. Not necessarily from professionals … but from amateur riders which make up the a huge part of the dressage demographic… they almost all want the warmblood. :slight_smile:

I think the reason the American Quarter Horse gets the most flack of the non-warmblood breeds is 99% of their own doing. I grew up riding QHs – many of whom where very athletic, smart, and beautiful horses with great gaits – but many (many) Quarter Horses are not. I have two in my barn right now who are great examples of what many of the modern Q.H.s have turned into – straight hips, super upright shoulders and pasterns, low set necks, downhill, tiny hooves, etc. And LAZY! So painfully lazy! And lame. :frowning:

On the other hand I have a Quarter Horse mare that gets drooled over where ever we go – but always with the reply “I can’t believe she is a Quarter Horse!” > I want to scream “She is what a QH is suppose to look like!”, but I just smile and nod and take the compliment. The QH gelding I had before her was even nicer, he screamed dressage horse (he looked like an Andalusian/QH cross). I also had another QH gelding that could jump the moon and do upper level dressage, and could not be beat in our “races” with other horses at the barn – he could run so fast that tears would stream down your face from wind. :slight_smile: These athletic types of QHs used to be common, and can still be found, but unfortunately they have now become the exception. Dressage people watch western pleasure classes online and are horrified by what they see, can you blame them for thinking that a QH would be an odd choice for a Sport Horse?

If you can get a QH with conformation, gaits and athleticism comparable to a warmblood and still have the work ethic and smarts of the traditional (cow horse, ranch horse) QHs then they are worth their weight in gold (IMHO). Or you could just go a simpler route and find all that in a nice Morgan. :wink: :stuck_out_tongue:

[QUOTE=Ysabel;7272110]

If you can get a QH with conformation, gaits and athleticism comparable to a warmblood and still have the work ethic and smarts of the traditional (cow horse, ranch horse) QHs then they are worth their weight in gold (IMHO). Or you could just go a simpler route and find all that in a nice Morgan. :wink: :-P[/QUOTE]

^ Very well said, but we are not sure if the OP has this type of horse.

hey, on that note - I saw a 16HH morgan at a CNYDCTA show a few months ago… One of the NICEST horses (type and movementwise) at a show that had many nicely bred WBs, when I asked the woman of his breeding I was floored – but you’re right, that’s what a good horse SHOULD look like.

I apologize for the snark but I really feel like post #36 needed to be a part of this thread. http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?420848-IF-you-had-to-sell-your-horse-tomorrow-do-you-think/page2

[QUOTE=Laurierace;7275361]
I apologize for the snark but I really feel like post #36 needed to be a part of this thread. http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/showthread.php?420848-IF-you-had-to-sell-your-horse-tomorrow-do-you-think/page2[/QUOTE]

I assume you mean this part fire-medic posted:

My stallion ? Not so much. He is like his mother. Very picky and testy with people. He definitely has his favorites. And if you aren’t on that list, he can be a complete a$$.

Well, yet another reason for all of us to line up to breed our mares to him…this gal (or guy) is a real piece of work…

Yep, that is the one. Almost like a high powered ad agency is writing her copy for her. Not.

[QUOTE=Laurierace;7275713]
Yep, that is the one. Almost like a high powered ad agency is writing her copy for her. Not.[/QUOTE]

:lol: Honestly! Even if her stallion was the best thing since Donnerhall, she sure isn’t doing it any favors in the promotion dept…

http://www.chronofhorse.com/article/been-ripped-making-his-mark

This pair is doing well and I bet most people get a warm fuzzy reading this story. I certainly am hoping they reach their goal of GP.
I bet this lady didn’t spent time worrying about breed prejudice with her QH/Arab cross because she was too busy winning.