Repeat Colic Episodes

[Roadmix3]

His manure continues to be like formed diarrhea, in small quantities, since he got back from OSU. It’s not water but it’s not really what I would consider cow patty either. He’s had everything in between during this whole experience. There for awhile when he was doing great/better he had amazing manure output. Now we are back to not so good.

Started probiotics and hoping results show sooner than expected. They gave me a tube of some sedative gel, I’d have to look at it to get the name, but they want me to give that over Banamine for pain and colic signs. It goes under the tongue and acts in 20 minutes…… I guess it’s pretty dangerous for humans if on the skin or if you get some of it in your mouth so I was instructed to be careful giving it if I need to. I’d rather use Banamine.

[findthedistance]

@starsandsun

I wouldn’t hesitate to push harder and get her thoughts on why she doesn’t want to start treatment now. Sometimes the use of steroids gets things on a healing path which then means you can’t really explore any other clues for diagnosis, but that’s no reason for you not to get your horse relief - I have found that sometimes in vet hospitals their long-term research goals get in the way of immediate support for my horse.

Salmonella is in the differential, so it seems pretty reasonable to not want to suppress his immune system with steroids until that is ruled out. (I would agree with you if infection wasn’t still in the differential – when all diagnoses are going to lead to steroids, the specific diagnosis isn’t a hill worth dying on.)

OP, jingling for faster-than-expected lab turnaround times and a clear course of action!

[starsandsun]

Any updates? Hope he is quieter and happier.

[Roadmix3]

I had our local vet out to do the repeat blood work that OSU wanted done Monday, to make sure things haven’t gotten worse with him. I’m happy to say all of his numbers have stabilized and are in the normal range. Whew! I’m thrilled about that.

He’s eating and comfortable, no colic episodes as of yet, although I still check on him frequently out of concern. He also has perked back up, he no longer stands around sleeping with drooped eyes and a low energy attitude. He’s got life back in those eyes. My local vet also decided to do a Succeed fecal blood test. To detect blood in his manure. Unfortunately that came back positive. But he wants to start him on Sucralfate which I think is good idea

[starsandsun]

My recommendation is to get the suspension for Sucralfate - from Wedgewood and I’m sure your vet knows them or someone else.

When are biopsies back?

[cnd8]

@Roadmix3

I’d rather use Banamine.

If it is anything hindgut related, NSAIDs such as Banamine will aggravate it worse.

[Roadmix3]

He gave me a bottle of tablets that are to be dissolved in warm water, given by syringe, which sounds messy. 11 tablets, 3 times a day. Does that sound about right? He said can cause constipation…… I sure hope not.

Biopsy results back Wednesday or Thursday.

Good to know on banamine. Scratch that idea.

[cnd8]

I’ve never exprienced sucralfate administered like that. I’ve always seen tablets fed in a small amount of grain. (That’s not to say that isn’t a viable option. I just always get tablets)

[starsandsun]

My challenge was always that they don’t dissolve and adhere/mix in anything. Some horses will eat them with a handful of grain which might be easier if yours will do it. Old school was to give on an empty stomach and wait an hour before letting them have hay/grain. My internist says 10 minutes is good, so I do that.

I agree on the banamine as maybe not great for hind gut. I used it when I had nothing else and my horse was in internal agony (throwing himself into trees and the fence line).

[starsandsun]

Also it doesn’t taste bad or hurt if it gets in your eyes (ask me how I know - HAHA!).

[Roadmix3]

Well, it is a mess. I grind up the 11 pills and then put them in some warm water. Stir it all up. But yes, it doesn’t dissolve at all. Well, maybe some, but not the majority of it. I end up filling the syringe with the mixture and then putting it in the side of his mouth and far back as I safely can. Some does get spat out (on my coat mostly) and then some makes it down.

My concern is aspiration while I am administering meds. Is this a thing? It’s a decent sized syringe and water isn’t paste like wormer or anything. Should I be concerned about aspiration?

[starsandsun]

I’ve been doing this for a long time and haven’t any risk of aspiration so I think you’re ok.

Thoughts/suggestions:

use way less water
mix with a little applesauce first/instead
mix with oil if he gets that (I feed the Plat Perf oil for omega 3s)
will he eat it powdered on a handful of grain?

Oh … mix in the syringe itself. Put a splash of water in first, hold your finger on the end so it doesn’t drain out, then add the powder. Add more water/applesauce/oil and shake and just squirt in. It’s never going to mix well.

[TWH_Girl]

Uckele’s Equisweet liquid flavor may help the meds be more palatable. You could try in the syringe or see if he’ll eat the pills crushed and mixed in with the flavoring. Sucralfate is a hard med to swallow- I take it and it starts dissolving and gets stuck in your throat if you don’t drink enough.

[MorganMaresVT]

On syringing in meds…just treated a mare for anaplasmosis, which was 25 minocycline pills 2x/day for 8 days. She wasn’t eating much of anything when she felt so bad and had a high fever at first, so dropping the pills in her feed pan didn’t work. If you have an old coffee grinder, that might help you powder the pills more quickly and evenly. I agree with applesauce as a mixer if your syringe is large enough. I added a small splash of water because the applesauce on its own was a little too thick on its own to shake up with the powder. My mixology got better as the days went on

Mare was a saint about syringing but by the last day of administration, we were both DONE with the process.

Hope things continue going in the right direction for you!

[Cassi1125]

Have they checked your horse’s liver enzymes? Just thinking his various ailments might be impacting his liver.

[Roadmix3]

Update:

The old man has been on the stomach coating meds for 2 weeks now, and I hate to say it, but he has not had a colic episode going on three weeks this coming Wednesday. However, this afternoon I got home from work and he wasn’t outside. He has free choice access to his stall and run in area. I quickly parked my car and went to the barn, to find him laying down in his stall. Not flat out, but just laying with his head up. He popped up when he saw me and acted “fine”. After saying hello, he went back outside and starting munching on some hay. I’m not quite sure what to make of that. He’s not normally in his stall laying down, however he didn’t act painful either. I guess I will keep a close eye on him.

We are to continue the stomach coating meds, holding off on steroids for now. His vet here at home feels like the steroids may make his suspected hind gut ulcerations worse. He said if he does poorly going forward we can try them as a last ditch effort. He also had a talk with me about trying him off hay completely for awhile and moving to an increased complete feed and soaked, pelleted hay. OSU biopsies were “inconclusive” meaning, they didn’t find anything worth noting and couldn’t rule in or out IBD or Lymphoma of the GI tract.

His attitude, and energy has been night and day difference compared to almost three weeks ago. His appetite is good too. He looks to be gaining some weight back as well. I am hopeful we are on the right track with him, and I wanted to thank everyone for all their suggestions, it helps even, to know I’m not the only horse owner to deal with these frustrating symptoms.

[starsandsun]

So glad to hear he is improving. May I ask if you got the histology reports and can share?

[Roadmix3]

If you mean results from the biopsies, they came back (two whole weeks later!) as inconclusive. They didn’t see any cancer cells in the samples they took, but they said since they sample such a small area of a horse’s digestive tract (piece from large and small intestine) they can’t really completely rule that out. Neither can they rule out Irritable Bowl Disease/colitis since there’s not really a “marker” for that. They did see some “inflammatory” cells in the sample from his colon. All infectious possibilities came back negative. Salmonella also negative. In one way it’s nice to rule out some issues, in another, it’s completely frustrating and expensive to just find out your horse is suffering from what was originally thought to be the issue.

[starsandsun]

So they did find eosinophils in the colon?

The reason I ask is that no vets at the hospital ever commented on the fact that they were present; we persisted for another 6 months or so with frequent, painful, horrible colics because it wasn’t addressed or treated.

ETA: We had a re-check today after 21 days on antibiotics for a nasty bacteria in my horse’s stomach that likely caused the inflammation in small intestine and colon … and resulted in eosinophils. So I asked my vet, who is pretty much a vanguard in this area. Her thought is if the horse is showing symptoms AND has eosinophils in a tissue sample, that is IBD/colitis and should be treated as such.

Granted, she is ahead of the curve on approaching colic, stomach/gut health so takes a more assertive approach. But, she is the one who has healed my horse after a year of terrible pain and suffering.

(re-check showed all areas of inflammation in small intestine and colon have resolved, stomach looks gorgeous with no ulceration or irritation present)

[cnd8]

@Roadmix3

He also had a talk with me about trying him off hay completely for awhile and moving to an increased complete feed and soaked, pelleted hay

If he’s anything like what I experienced with my horse, this treatment method fixed my horse and gave him his life back! I put it off for so long just due to management restrictions at the place I boarded at the time, but once I removed all the hay, my horse blossomed–feeling good for the first time probably.