Profitability of Training/Sales in Dressage

[MapleBreeze]

You will have to deal with really crazy people in the name of money to make ends meet.
and I think you will have to have a hard look at what value range you offer services at to make ends meet. For example I really lose money on stall board but I am okay with pasture board.
What are you going to do for labor to cut costs? Are you going to do everything or are you going to hire someone?

Are you going to be strictly doing dressage training and instruction? You will probably have to do up down lessons and more generic riding to make ends meet.

Can you teach jumping? You might need a little of that to help ends meet too.

I think like in Eliza’s post it’s very difficult financially to be a specific dressage boarding and training barn.
I think if you are generic English it might help.

[clanter]

@MapleBreeze

You will have to deal with really crazy people in the name of money to make ends meet.

just need to review any of the threads regarding Michael Barisone/ Lauren Kanarek as to how things can go wrong

[Scribbler]

@MapleBreeze

You will have to deal with really crazy people in the name of money to make ends meet.
and I think you will have to have a hard look at what value range you offer services at to make ends meet. For example I really lose money on stall board but I am okay with pasture board.
What are you going to do for labor to cut costs? Are you going to do everything or are you going to hire someone?

Are you going to be strictly doing dressage training and instruction? You will probably have to do up down lessons and more generic riding to make ends meet.

Can you teach jumping? You might need a little of that to help ends meet too.

I think like in Eliza’s post it’s very difficult financially to be a specific dressage boarding and training barn.
I think if you are generic English it might help.

I’d also add that if you want to advertise as a trainer in a discipline you will generally benefit from having a solid show record in that discipline. Usually at a higher level than your target clientele. But once you start running a barn your own development goes on hold because you need to focus on your clients’ success over yours.

[cardinale]

Another possible route would be to go into another profession, use it to develop your training and competition skills including getting the best available instruction, and if you end up being highly successful with horses, transition later into being a clinician/high end coach. Seems to me that some of the most financially secure and satisfied dressage pros are those who have had enough success in competition that they can pick and choose how they spend their time–training talented horses, giving clinics, etc. Not just the daily grind of lessons and green horses. Of course, you have to get the cred and have enough talent as an instructor and communicator that there will be a clientele willing to spend the $$$. Just a thought.

[sami-joe]

One of the smartest people I know is a vet who had the same experience. She realized that an equine vet vocation would wreck her appreciation for her own riding scene. I remember her saying something like, she worried that the human interactions of boarding her horse would have likely become super awkward.

She became a wildlife veterinarian. She figured she’d always have a rural location and probably never be bought out by a giant corporation or private equity. Though she had to do per diem work for years to pay off her loans, she really made a name for herself locally. At the moment, she’s teaching wildlife vet courses at a big university, boarding her horse at a barn she likes, and, last I knew, loving life.

So, though she’s not making a living with horses, she, like you, continues her horse cult membership on her own terms.

[cardinale]

@sami-joe

One of the smartest people I know is a vet who had the same experience. She realized that an equine vet vocation would wreck her appreciation for her own riding scene. I remember her saying something like, she worried that the human interactions of boarding her horse would have likely become super awkward.

She became a wildlife veterinarian.

Yes, there are other paths to take with a DVM. If I were doing it all over again, I might have continued on but gone to work for USDA or used the degree in some manner other than “equine private practice.” I just wasn’t sufficiently aware at the time of all the other ways you could go.

Your wildlife vet acquaintance had the right idea.

[sami-joe]

@cardinale

I just wasn’t sufficiently aware at the time of all the other ways you could go.

Your wildlife vet acquaintance had the right idea.

She is a rare bird. Few of us have that awareness, persistence, and flexibility.
That said, she would own that she had some wicked good luck, too.

[strangewings]

I am another person who wanted to do equine dvm work, but was expecting to aim for academia/specialized research. I went a completely different direction in college (still aimed for academia) in order to keep horses as a passion.

However, i took a few ag/animal science classes before switching disciplines and I think you have to have a constitution for viewing animals as a product for a lot of USDA work. This isn’t a bad thing, I just personally still think about ethical questions surrounding animal care in large farming systems 20 years later, and though I still have an itch for learning more about that field and work, I think it is also possible that if that had been my veterinary path, I could have ended up feeling too conflicted and trapped by the system at some point. So as with anything, know thyself.

I think vet practice of any kind, private or otherwise, was always off the table due to social anxiety!

[Amberley]

Plenty of people make money in the horse business. If you want to make money in dressage you need to become a competent GP rider, so go to Europe before or after college and work for 10 years, learn how to ride GP and how to be a professional and how to make money in horses. Decide later if you want to come back to the US.

[atlatl]

@Amberley

Plenty of people make money in the horse business. If you want to make money in dressage you need to become a competent GP rider, so go to Europe before or after college and work for 10 years, learn how to ride GP and how to be a professional and how to make money in horses. Decide later if you want to come back to the US.

That’s all?

[AnastasiaBeaverhousen]

What, like it’s hard?

[Bogey2]

Right?

[Scribbler]

I think that’s good advice as far as how to position yourself at the top of the dressage community where money will be better. You can’t run a high end program for rich ammies who want to show PSG if your experience tops out at second level local shows. Like anything you need to commit to the further education to get good in a field, this is equivalent to grad school for future dressage trainers.

Also European contacts will allow you to participate in the lucrative WB import business.

The entry level bar to boarding horses and lessons is very low, just enough saved up to lease a barn somewhere, but that end of the business is tough and can be hand to mouth. The more real credentials you have the better you can position yourself.

[atlatl]

@Scribbler

I think that’s good advice as far as how to position yourself at the top of the dressage community where money will be better. You can’t run a high end program for rich ammies who want to show PSG if your experience tops out at second level local shows. Like anything you need to commit to the further education to get good in a field, this is equivalent to grad school for future dressage trainers.

Also European contacts will allow you to participate in the lucrative WB import business.

The entry level bar to boarding horses and lessons is very low, just enough saved up to lease a barn somewhere, but that end of the business is tough and can be hand to mouth. The more real credentials you have the better you can position yourself.

I don’t disagree, however, that’s not quite what the OP asked to my understanding.

Also, in order to execute the suggested plan one needs to be able to a) get to Europe and b) get hired by a GP trainer. I’m reminded of a comparison someone made of the numbers of kids playing high school sports and the number of spots available in the professional sports leagues. The odds are not great.

From
https://marketscale.com/industries/sports-and-entertainment/from-the-high-school-field-to-an-nfl-success/#:~:text=But%20out%20of%20over%20one,a%20slot%20in%20the%20NFL.

But out of over one million high school football players, just 2.6 percent are eligible to play for NCAA Division I teams, 22 percent are Draft Eligible, and only 1.5 percent of Draft Eligible players actually get a slot in the NFL. So, in the end, how many high school athletes really get a shot at being NFL players? A fraction of a percent—in fact, just .023 percent.

That said, I think the entire equine industry is really tough and frankly the odds for financial success are extremely limited (of course that depends on one’s definition of financial success) which is why I think having a marketable skills set is important.

[Scribbler]

I agree the odds are not great. But if you want to be at the top of a field you have to make the effort. Sports and arts are both fields with huge amounts of recreational amateurs doing things for fun and a very small percentage making a living from it. Neither sports nor arts can be your fallback career life you get bored with a regular profession. At least in horses there’s a need for boarding barns at every level, but you may not make much money after expenses.

[ahdressage]

I don’t think it’s possible to be profitable without a sponsor or other financial support, like a spouse.
The cost of health care, insurance, and the upkeep of your own horse(s) - especially vet bills - would consume any profit you might make.
And then there’s the drama.

Not that it can’t be done. But it’s a really tough road.

[Dressurfrau]

Very, very well said. I’ve seen so many professional begin to resent horses when business doesn’t go well.

It’s a TOUGH job. Getting reliable barn help is just the start - even for more “famous” riders. Insurance is very high and the reason many pros either quit or don’t carry it.

I hate to come off negative but it was very wise of the OP to ask these questions and mull it over. It’s not a business where you’ll get rich or even make a decent living.

[Calhoun]

I didn’t read every reply, apologies if this has been mentioned. Go get your college degree and keep riding, preferably with a professional. When have enough experience, try applying to instructor/barn manager/coach at colleges that offer equestrian programs. You’ll get health insurance, 401K, and a dependable salary.

[oldernewbie]

I’m acquainted with 2 professionals who ran good businesses but have quit the business in the last 2 years. One has been a trainer for breed shows since he was in high school. Very good horseman. He has also been very wise in how he handled his money. Also had some lucky breaks re: jobs and inheritance and had a partner with a steady job. I think he finally got burnt out and some physical problems cropped up so he retired. So he did make a decent living as a trainer BUT he bought his farm 20 years ago when things were much cheaper and he worked his rear off for many years. I don’t blame him for getting out while the gettin’ was good.

The second person has a regular professional job but also owned/managed a very good boarding facility. She ran a tight ship and had a great operation. But, burnout reared its ugly head and she’s getting out of the business too. Also some lucky breaks there with family support/investment.

Almost all the other capable professionals I know either have a primary job or a spouse with a stable, good job. Or they do the lessons/clinic/travel thing and don’t have a facility.

It’s a tough business. We’re all lucky that people find some way to give it a go.

[AllTheCarrots]

If you were my college student, I would encourage you to keep open as many doors as possible. Keep riding, because it feeds your soul. But also keep studying, so that you have a marketable degree on which to fall back.

Have you declared a major? Talk with your advisor or the career development office and ask about how graduates use their degree, other than the obvious paths. If you’re a bio or chem major, ask about graduates who have gone to work for Purina. If you’re an English major, ask about graduates who work in marketing – someone has to develop and nurture Dover’s customer base, or promote WEC/KY3DE/whatever. If you’re in some flavor of business, be the person who advises the horse professionals that they’re running out of money. (I kid. Sort of.) Find internships at the businesses that interest you. Ask to shadow for a week over spring break. Use your school’s alumni network to conduct informational interviews via Zoom – 99.9% of professionals would be flattered by a well-written request for 15 minutes of their time to talk about what they do and how they got there.

If you’re still trying to figure out what you want to study, ask yourself similar questions. Do you like analyzing stats? Persuading people? Lab work? Reading dusty tomes? Find the interest, and the job path will follow. It may not be straightforward, but it will likely give you a steady paycheck, vacation time, sick leave, and the ability to make space in your life for other needs/wants as they arise.